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One thing that's not mentioned in this article (and it's too soon to access the original manuscript) is if they control for how markets change their products in

by agurk 6y ago

One thing that's not mentioned in this article (and it's too soon to access the original manuscript) is if they control for how markets change their products in response to the sugar tax. I've noticed after the UK brought in the sugar tax the formulations for a lot of drinks changed to have a lower sugar content with sweetness boosted with artificial sweeteners. This allows them to avoid the sugar tax as they are now lower sugar. I realised this as occasionally when I was in England I'd enjoy something like an Irn-Bru (orange Scottish soda made from girders), but a few years ago I noticed it now tasted horrible to me as I really can't stand artificial sweeteners. Coca-cola seems to be a notable exception that didn't change their formula. Denmark also has a sugar tax (higher than the UK's) but the market kept the existing products and just charged more for them. An interesting example is the original formula Ribena (blackcurrant cordial) is made in England and freely available in Denmark, but the new formulation (less sugar, more sweeteners, less fruit juice, more thickeners) is the only one available in the UK. It'd be interesting to see if there was an effect from sweet drinks now being a different thing in the UK and if that's a positive outcome from the legislation. I certainly avoid most soft drinks now when in the UK.

vidarh 6y ago
> Coca-cola seems to be a notable exception that didn't change their formula. Coca Cola is an interesting one in that the Coca Cola Zero Sugar introduction seemed to have been mostly about introducing a replacement for Coke Zero that had labeling making it easier to confuse with regular Coke, with the design dominated by the "regular" red and just some black added (in Europe; in some other markets the design is more distinct from regular Coke) > blackcurrant cordial Interestingly, blackcurrant is almost exclusively a European thing (99%+ of production).
- user5994461 6y ago
  >>> Interestingly, blackcurrant is almost exclusively a European thing (99%+ of production). It's a UK thing as far as I am aware. Never seen it in any quantity outside of the UK.
  - agurk 6y ago
    It's definitely common in Denmark. France has crème de cassis[0] and produces 16 million litres annually of the stuff. In Germany and Eastern Europe I've seen it commonly sold as fruit juice and I've certainly drank a lot of (Schwarze) Johannisbeereschorle - blackcurrent juice mixed with sparkling water - in Munich. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cr%C3%A8me_de_cassis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cr%C3%A8me_de_cassis
    - user5994461 6y ago
      I am French so there you go ^^ Creme de cassis is a strong liquor. It's quite expensive due to being alcohol (alcohol taxes and regulations) and generally being a luxury mixer at that. It's never drinked alone. It is not drinkable, it's very strong and it has a thick consistency akin to a smoothie. (You could try a sip but you're definitely not going to down a glass of that). Main use is a mixer for cocktails. The most common is "kir". Put a bit of creme de cassis at the bottom of the glass and fill the rest with a white wine. The fancy version is the "kir royale", using champagne in place of white wine.
  - vidarh 6y ago
    It's more common in the UK than elsewhere, but I grew up with blackcurrant as one of the most common types of squash/cordial in Norway as well, with a wide range of brands - to extent that blackcurrant is the expected taste of red squash if nothing else is specified. I know it is also widespread in Denmark as well. It may well be uncommon in parts of Europe too, but not to the extent of particularly the US where most states banned it for nearly a century because it contributed as a reservoir to diseases that threatened white pine, which made it uncommon enough that most Americans have never tasted it.
- coldpie 6y ago
  This is getting wildly off topic, but blackcurrant is an interesting story. Commercial blackcurrant production was actually banned in the US for between 50 and 100 years, depending on the state. That means it's basically an unknown fruit in the US today. It was banned because it is a carrier of a disease which was destroying a species of pine tree which is important to the US lumber industry. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackcurrant_production_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackcurrant_production_in_the... Quote from the article: "Marvin Pritts, a professor of horticulture at Cornell University, asserts that less than 0.1% of Americans have likely ever eaten a blackcurrant."
  - agurk 6y ago
    The lack of exposure to blackcurrants in the US does raise a question of wine - specifically Cabernet Sauvignon. One of the defining qualities is blackcurrant notes which are a good help when trying to detect which grape you're drinking. Being exposed to it as a child makes it easy to detect it, but for the 99.9%+ of Americans who've never been exposed to it what do they experience? Another berry? A wine flavour they can't quite describe? Do they miss out on it altogether?

by agurk 6y ago

vidarh 6y ago

> Coca-cola seems to be a notable exception that didn't change their formula. Coca Cola is an interesting one in that the Coca Cola Zero Sugar introduction seemed to have been mostly about introducing a replacement for Coke Zero that had labeling making it easier to confuse with regular Coke, with the design dominated by the "regular" red and just some black added (in Europe; in some other markets the design is more distinct from regular Coke) > blackcurrant cordial Interestingly, blackcurrant is almost exclusively a European thing (99%+ of production).

user5994461 6y ago
>>> Interestingly, blackcurrant is almost exclusively a European thing (99%+ of production). It's a UK thing as far as I am aware. Never seen it in any quantity outside of the UK.
- agurk 6y ago
  It's definitely common in Denmark. France has crème de cassis[0] and produces 16 million litres annually of the stuff. In Germany and Eastern Europe I've seen it commonly sold as fruit juice and I've certainly drank a lot of (Schwarze) Johannisbeereschorle - blackcurrent juice mixed with sparkling water - in Munich. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cr%C3%A8me_de_cassis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cr%C3%A8me_de_cassis
  - user5994461 6y ago
    I am French so there you go ^^ Creme de cassis is a strong liquor. It's quite expensive due to being alcohol (alcohol taxes and regulations) and generally being a luxury mixer at that. It's never drinked alone. It is not drinkable, it's very strong and it has a thick consistency akin to a smoothie. (You could try a sip but you're definitely not going to down a glass of that). Main use is a mixer for cocktails. The most common is "kir". Put a bit of creme de cassis at the bottom of the glass and fill the rest with a white wine. The fancy version is the "kir royale", using champagne in place of white wine.
- vidarh 6y ago
  It's more common in the UK than elsewhere, but I grew up with blackcurrant as one of the most common types of squash/cordial in Norway as well, with a wide range of brands - to extent that blackcurrant is the expected taste of red squash if nothing else is specified. I know it is also widespread in Denmark as well. It may well be uncommon in parts of Europe too, but not to the extent of particularly the US where most states banned it for nearly a century because it contributed as a reservoir to diseases that threatened white pine, which made it uncommon enough that most Americans have never tasted it.
coldpie 6y ago
This is getting wildly off topic, but blackcurrant is an interesting story. Commercial blackcurrant production was actually banned in the US for between 50 and 100 years, depending on the state. That means it's basically an unknown fruit in the US today. It was banned because it is a carrier of a disease which was destroying a species of pine tree which is important to the US lumber industry. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackcurrant_production_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackcurrant_production_in_the... Quote from the article: "Marvin Pritts, a professor of horticulture at Cornell University, asserts that less than 0.1% of Americans have likely ever eaten a blackcurrant."
- agurk 6y ago
  The lack of exposure to blackcurrants in the US does raise a question of wine - specifically Cabernet Sauvignon. One of the defining qualities is blackcurrant notes which are a good help when trying to detect which grape you're drinking. Being exposed to it as a child makes it easy to detect it, but for the 99.9%+ of Americans who've never been exposed to it what do they experience? Another berry? A wine flavour they can't quite describe? Do they miss out on it altogether?