7 ms·

As a 30 year old software developer who's now considering going back to school for the next 3-4 years to get a degree, I wonder if I should blame these kinds of

As a 30 year old software developer who's now considering going back to school for the next 3-4 years to get a degree, I wonder if I should blame these kinds of resources for making me believe that I could learn everything on my own and that a degree was unnecessary. Having learned this material in school would have made my life so much easier... For context, I recently received a lot of pressure to get a degree, despite years of experience and good knowledge of CS fundamentals.

wincy 6y ago
Where is the pressure coming from? Your employer? I’d guess it varies widely between companies.
- miguelrochefort 6y ago
  The pressure comes from everywhere: - Current employer: "Your salary is already good for someone without a bachelor's degree" - Current employer: "We're sorry but this promotion requires a bachelor's degree" - Future employer: "We're sorry but we hired someone with a bachelor's degree for this job" - Date: "You don't have a bachelor's degree?" - Friends: "You're the only one without a bachelor's degree" - Meetup: "What did you study in college?" - Country: "We can't grant you a work visa without a bachelor's degree" - Family: "You will have more opportunities with a bachelor's degree. We'll even pay for it." (offer expired) - School: "Here's a scholarship" (offer expired) - 80,000 hours: "You basically don't exist" - Brain: "Maybe I'm not a superstar coder and job security is important" Perhaps some of these are hypothetical, but they feel the same as if they had been concretized.
  - M5x7wI3CmbEem10 6y ago
    does similar pressure exist for a Master’s Degree? I’ve considered OMSCS for this reason.
    - miguelrochefort 6y ago
      Ask me after I get my bachelor's degree. I suspect the pressure never really goes away.
  - scarface74 6y ago
    I have a hard time believing that an employer ever cared about my degree in CS from 24 years ago from a no name state college when they decided to hire me. I’m sure my classes in COBOL,FORTRAN, and data structures in Pascal made any difference. Well, I did take a course in C and 16 bit x86 assembly.
    - danielscrubs 6y ago
      It was different times back then I'd argue, you could basically do 5+5 in a shell and get hired and shipped of to New York, but they where also forced to be constrained enough by the hardware to become clever after getting the job. 2018 Apple had 20 million registered developers and it has only increased since then. It's still very easy to become a developer right now (sambo found it to be the easiest path forward for example, from no experience at all), but the trend is quite scary. I have frankly no idea how it look when I turn 60.
      - scarface74 6y ago
        I’m saying once you have experience even now, as the original poster has, most companies don’t care if you have experience. In the immortal words of every in r/cscareerquestions “learn leetCode and work for a FAANG”. No I didn’t do that to “get into a FAANG” but it is a much easier route than the one I took. If you want to go the enterprise route, if you have experience and do enough resume driven development and can answer basic techno trivia on a company’s chosen stack, it’s even easier.
rhc2104 6y ago
Perhaps Western Governors University could be a good fit. https://www.wgu.edu/online-it-degrees/computer-science.html https://www.wgu.edu/online-it-degrees/computer-science.html The philosophy of WGU is that you pass self-paced courses by passing tests, so people that already know the material can complete the courses quickly.
- miguelrochefort 6y ago
  I wish I had known about them years agob. I have applied last week, but I'm still waiting for their decision (they don't officially accept international students).
- ApolloRising 6y ago
  Are they a respected degree in CS?
  - kyawzazaw 6y ago
    They are accredited and mostly pursued by already practicing software engineers who want to check the box for a degree.
    - mcguire 6y ago
      That's not an answer. :-)
      - Technetium 6y ago
        Accredited is indeed a valid answer https://www.wgu.edu/missouri/about/accreditation.html https://www.wgu.edu/missouri/about/accreditation.html
vector_spaces 6y ago
I'm doing that right now at 32, but more for personal enrichment than anyone pressuring me. I feel like I'm getting much more out of my degree than I would have if I went the traditional route because I understand the context for the material, and because I've seen much of it before through self teaching, so I can focus more on consolidating my knowledge of the fundamentals rather than struggling to absorb all of these hard and often poorly justified concepts for an exam.
throwawaygh 6y ago
> despite years of experience and good knowledge of CS fundamentals Have you considered majoring in something other than CS? If you're adequately self-taught and need the degree, then might as well learn something new and useful.
- non-entity 6y ago
  This is what I'm considering. I'm relatively content having been programming long enough. If I go back to school it probably won't be CS. On the flip side, unfortunately CS is one of the few useful degrees that's had enough schools create a worker-friendly program (i.e. online) so many other degrees probable mean dropping out of the workforce.
  - bigasscoffee 6y ago
    Don't quit working to get a degree, and don't take on a lot of debt to get one.
    - non-entity 6y ago
      Unfortunately the way the US education system is designed I don't have much of a choice atm.
- miguelrochefort 6y ago
  I have considered the idea, but I don't know if the additional effort would be worth the possibly marginal benefits. I've considered biology and law because they seem to pair well with software. Perhaps smaller niches would be even better.
M5x7wI3CmbEem10 6y ago
was a Bachelor’s in a quantitative subject not sufficient?
Whinner 6y ago
Georgia Tech has an online MS in CS or Cybersecurity. The CS degree is a little cheaper, classes are roughly $650 each, cyber are around $900. You're looking at around $7k or $12k for the entire degree. I'm currently in the Cybersecurity program if you have any questions. https://omscs.gatech.edu/ https://omscs.gatech.edu/ https://pe.gatech.edu/degrees/cybersecurity https://pe.gatech.edu/degrees/cybersecurity Another option is NYU's Cyberfellow's MS for cybersecurity. It's around $16k https://engineering.nyu.edu/academics/programs/cybersecurity-ms-online/nyu-cyber-fellows https://engineering.nyu.edu/academics/programs/cybersecurity...

wincy 6y ago

Where is the pressure coming from? Your employer? I’d guess it varies widely between companies.

miguelrochefort 6y ago
The pressure comes from everywhere: - Current employer: "Your salary is already good for someone without a bachelor's degree" - Current employer: "We're sorry but this promotion requires a bachelor's degree" - Future employer: "We're sorry but we hired someone with a bachelor's degree for this job" - Date: "You don't have a bachelor's degree?" - Friends: "You're the only one without a bachelor's degree" - Meetup: "What did you study in college?" - Country: "We can't grant you a work visa without a bachelor's degree" - Family: "You will have more opportunities with a bachelor's degree. We'll even pay for it." (offer expired) - School: "Here's a scholarship" (offer expired) - 80,000 hours: "You basically don't exist" - Brain: "Maybe I'm not a superstar coder and job security is important" Perhaps some of these are hypothetical, but they feel the same as if they had been concretized.
- M5x7wI3CmbEem10 6y ago
  does similar pressure exist for a Master’s Degree? I’ve considered OMSCS for this reason.
  - miguelrochefort 6y ago
    Ask me after I get my bachelor's degree. I suspect the pressure never really goes away.
- scarface74 6y ago
  I have a hard time believing that an employer ever cared about my degree in CS from 24 years ago from a no name state college when they decided to hire me. I’m sure my classes in COBOL,FORTRAN, and data structures in Pascal made any difference. Well, I did take a course in C and 16 bit x86 assembly.
  - danielscrubs 6y ago
    It was different times back then I'd argue, you could basically do 5+5 in a shell and get hired and shipped of to New York, but they where also forced to be constrained enough by the hardware to become clever after getting the job. 2018 Apple had 20 million registered developers and it has only increased since then. It's still very easy to become a developer right now (sambo found it to be the easiest path forward for example, from no experience at all), but the trend is quite scary. I have frankly no idea how it look when I turn 60.
    - scarface74 6y ago
      I’m saying once you have experience even now, as the original poster has, most companies don’t care if you have experience. In the immortal words of every in r/cscareerquestions “learn leetCode and work for a FAANG”. No I didn’t do that to “get into a FAANG” but it is a much easier route than the one I took. If you want to go the enterprise route, if you have experience and do enough resume driven development and can answer basic techno trivia on a company’s chosen stack, it’s even easier.

rhc2104 6y ago

Perhaps Western Governors University could be a good fit. https://www.wgu.edu/online-it-degrees/computer-science.html https://www.wgu.edu/online-it-degrees/computer-science.html The philosophy of WGU is that you pass self-paced courses by passing tests, so people that already know the material can complete the courses quickly.

miguelrochefort 6y ago
I wish I had known about them years agob. I have applied last week, but I'm still waiting for their decision (they don't officially accept international students).
ApolloRising 6y ago
Are they a respected degree in CS?
- kyawzazaw 6y ago
  They are accredited and mostly pursued by already practicing software engineers who want to check the box for a degree.
  - mcguire 6y ago
    That's not an answer. :-)
    - Technetium 6y ago
      Accredited is indeed a valid answer https://www.wgu.edu/missouri/about/accreditation.html https://www.wgu.edu/missouri/about/accreditation.html

vector_spaces 6y ago

I'm doing that right now at 32, but more for personal enrichment than anyone pressuring me. I feel like I'm getting much more out of my degree than I would have if I went the traditional route because I understand the context for the material, and because I've seen much of it before through self teaching, so I can focus more on consolidating my knowledge of the fundamentals rather than struggling to absorb all of these hard and often poorly justified concepts for an exam.

throwawaygh 6y ago

> despite years of experience and good knowledge of CS fundamentals Have you considered majoring in something other than CS? If you're adequately self-taught and need the degree, then might as well learn something new and useful.

non-entity 6y ago
This is what I'm considering. I'm relatively content having been programming long enough. If I go back to school it probably won't be CS. On the flip side, unfortunately CS is one of the few useful degrees that's had enough schools create a worker-friendly program (i.e. online) so many other degrees probable mean dropping out of the workforce.
- bigasscoffee 6y ago
  Don't quit working to get a degree, and don't take on a lot of debt to get one.
  - non-entity 6y ago
    Unfortunately the way the US education system is designed I don't have much of a choice atm.
miguelrochefort 6y ago
I have considered the idea, but I don't know if the additional effort would be worth the possibly marginal benefits. I've considered biology and law because they seem to pair well with software. Perhaps smaller niches would be even better.

M5x7wI3CmbEem10 6y ago

was a Bachelor’s in a quantitative subject not sufficient?

Whinner 6y ago

Georgia Tech has an online MS in CS or Cybersecurity. The CS degree is a little cheaper, classes are roughly $650 each, cyber are around $900. You're looking at around $7k or $12k for the entire degree. I'm currently in the Cybersecurity program if you have any questions. https://omscs.gatech.edu/ https://omscs.gatech.edu/ https://pe.gatech.edu/degrees/cybersecurity https://pe.gatech.edu/degrees/cybersecurity Another option is NYU's Cyberfellow's MS for cybersecurity. It's around $16k https://engineering.nyu.edu/academics/programs/cybersecurity-ms-online/nyu-cyber-fellows https://engineering.nyu.edu/academics/programs/cybersecurity...