4 ms·

16kbps over 2km, wow! How sensitive is the system to the quality of connection? If I hide enamel coated filament just beneath my lawn is that going to be good

16kbps over 2km, wow! How sensitive is the system to the quality of connection? If I hide enamel coated filament just beneath my lawn is that going to be good for a one wire bus to work? Does it even need to be insulated?

gioscarab 6y ago
It works even if you use the human body or water as a conductor, as I showcase in this demonstration (sorry for my strong italian accent): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWlhKD5lz5w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWlhKD5lz5w This is the implementation: https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/tree/master/src/strategies/SoftwareBitBang https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/tree/master/src/strategies/So... This is the source code: https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/blob/master/src/strategies/SoftwareBitBang/SoftwareBitBang.h https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/blob/master/src/strategies/So... It is extremely rugged, it works much better than any alternative I have ever tried. Ah, it is free and open-source ;)
- gioscarab 6y ago
  Looking at the interest my comment generated I decided to create a post here on HN about PJDL, please if you liked up it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23591953 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23591953
- Jnr 6y ago
  The awesome thing with wireless IoT is that it can be set up without any additional cabling, which can be extremely painful process in most homes. In case of wireless all you need is ESP32, relay and a power supply. And all of that together will cost less than 10$. Can you easily (cheaply) use the already existing power cables for PJDL? I know there are network repeaters that use power cables to transfer data, but I have no idea how much it would cost in IoT scenario. Do you have some examples?
  - gioscarab 6y ago
    Yes many users have squatted old phone wiring, here in italy in most houses it is embedded in walls, and it is present in most rooms. Being unused and obsolete it can be used for home automation with PJON :)
- MaxBarraclough 6y ago
  As a software person who doesn't know much about this sort of thing: how does this work electrically? Presumably there's no current flowing as it's an open circuit? Is it akin to a voltmeter using the ground as a point of reference? Why don't other wire-based protocols use the single-wire approach? Does it have anything in common with 'single-wire earth return', in power-distribution?
  - gioscarab 6y ago
    The protocol is really simple +5v is 1, 0v is 0. The circuit is just a single conductor and a common ground pin. If you connect a LED between the bus and ground you can visually see packets in form of light pulses.
- Aloha 6y ago
  The Italian accent made me think of Marconi, also your accent isnt heavy at all, just adds a little bit of color.
  - gioscarab 6y ago
    That is really a good compliment :)
aasasd 6y ago
Here's why it's a good idea to insulate underground cables or use optical fiber: https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=357 https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=357 (TLDW: the salient point is at 7:20: https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=440 https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=440). Though, I don't know if insulation helps in the case of lightning. Apparently with Ethernet, special grounding thingies help.
- gioscarab 6y ago
  Yes, in production it is suggested to use current-limiting resistors, pull-down resistors, a fuse, a zener diode or a TVS or a varistor. Using all the suggested protective circuitry in the worst case the fuse should be the only component to fry in case of direct lightning strike.
  - fest 6y ago
    Lightning crosses several hundred meters of air at the very minimum- what makes you think it won't arc over a few millimeters more, if that's the path of least impedance? In general even the most rugged lightning/surge protection only decrease the likelihood of protected equipment being vaporized.
    - gioscarab 6y ago
      I agree that in some cases there is nothing to do and damage will be done by the strike and there could be no protection able to prevent it, specially if the equipment is directly hit. I would have corrected my previous statement but it cannot be edited.
  - mito88 6y ago
    have you worked with VDSL modems and lines? it can be a nightmare.

gioscarab 6y ago

It works even if you use the human body or water as a conductor, as I showcase in this demonstration (sorry for my strong italian accent): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWlhKD5lz5w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWlhKD5lz5w This is the implementation: https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/tree/master/src/strategies/SoftwareBitBang https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/tree/master/src/strategies/So... This is the source code: https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/blob/master/src/strategies/SoftwareBitBang/SoftwareBitBang.h https://github.com/gioblu/PJON/blob/master/src/strategies/So... It is extremely rugged, it works much better than any alternative I have ever tried. Ah, it is free and open-source ;)

gioscarab 6y ago
Looking at the interest my comment generated I decided to create a post here on HN about PJDL, please if you liked up it: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23591953 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23591953
Jnr 6y ago
The awesome thing with wireless IoT is that it can be set up without any additional cabling, which can be extremely painful process in most homes. In case of wireless all you need is ESP32, relay and a power supply. And all of that together will cost less than 10$. Can you easily (cheaply) use the already existing power cables for PJDL? I know there are network repeaters that use power cables to transfer data, but I have no idea how much it would cost in IoT scenario. Do you have some examples?
- gioscarab 6y ago
  Yes many users have squatted old phone wiring, here in italy in most houses it is embedded in walls, and it is present in most rooms. Being unused and obsolete it can be used for home automation with PJON :)
MaxBarraclough 6y ago
As a software person who doesn't know much about this sort of thing: how does this work electrically? Presumably there's no current flowing as it's an open circuit? Is it akin to a voltmeter using the ground as a point of reference? Why don't other wire-based protocols use the single-wire approach? Does it have anything in common with 'single-wire earth return', in power-distribution?
- gioscarab 6y ago
  The protocol is really simple +5v is 1, 0v is 0. The circuit is just a single conductor and a common ground pin. If you connect a LED between the bus and ground you can visually see packets in form of light pulses.
Aloha 6y ago
The Italian accent made me think of Marconi, also your accent isnt heavy at all, just adds a little bit of color.
- gioscarab 6y ago
  That is really a good compliment :)

aasasd 6y ago

Here's why it's a good idea to insulate underground cables or use optical fiber: https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=357 https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=357 (TLDW: the salient point is at 7:20: https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=440 https://youtu.be/Ev0PL892zSE?t=440). Though, I don't know if insulation helps in the case of lightning. Apparently with Ethernet, special grounding thingies help.

gioscarab 6y ago
Yes, in production it is suggested to use current-limiting resistors, pull-down resistors, a fuse, a zener diode or a TVS or a varistor. Using all the suggested protective circuitry in the worst case the fuse should be the only component to fry in case of direct lightning strike.
- fest 6y ago
  Lightning crosses several hundred meters of air at the very minimum- what makes you think it won't arc over a few millimeters more, if that's the path of least impedance? In general even the most rugged lightning/surge protection only decrease the likelihood of protected equipment being vaporized.
  - gioscarab 6y ago
    I agree that in some cases there is nothing to do and damage will be done by the strike and there could be no protection able to prevent it, specially if the equipment is directly hit. I would have corrected my previous statement but it cannot be edited.
- mito88 6y ago
  have you worked with VDSL modems and lines? it can be a nightmare.