6 ms·

Would love feedback on this post - no mercy expected!

by fapi1974 16y ago

icey 16y ago
It's great to see an idea that isn't just a clone of some other popular tech service. This looks pretty original; what are your plans for success? How does this scale up?
- fapi1974 16y ago
  Thanks! The product is designed with a couple nice little ratchets in mind. People see videos they like, then recognize they can participate. When they participate they invite their friends to watch them - it's instinct. That's the first cycle. The second cycle is that when people don't see a video on a topic they like, they can create one - and invite their friends to contribute. Success is premised on growing the user base through those two cycles, and then selling things like premium editing subscriptions for people who create a lot of content.
  - icey 16y ago
    This is the part that would worry me regarding scaling: "The pieces get plugged in to the appropriate areas, combined and narrated into beautiful product that you can share on all your favorite outlets" Who does the combination and narration? The quality of the final movie is going to be a strong driver perception of your product - how do you ensure the quality stays high as you grow? Is it the users that do the narration? That might make it easier, but then your value proposition drops since they could use iMovie, right? I think it's a cool idea though; definitely sounds interesting.
    - fapi1974 16y ago
      "Narrated" might have been an inexact choice of words. Most of this will be webcam and mobile footage - what will drive much of the quality will be the words that are said and how they are arranged in sequence, both before and after production. So - narrative just means that unlike a shared photo or video album, or slideshow, there's people talking and it makes sense...
    - fapi1974 16y ago
      I fixed the wording to make it a bit more precise, thanks.
gridspy 16y ago
Exciting idea. I'd jump on board if I was "single" and in the US. I love the viral nature of the service - you have to tell your friends about it so they will contribute their clips to your movie. It would be cool if you had some great placeholders and the author of the clip could edit and cut a placeholder full version. That way as each friend drops their clip in they can view the whole and adjust their part. Making the system modular so you could collaborate on a large movie would also be cool. You could have an import tool that accepts a script as a text file. It finds definitions of characters, scenes, dialog, direction, etc. It then breaks the script into acts, scenes, shots and creates the corresponding data-structures on your end to present same. You then use chunks of dialog as placeholders for the rendered imagery and presto, instant placeholder movie. Author then replaces dialog with storyboards, early renders, then finished content. It could be truly social, like a movie creation wiki with many users. Each user might have different permissions to edit, add content for (some subset of) scenes, etc.
- fapi1974 16y ago
  I just addressed this with Keyframe. The shining light on a hill is a full toolbox that could be used to create a full on movie. We'll start simple - but my sense is that people will be able to take it quite far within the constraints we establish. All of the above will make awesome premium features...great feedback!
- fapi1974 16y ago
  Also - and obviously - let me know if your "single" status changes :-)
Keyframe 16y ago
I'm actually in real movie studios and around that world every day. I realizes this is a consumer product, not a directorial production. I'm having trouble grasping this concept: 'You provide an outline of topics for each clip you need'... are you suggesting your client (average consumer, I guess?) would be well prepared to have an entire editing session in their mind and prevized the whole montage in their head before they hire your service? Because that's a bit..er far fetched. I feel I don't understand it - can you explain it a bit more? My first idea when I heard about consumer oriented MSAAS as you call it, was that you would provide them with guidelines about story structure (however simple it may be - because it can be made formulaic), offer them a slew of templates like digital juice and, on top of that, list them required material to be shot for a given project... and in the end you auto-magically comp and edit it with a sound sheet and they take of their product.
- fapi1974 16y ago
  You know, I have stayed away from the "MSAAS" tag in any consumer facing concepts because I feel like that will scare away the average user. The right level of complexity to consider is a wedding tribute video. Ten friends of the couple speak on a topic each: when they were young, how they met, why they're good for each other, etc. We then take those clips and put them together with great transitions, overlays, and copy, and what you have is something that is not fully scripted but far more linear and story-like than, say, an Animoto project. We'll be doing these on all kinds of topics, of course - the wedding thing just gives you a sense for the structure.
  - Keyframe 16y ago
    Yes, of course. Wedding, anniversaries, birthdays.. There are A LOT of template companies out there (like digital juice), comping/editing for a user is a challenging task (and might be fun to make :)), but IMO if you could provide them with a layout tool for story structure, it would be a killer. Like that imovie thing mentioned. I purposely called it a layout tool, since you need only a basic structure to hold it through, not a full blown script (at least not for initial kickoff). I'm sure you've sen Syd Field's workshops and stuff like that. If you could hook up with some template guys (to cut down costs of making them yourself - both money and time wise), maybe hook up with guys like dramatica to devise a simpler version of structure process, and you do the tech part for comp/editing... you'd have something that nobody currently has, and online... I bet youtube guys would be interested if you lose interest in the business along the road. Of course, you could do all the steps without partnerships, but it would take a long time. Just my 2cs.
anigbrowl 16y ago
I see that your actual business model is 'templates + talking heads = a nice video,' and that the examples you cite are things like wedding tributes, or little opinion pieces. This is an attractive idea, because it's true that there is a lot of demand for this sort of thing, and most of it is pretty generic. It has potential. But...'movie studio as a service' is a terrifying prospect, because there are a ton of people out there with scripts and a ton of people out there with cameras, and a tagline like that is guaranteed to attract the very worst of both groups. Same thing with the domain name - 'cine' puts people's brains into art mode, and when people are disappointed they often blame their tools. This is the sort of hump that besets products like MovieStorm and XtraNormal. I am overstating it a bit to give you the pessimistic angle, but after about a decade of working in indie film and video doing everything from narrative to commercials, it's very hard to work around the inevitable quality problems in the post pipeline - the worse the input material, the less realistic the expectations of the customers about the ability to 'fix it in post' may be. The people who can shoot quality video don't really need a product like this, and the people who really need a product like that may be the trickiest customers to deal with. There's an industry joke to the effect that if the sound is no good, people will say there was something wrong with the lighting; the ability to manage expectations is going to be key to how the public receives it.
- fapi1974 16y ago
  This is really good insight. "Movie Studio as a Service" has been used nowhere other than in this job posting because of the likelihood of attracting HN interest. I'm actually really happy with that particular result! As for Cine - that's a tough one...I often use "video" instead of "movie" because of different connotations. Naming took forever though - finally I got to the point where I just had to make a call. I don't think there's a good answer to the sweet-spot customer question until we get out there - my personal hunch is it will be more about sharing opinions and being seen than cinematography. And...the cinematography stuff offers great premium opps!

Would love feedback on this post - no mercy expected!

icey 16y ago

It's great to see an idea that isn't just a clone of some other popular tech service. This looks pretty original; what are your plans for success? How does this scale up?

fapi1974 16y ago
Thanks! The product is designed with a couple nice little ratchets in mind. People see videos they like, then recognize they can participate. When they participate they invite their friends to watch them - it's instinct. That's the first cycle. The second cycle is that when people don't see a video on a topic they like, they can create one - and invite their friends to contribute. Success is premised on growing the user base through those two cycles, and then selling things like premium editing subscriptions for people who create a lot of content.
- icey 16y ago
  This is the part that would worry me regarding scaling: "The pieces get plugged in to the appropriate areas, combined and narrated into beautiful product that you can share on all your favorite outlets" Who does the combination and narration? The quality of the final movie is going to be a strong driver perception of your product - how do you ensure the quality stays high as you grow? Is it the users that do the narration? That might make it easier, but then your value proposition drops since they could use iMovie, right? I think it's a cool idea though; definitely sounds interesting.
  - fapi1974 16y ago
    "Narrated" might have been an inexact choice of words. Most of this will be webcam and mobile footage - what will drive much of the quality will be the words that are said and how they are arranged in sequence, both before and after production. So - narrative just means that unlike a shared photo or video album, or slideshow, there's people talking and it makes sense...
  - fapi1974 16y ago
    I fixed the wording to make it a bit more precise, thanks.

gridspy 16y ago

Exciting idea. I'd jump on board if I was "single" and in the US. I love the viral nature of the service - you have to tell your friends about it so they will contribute their clips to your movie. It would be cool if you had some great placeholders and the author of the clip could edit and cut a placeholder full version. That way as each friend drops their clip in they can view the whole and adjust their part. Making the system modular so you could collaborate on a large movie would also be cool. You could have an import tool that accepts a script as a text file. It finds definitions of characters, scenes, dialog, direction, etc. It then breaks the script into acts, scenes, shots and creates the corresponding data-structures on your end to present same. You then use chunks of dialog as placeholders for the rendered imagery and presto, instant placeholder movie. Author then replaces dialog with storyboards, early renders, then finished content. It could be truly social, like a movie creation wiki with many users. Each user might have different permissions to edit, add content for (some subset of) scenes, etc.

fapi1974 16y ago
I just addressed this with Keyframe. The shining light on a hill is a full toolbox that could be used to create a full on movie. We'll start simple - but my sense is that people will be able to take it quite far within the constraints we establish. All of the above will make awesome premium features...great feedback!
fapi1974 16y ago
Also - and obviously - let me know if your "single" status changes :-)

Keyframe 16y ago

I'm actually in real movie studios and around that world every day. I realizes this is a consumer product, not a directorial production. I'm having trouble grasping this concept: 'You provide an outline of topics for each clip you need'... are you suggesting your client (average consumer, I guess?) would be well prepared to have an entire editing session in their mind and prevized the whole montage in their head before they hire your service? Because that's a bit..er far fetched. I feel I don't understand it - can you explain it a bit more? My first idea when I heard about consumer oriented MSAAS as you call it, was that you would provide them with guidelines about story structure (however simple it may be - because it can be made formulaic), offer them a slew of templates like digital juice and, on top of that, list them required material to be shot for a given project... and in the end you auto-magically comp and edit it with a sound sheet and they take of their product.

fapi1974 16y ago
You know, I have stayed away from the "MSAAS" tag in any consumer facing concepts because I feel like that will scare away the average user. The right level of complexity to consider is a wedding tribute video. Ten friends of the couple speak on a topic each: when they were young, how they met, why they're good for each other, etc. We then take those clips and put them together with great transitions, overlays, and copy, and what you have is something that is not fully scripted but far more linear and story-like than, say, an Animoto project. We'll be doing these on all kinds of topics, of course - the wedding thing just gives you a sense for the structure.
- Keyframe 16y ago
  Yes, of course. Wedding, anniversaries, birthdays.. There are A LOT of template companies out there (like digital juice), comping/editing for a user is a challenging task (and might be fun to make :)), but IMO if you could provide them with a layout tool for story structure, it would be a killer. Like that imovie thing mentioned. I purposely called it a layout tool, since you need only a basic structure to hold it through, not a full blown script (at least not for initial kickoff). I'm sure you've sen Syd Field's workshops and stuff like that. If you could hook up with some template guys (to cut down costs of making them yourself - both money and time wise), maybe hook up with guys like dramatica to devise a simpler version of structure process, and you do the tech part for comp/editing... you'd have something that nobody currently has, and online... I bet youtube guys would be interested if you lose interest in the business along the road. Of course, you could do all the steps without partnerships, but it would take a long time. Just my 2cs.

anigbrowl 16y ago

I see that your actual business model is 'templates + talking heads = a nice video,' and that the examples you cite are things like wedding tributes, or little opinion pieces. This is an attractive idea, because it's true that there is a lot of demand for this sort of thing, and most of it is pretty generic. It has potential. But...'movie studio as a service' is a terrifying prospect, because there are a ton of people out there with scripts and a ton of people out there with cameras, and a tagline like that is guaranteed to attract the very worst of both groups. Same thing with the domain name - 'cine' puts people's brains into art mode, and when people are disappointed they often blame their tools. This is the sort of hump that besets products like MovieStorm and XtraNormal. I am overstating it a bit to give you the pessimistic angle, but after about a decade of working in indie film and video doing everything from narrative to commercials, it's very hard to work around the inevitable quality problems in the post pipeline - the worse the input material, the less realistic the expectations of the customers about the ability to 'fix it in post' may be. The people who can shoot quality video don't really need a product like this, and the people who really need a product like that may be the trickiest customers to deal with. There's an industry joke to the effect that if the sound is no good, people will say there was something wrong with the lighting; the ability to manage expectations is going to be key to how the public receives it.

fapi1974 16y ago
This is really good insight. "Movie Studio as a Service" has been used nowhere other than in this job posting because of the likelihood of attracting HN interest. I'm actually really happy with that particular result! As for Cine - that's a tough one...I often use "video" instead of "movie" because of different connotations. Naming took forever though - finally I got to the point where I just had to make a call. I don't think there's a good answer to the sweet-spot customer question until we get out there - my personal hunch is it will be more about sharing opinions and being seen than cinematography. And...the cinematography stuff offers great premium opps!