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Because the same people who make the devices also run the app store. Therefore they get to stay 'No other app stores allowed' on our devices and OS. Isn't this
by kingkongjaffa 6y ago
Because the same people who make the devices also run the app store. Therefore they get to stay 'No other app stores allowed' on our devices and OS.
Isn't this extremely obvious?
- ekr 6y agoThey don't get to say that due to antitrust laws. Hence why you can use Amazon's appstore on Android, or FDroid etc. I'm not really familiar with the Apple ecosystem.
- kick 6y agoThey do get to say that. Apple has a minority of the market and wouldn't run into legally-justifiable antitrust problems.
- rbecker 6y agoMonopoly is not necessary for antitrust enforcement - 'market power' is sufficient: https://www.justice.gov/atr/monopoly-power-and-market-power-antitrust-law https://www.justice.gov/atr/monopoly-power-and-market-power-...
- kick 6y agoFYI, your account seems to have triggered the system that hellbans new accounts. I vouched for your comment (which revived it), and I sent a message to hn@yc to point out that it looks like there was a false-positive. Your last few comments haven't been visible without showdead set or been able to be interacted with by anyone.
- rbecker 6y agoThanks. I noticed that most of my comments were invisible, but with a few seemingly random ones getting through. I assumed it was a matter of time before restrictions were lifted on my account.
- jonas_kgomo 6y agoWOW thanks for vouching for him and keeping watch on that.
- bouk 6y agoApple certainly has a monopoly in the iPhone app market.
- kick 6y agoSure, and Frigidaire has a monopoly on Frigidaire refrigerators. I said legally-justifiable antitrust claims. Apple has a minority of the smartphone market. You can make anything into a "monopoly" if you define it narrowly enough but that's not legally justifiable in any way.
- Nullabillity 6y agoBut that's not what the discussion is about. Frigidaire doesn't try to limit you to only putting stuff you bought at Walmart into their fridges.
- kick 6y agoNor does Apple: you can have as many PWAs as you want. As JS is Turing complete, you can then have every sort of app. They've always encouraged PWAs. Unless you want to legally force every company to surrender their source code (which I enthusiastically would support), there's no legal basis for Apple not being able to have their proprietary feature phone locked down. Though if you'd like, you can look at Keurig, which does limit what you can put into it to "only Keurig products" or one of the millions of other things that limit what you can put into it.
- anoncake 6y ago> Though if you'd like, you can look at Keurig, which does limit what you can put into it to "only Keurig products" or one of the millions of other things that limit what you can put into it. Whatabout...
- anoncake 6y agoWhat use case is there for Fridgidaire refrigerators that cannot be fulfilled by other brands?
- cargo8 6y agoAlso - that's not the reason. The reason is because Android is open source and Google allows sideloading. I don't think Google allows Amazon to distribute their app store through the Play Store, so you have to sideload it. Doesn't solve the distribution problem anyway – the app stores are the shelf
- fallingtopieces 6y agoYea, ‘monopoly’ in the question is the answer...
- DesiLurker 6y agoso monopoly laws dont matter?
- Finnucane 6y agoThanks to what’s become known as the Bork doctrine, they matter a lot less than they used to. Since at least the 1980s, regulators and courts have favored a very narrow idea of what counts as abuse of monopoly power, centered on consumer pricing issues. More general problems of market efficiency, preventing competition, monopsony, etc., have fallen by the wayside.
- ScottFree 6y ago> Isn't this extremely obvious? Yes and no. The obvious answer is to make your own device with your own OS and make it better than iOS or android. That used to be difficult, but the quality of iOS and android has been declining for a long time. We're at the point where an alternative could be viable for somebody with deep enough pockets and the know-how. The not-so obvious answer is we have lots of evidence over the years of the tech sector engaging in anticompetitive and illegal actions with very little consequence. Apple, Google and Facebook colluding not to poach each other's employees. Intel threatening to cut off relations with any computer manufacturer that deals with AMD. It's very likely that Google and Apple would use their influence and power to kill any viable competitor. So, how do you deal with that?
- kyriakos 6y agoyou can use android and not use google as evident from huawei's latest devices. at least in my country they are selling just fine even though google services are not enabled.
- unix_fan 6y agoHuawei has been completely crippled in my country. In Latin American markets at least, people heavily depend on Google services.
- ScottFree 6y agoI'm talking exclusively about the US. Different markets have different market shares. Different countries have different monopoly and antitrust laws. Limiting it to the biggest market, and the one most germane to HN, is what makes it possible to have a discussion. Otherwise, we're all just talking to ourselves.
- kyriakos 6y agoBiggest market?
- obarthelemy 6y agoNo, and it's untrue: only Apple does that, Google doesn't.