6 ms·

A tiny smartphone company just brought a new Android version to a 2015 device

86 points by Vinnl 6y ago

Abishek_Muthian 6y ago
Kudos FairPhone for sticking to its ideals. I would sincerely suggest FairPhone team to look into officially supporting pure Linux OS (PostmarketOS, PureOS, Ubuntu Touch) both from consumer/business perspective. Because, those who are ordering Librem5/PinePhone are doing it for open/ethical/privacy features offered by the pure Linux ecosystem; but the hardware being used is far from that philosophy (Although Purism team seem to have taken great effort in choosing vendors). Fairphone Linux phone would fill in the need gap nicely!
- ss2003 6y ago
  Looks like they do https://ubports.com/devices/promoted-devices https://ubports.com/devices/promoted-devices
  - Abishek_Muthian 6y ago
    Yes FP2 has been long supported by UBPorts team, I don't think it's officially supported by FP side like how PinePhone does for PostmarketOS[1] or UBPorts[2]; FP3 has listed Android as the OS officially. [1]https://postmarketos.org/blog/2020/06/15/pinephone-postmarketos-community-edition/ https://postmarketos.org/blog/2020/06/15/pinephone-postmarke... [2]https://store.pine64.org/?product=pinephone-community-edition-ubports-limited-edition-linux-smartphone https://store.pine64.org/?product=pinephone-community-editio...
- ar0 6y ago
  There is the officially supported /e/OS Fairphone 3: https://esolutions.shop/shop/e-os-fairphone-3/ https://esolutions.shop/shop/e-os-fairphone-3/ Granted, /e/OS is not the same as one of those "pure Linux OS" options mentioned above, but it is open source and privacy-focused.
  - owenversteeg 6y ago
    Does anyone here have one of these? I'd love to hear about someone's day to day experience using one.
    - fgeiger 6y ago
      If you have a Fairphone 3 already, you can install /e/ OS and try for yourself: https://doc.e.foundation/devices/FP3/ https://doc.e.foundation/devices/FP3/
    - toper-centage 6y ago
      My daily driver for more than 6 months has been the FP3. I love it, its super comfortable, amazing battery. The biggest crux is the camera - terrible is darker conditions. Phones are so good these days, that even "mediocre" specs are far more than what you need in a phone.
    - bklaasen 6y ago
      I bought a Fairphone 3 with /e/ as soon as the announcement of the partnership between e.foundation and Fairphone was announced. I was aware I'd have to make certain compromises in order to have a device running an OS which would give me digital sovereignty. I had tried UBPorts on a OnePlus One, but the lack of apps and lack of Nextcloud integration meant it never really became my daily driver. My SIM didn't stay in it for long. As /e/ is basically LineageOS with MicroG and excellent Nextcloud integration, I reckoned it would have a better chance of working for me. The Fairphone 3 itself is large and clunky, with a low screen-to-body ratio. The modular construction may ironically make its longevity questionable - it feels less robust than unibody phones. The screen is good, as is the touch capability. There's one adequate mono speaker. The battery life is a little poor, but gets me through a waking day of heavy use. The mic is fine. The camera is woeful, but I didn't buy the phone to take snaps with. That might be one tradeoff too many for some people. Wifi, 4G and Bluetooth are solid. I've put a 128GB microSD card in and this works perfectly. Overall the device is convenient to use, pocketable and very usable. The fingerprint sensor is fast and reliable. I like the old-skool aesthetic of the device. /e/ OS comes with MicroG and no Google apps. To me, this is the main selling point of /e/. I've been working for years to disentangle my life from Google. The biggest steps I'd made prior to buying the Fairphone were to move my email account to Gandi and my documents, photos, calendar, contacts, map bookmarks, RSS feeds and everything else to a self-hosted Nextcloud instance. And here's where /e/ really, really shines. When I switched on the phone for the first time, instead of signing up for an /e/ account, I entered the URL, username and password of my account on my Nextcloud instance. After a few moments, my calendar, contacts and data were synched to the phone or available to browse. I can't describe what a feeling of pure delight and freedom that gave me. This is a device that acts in my interests. I've since piled a bunch of telemetry-laden Android apps onto the phone, but at least when I'm at home (which I am a lot these days) the telemetry can be mitigated by the Pi-Hole on my network. What's remarkable is how well they all work; even apps that I expected to fail - like my banking app, Audible, Netflix, RSA Token, Skype - all work perfectly. I've downloaded them from one of three places: the /e/ app store (where apps are graded with privacy and energy ratings), F-Droid and the Aurora Store. The one necessary app that doesn't work is Microsoft Authenticator, which I need for work SSO 2FA. I almost picked up a Nokia Lumia running Windows phone 10 for €30 just to run that! For now an ancient Nexus 9 stays charged to provide the second factor when I need it. I'll start a conversation with work to see what free alternatives they'll consider. There's no more casting to the Chromecast; I'm watching the Nymphcast project with interest. LibreELEC and DLNA are local streaming alternatives. So, all in all am I very happy with my purchase. The tradeoffs I have to make are more than acceptable to me. Yes, I would make the same purchase again. My old Huawei Mate 10 Pro is getting a system reset, going into its original box and on to a secondhand goods site. I haven't looked at it for weeks. Finally, I've already received an OS update in the few weeks I've had it. It's now midnight and I have 39% battery left.
- pengaru 6y ago
  > but the hardware being used is far from that philosophy (Although Purism team seem to have taken great effort in choosing vendors). Far from that philosophy? How so? Unless we're talking about them not being entirely open hardware with downloadable KiCAD files for reproducing the devices ourselves, I don't get the impression they're significantly worse than your average Linux-supported laptop, outside the baseband. The Mnt Reform is the only machine on my radar that strives to be completely open, is the FairPhone on that level? https://www.pine64.org/2020/01/24/setting-the-record-straight-pinephone-misconceptions/ https://www.pine64.org/2020/01/24/setting-the-record-straigh...
garysahota93 6y ago
This is amazing! I used to flash custom roms on phones back in college 5+ years ago, which was awesome. Would even charge friends for it. I think there's something here & makes me want to buy the Fairphone 3 even more now.
jbverschoor 6y ago
iOS 13 is supported on a 2015 device, the iPhone 6S
- fgeiger 6y ago
  Apple does a much better job in keeping devices alive for longer than Android OEMs in general. Having full control over hardware and software and focusing on few devices helps there. In Android land, this is unfortunately different. Longevity stands and falls (mostly the latter) with the (lack of) support of the chipset vendors such as Qualcomm and Mediatek. If they stop supporting a chipset, all devices built on them can not be properly supported anymore. Just think of all of the unreported and unfixed hardware and software vulnerabilities in proprietary components. It is impossible to maintain a device without the chipset vendor's involvement. Apple, on the other hand, is its own chipset vendor. The Android supply chain needs a drastic make-over to come anywhere near that.
  - ryukafalz 6y ago
    I really think the only way forward long-term is to build on hardware with mainlined drivers. This is so far outside the norm in the mobile ecosystem though that it's a huge uphill battle to get something working even passably. Purism and Pine64 have made great strides in that regard though.
bserge 6y ago
Thanks to the mentioned LineageOS team (and many other developers at XDA forums) this otherwise "enormous undertaking" is relatively easy. Android 9 works flawlessly on many SD 801 devices. I believe it's the last version of Android to see such active development on this 32-bit SoC. I've just installed it on my old HTC (which was also stuck at Android 5 and apps last updated ~2 years ago, even the autocorrect stopped working), and it's surprisingly usable. Increasing the minimum CPU frequency and boost time makes it feel much snappier, and everything works as it should, even Google Assistant with hotword activation. Some overclocking should provide even better performance, but it would likely need a new battery.
- fgeiger 6y ago
  Fairphone employee here. > Thanks to the mentioned LineageOS team (and many other developers at XDA forums) this otherwise "enormous undertaking" is relatively easy. You would think so. In fact, we also thought so, when we had started our work on Android 7 for the same device a while ago. Unfortunately, it shows that Lineage OS is by and for tech enthusiasts. There are several issues that break using this for production devices. There are a lot of stability issues that that the regular Lineage users put up with because they care more about the control they get than stability. However, the same instability is prohibitive for releasing this to regular less tech-savvy users. The worst problem, however, is that the Lineage OS community only develops and tests with "userdebug" builds. Unfortunately, regular "user" builds don't even compile and if they do, they do not run properly. That has huge security implications (SE Linux rules, root access, etc) that we could not ignore. That being said, having the work of the Lineage OS community available did give us a leg up. Open Source is great.
  - Vinnl 6y ago
    Thanks for your work on keeping up maintenance of the Fairphone 2! And of having made Fairphone Open available on it; I know usage is probably not high enough to make it happen for the Fairphone 3, but with Fairphone Open available I had no reason at all to consider Lineage, and the peace of mind it gives me is way beyond what I expected when I first installed it.

86 points by Vinnl 6y ago

Kudos FairPhone for sticking to its ideals. I would sincerely suggest FairPhone team to look into officially supporting pure Linux OS (PostmarketOS, PureOS, Ubuntu Touch) both from consumer/business perspective. Because, those who are ordering Librem5/PinePhone are doing it for open/ethical/privacy features offered by the pure Linux ecosystem; but the hardware being used is far from that philosophy (Although Purism team seem to have taken great effort in choosing vendors). Fairphone Linux phone would fill in the need gap nicely!

ss2003 6y ago
Looks like they do https://ubports.com/devices/promoted-devices https://ubports.com/devices/promoted-devices
- Abishek_Muthian 6y ago
  Yes FP2 has been long supported by UBPorts team, I don't think it's officially supported by FP side like how PinePhone does for PostmarketOS[1] or UBPorts[2]; FP3 has listed Android as the OS officially. [1]https://postmarketos.org/blog/2020/06/15/pinephone-postmarketos-community-edition/ https://postmarketos.org/blog/2020/06/15/pinephone-postmarke... [2]https://store.pine64.org/?product=pinephone-community-edition-ubports-limited-edition-linux-smartphone https://store.pine64.org/?product=pinephone-community-editio...
ar0 6y ago
There is the officially supported /e/OS Fairphone 3: https://esolutions.shop/shop/e-os-fairphone-3/ https://esolutions.shop/shop/e-os-fairphone-3/ Granted, /e/OS is not the same as one of those "pure Linux OS" options mentioned above, but it is open source and privacy-focused.
- owenversteeg 6y ago
  Does anyone here have one of these? I'd love to hear about someone's day to day experience using one.
  - fgeiger 6y ago
    If you have a Fairphone 3 already, you can install /e/ OS and try for yourself: https://doc.e.foundation/devices/FP3/ https://doc.e.foundation/devices/FP3/
  - toper-centage 6y ago
    My daily driver for more than 6 months has been the FP3. I love it, its super comfortable, amazing battery. The biggest crux is the camera - terrible is darker conditions. Phones are so good these days, that even "mediocre" specs are far more than what you need in a phone.
  - bklaasen 6y ago
    I bought a Fairphone 3 with /e/ as soon as the announcement of the partnership between e.foundation and Fairphone was announced. I was aware I'd have to make certain compromises in order to have a device running an OS which would give me digital sovereignty. I had tried UBPorts on a OnePlus One, but the lack of apps and lack of Nextcloud integration meant it never really became my daily driver. My SIM didn't stay in it for long. As /e/ is basically LineageOS with MicroG and excellent Nextcloud integration, I reckoned it would have a better chance of working for me. The Fairphone 3 itself is large and clunky, with a low screen-to-body ratio. The modular construction may ironically make its longevity questionable - it feels less robust than unibody phones. The screen is good, as is the touch capability. There's one adequate mono speaker. The battery life is a little poor, but gets me through a waking day of heavy use. The mic is fine. The camera is woeful, but I didn't buy the phone to take snaps with. That might be one tradeoff too many for some people. Wifi, 4G and Bluetooth are solid. I've put a 128GB microSD card in and this works perfectly. Overall the device is convenient to use, pocketable and very usable. The fingerprint sensor is fast and reliable. I like the old-skool aesthetic of the device. /e/ OS comes with MicroG and no Google apps. To me, this is the main selling point of /e/. I've been working for years to disentangle my life from Google. The biggest steps I'd made prior to buying the Fairphone were to move my email account to Gandi and my documents, photos, calendar, contacts, map bookmarks, RSS feeds and everything else to a self-hosted Nextcloud instance. And here's where /e/ really, really shines. When I switched on the phone for the first time, instead of signing up for an /e/ account, I entered the URL, username and password of my account on my Nextcloud instance. After a few moments, my calendar, contacts and data were synched to the phone or available to browse. I can't describe what a feeling of pure delight and freedom that gave me. This is a device that acts in my interests. I've since piled a bunch of telemetry-laden Android apps onto the phone, but at least when I'm at home (which I am a lot these days) the telemetry can be mitigated by the Pi-Hole on my network. What's remarkable is how well they all work; even apps that I expected to fail - like my banking app, Audible, Netflix, RSA Token, Skype - all work perfectly. I've downloaded them from one of three places: the /e/ app store (where apps are graded with privacy and energy ratings), F-Droid and the Aurora Store. The one necessary app that doesn't work is Microsoft Authenticator, which I need for work SSO 2FA. I almost picked up a Nokia Lumia running Windows phone 10 for €30 just to run that! For now an ancient Nexus 9 stays charged to provide the second factor when I need it. I'll start a conversation with work to see what free alternatives they'll consider. There's no more casting to the Chromecast; I'm watching the Nymphcast project with interest. LibreELEC and DLNA are local streaming alternatives. So, all in all am I very happy with my purchase. The tradeoffs I have to make are more than acceptable to me. Yes, I would make the same purchase again. My old Huawei Mate 10 Pro is getting a system reset, going into its original box and on to a secondhand goods site. I haven't looked at it for weeks. Finally, I've already received an OS update in the few weeks I've had it. It's now midnight and I have 39% battery left.
pengaru 6y ago
> but the hardware being used is far from that philosophy (Although Purism team seem to have taken great effort in choosing vendors). Far from that philosophy? How so? Unless we're talking about them not being entirely open hardware with downloadable KiCAD files for reproducing the devices ourselves, I don't get the impression they're significantly worse than your average Linux-supported laptop, outside the baseband. The Mnt Reform is the only machine on my radar that strives to be completely open, is the FairPhone on that level? https://www.pine64.org/2020/01/24/setting-the-record-straight-pinephone-misconceptions/ https://www.pine64.org/2020/01/24/setting-the-record-straigh...

garysahota93 6y ago

This is amazing! I used to flash custom roms on phones back in college 5+ years ago, which was awesome. Would even charge friends for it. I think there's something here & makes me want to buy the Fairphone 3 even more now.

jbverschoor 6y ago

iOS 13 is supported on a 2015 device, the iPhone 6S

fgeiger 6y ago
Apple does a much better job in keeping devices alive for longer than Android OEMs in general. Having full control over hardware and software and focusing on few devices helps there. In Android land, this is unfortunately different. Longevity stands and falls (mostly the latter) with the (lack of) support of the chipset vendors such as Qualcomm and Mediatek. If they stop supporting a chipset, all devices built on them can not be properly supported anymore. Just think of all of the unreported and unfixed hardware and software vulnerabilities in proprietary components. It is impossible to maintain a device without the chipset vendor's involvement. Apple, on the other hand, is its own chipset vendor. The Android supply chain needs a drastic make-over to come anywhere near that.
- ryukafalz 6y ago
  I really think the only way forward long-term is to build on hardware with mainlined drivers. This is so far outside the norm in the mobile ecosystem though that it's a huge uphill battle to get something working even passably. Purism and Pine64 have made great strides in that regard though.

bserge 6y ago

Thanks to the mentioned LineageOS team (and many other developers at XDA forums) this otherwise "enormous undertaking" is relatively easy. Android 9 works flawlessly on many SD 801 devices. I believe it's the last version of Android to see such active development on this 32-bit SoC. I've just installed it on my old HTC (which was also stuck at Android 5 and apps last updated ~2 years ago, even the autocorrect stopped working), and it's surprisingly usable. Increasing the minimum CPU frequency and boost time makes it feel much snappier, and everything works as it should, even Google Assistant with hotword activation. Some overclocking should provide even better performance, but it would likely need a new battery.

fgeiger 6y ago
Fairphone employee here. > Thanks to the mentioned LineageOS team (and many other developers at XDA forums) this otherwise "enormous undertaking" is relatively easy. You would think so. In fact, we also thought so, when we had started our work on Android 7 for the same device a while ago. Unfortunately, it shows that Lineage OS is by and for tech enthusiasts. There are several issues that break using this for production devices. There are a lot of stability issues that that the regular Lineage users put up with because they care more about the control they get than stability. However, the same instability is prohibitive for releasing this to regular less tech-savvy users. The worst problem, however, is that the Lineage OS community only develops and tests with "userdebug" builds. Unfortunately, regular "user" builds don't even compile and if they do, they do not run properly. That has huge security implications (SE Linux rules, root access, etc) that we could not ignore. That being said, having the work of the Lineage OS community available did give us a leg up. Open Source is great.
- Vinnl 6y ago
  Thanks for your work on keeping up maintenance of the Fairphone 2! And of having made Fairphone Open available on it; I know usage is probably not high enough to make it happen for the Fairphone 3, but with Fairphone Open available I had no reason at all to consider Lineage, and the peace of mind it gives me is way beyond what I expected when I first installed it.