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I found this article utterly baffling. The author clearly knows their stuff, having created Fira Code, but my experiences couldn't be more different. I spe

I found this article utterly baffling. The author clearly knows their stuff, having created Fira Code, but my experiences couldn't be more different. I spend most of my days in a text browser, text editor and text terminal, looking at barely moving letters. So I optimize my setup to showing really, really good letters. I certainly appreciate how nice text looks on a high DPI display. But for coding purposes!? I don't find high DPI text more legible... unless we're talking really tiny font sizes, smaller than just about anybody would ever use for coding. And there's a big "screen real estate" penalty with high DPI displays and 2X scaling. As the author notes, this leaves you with something like 1440×900 or 1920x1080 of logical real estate. Neither of which is remotely suitable for development work IMO. But at least you can enjoy that gorgeous screen and pixel-crisp fonts. Otherwise, why would you buy a retina screen at all? It's not like you really have the option on Macs and many other higher-end laptops these days. And I am buying a computer to do some work, not admire the beautiful curves of a nice crisp font. So anyway, for me, I chose the Dell 3818. 38", 3840 x 1600 of glorious, low-resolution text. A coder's paradise. For purposes of software development, I won't really be interested until 8K displays become affordable and feasible. As the author notes, they integer scale perfectly to 2560×1440. Now that would rock.

JohnBooty 6y ago
What's with the downvotes? HN is turning into Slashdot or Reddit, and that's not a good thing. I clearly stated my point. Maybe you disagree. However, the downvote button is not a "disagree" button. It's for posts that actively detract from the discussion. We need some kind of meta-moderation to ensure frivolous downvoters lose their downvote privileges.
- ascar 6y ago
  I personally agree that the downvote button should be reserved for low quality comments rather than disagreement and that the diverse and high-quality comments are what makes this site and community awesome. Unfortunately neither the FAQ nor the Guidelines state anything about how to use the vote buttons. So how should HN users know when to use them? Is there even consent anymore (or ever has been?) that downvotes should not be used for disagreement? How did I form the opinion that downvotes should be reserved for low quality rather than disagreement? Somehow along the lines of contributing enough to this site to reach enough karma to downvote. Maybe the guidelines should add a section on how to vote. On the other hand, how can this really be enforced? It's a sad thing. I also stopped posting opinions that might trigger disagreement from a large majority. However, the guidlines clearly state: > Please don't post comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. It's a semi-noob illusion, as old as the hills. [1] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - nkurz 6y ago
    > So how should HN users know when to use them? It's not authoritative, and I don't know dang's feelings on the matter, but it's probably worth noting that long ago the founder of the site clearly stated that it was acceptable to use downvoting to express disagreement: pg: I think it's ok to use the up and down arrows to express agreement. Obviously the uparrows aren't only for applauding politeness, so it seems reasonable that the downarrows aren't only for booing rudeness. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=117171 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=117171
    - nkurz 6y ago
      For completeness, here's the primary moderator 'dang' very explicitly confirming that downvoting for disagreement is still allowed at least as of 2 years ago: dang: Downvoting for disagreement has always been ok on HN. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17666145 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17666145
      - JohnBooty 6y ago
        That's an awful policy. I don't care about the imaginary internet points, but it doesn't take many downvotes to bury/kill/whatever a post. If a few early responders "downvote disagree" then nobody will ever see it. It's almost as if they thought, "How can we best encourage groupthink?" and this was the answer.
        nkurz 6y ago
        And yet, years after Dan took over as moderator, and over a decade after Paul posted his comment, the site is still going strong, and arguably is one of the best places for discussion on the internet. There is clearly a tension between allowing people to "bury" unfavorable opinions and denying them the ability to express themselves at all, but somehow it mostly works. One thing I'd recommend, if you haven't done so already, is to at least occasionally browse with "Showdead" turned on (accessible through your profile link in the upper right). The majority of the things that are dead deserve to be, but the others can often be rescued by vouching for them. It also may help if you think of voting as "rearranging the page" rather than killing an opinion. The opinions are still there for those who wish to upvote them, they are just at the bottom. Like the dead comments, most of the things greyed out at the bottom deserve to be there---but the rest one can try to rescue with an upvote.
santoshalper 6y ago
Legibility is a funny thing. When you're paying attention, your standards for legibility will be very low. I was totally happy to read text on a 1024x768 17" MAG monitor for years. When you're paying attention to something else, like designing the code you are about to type, I think crispness and clarity of text absolutely matters. Microsoft Research did a lot of work on this when they released ClearType. They seemed to believe strongly that clearer text measurably improved speed to recognize characters.
ascar 6y ago
Well, it's really about personal preference and while I know a couple of collegues with your preference, I feel it's the minority. I take two 16:9 screens over one 3840x1600 screen anytime. No need to setup some additional inner-mintor split-window management. Split-monitor management and workspaces works very well and I can even turn the 2nd monitor off, when I don't need it and want full focus mode (i.e. reading). Also I prefer my main monitor exactly in the middle in front of me and an actual 2nd monitor to the right. If I have the luxury of a 3rd monitor, it's to the left (usually the laptop that powers the 2 big screens). Setting one half of an ultra-wide in the middle just feels wrong. And splitting in 3 is too small for me and again the inner-monitor window management issue. While I also strongly believed my old 1920x1080 24" (~92ppi) screens were good, I had the opportunity to use qhd 27" (~110ppi) screens for 3 months abroad and I was baffled when going home how incredibly bad text looked on my old 24" monitors.
- slg 6y ago
  The benefit of a 3840x1600 screen over two monitors with lower resolution is that 3840/2 = 1920 and 3840/3 = 1280. Those are horizontal resolutions for 1080p and 720p respectively. The fact that these are standard resolutions means basically every app works as designed regardless of whether you have 2 or 3 windows side by side. This isn't true for ultrawides with resolutions like 3440x1440 that don't divide cleanly into other standard resolutions. The default software that comes with the Dell mentioned above handles everything. If I want to simulate two 1080p monitors, I just do the standards Windows drag to the side of the screen. If I want to simulate three 720p monitors I can press shift while dragging and that tells the Dell software to take over. It is more versatile than having individual monitors.
  - WorldMaker 6y ago
    That Dell tool sounds a lot like Microsoft's PowerTool FancyZones. Have you tried FancyZones? It can optionally take over the Win+Left/Right shortcuts from Aero snap (the drag to side/quadrants tool built into Windows). I've been drooling over the Samsung curved ultra-wides since like January as a possibility for my gaming desktop. In March one of my gaming desktop's monitors blew so I've been done to just one monitor and started to use FancyZones and regular usage of FancyZones has got me much more convinced I'd be happy with the ultra-wide, now I'm just hesitant for merely financial reasons.
robertoandred 6y ago
Blurry, pixellated text is not a coder's paradise.
- JohnBooty 6y ago
  I'm in my 40s and my eyes aren't great. But I have zero issues with legibility on the non-high-DPI Dell 38". Depending on font choice (typically I use Input Mono Compressed) I can fit six or seven 80x100 text windows side-by-side on the Dell with excellent legibility. That is up to 800 total lines of code and/or terminal output on my screen at once. That really is my idea of coder's paradise. You, of course, are entitled to your own idea. No two coders like the same thing. Ever.
_ph_ 6y ago
That Dell would be the screen I would buy right now for coding. I am currently using a 5k iMac at home and a 30" Dell (2560x1600) at work. I really loved the resolution of the iMac, but for my work, I need screen estate. The font rendering on the 30" at 1x scaling is good enough, and having a lot of screen estate is essential for me. Having 50% more horizontal space would of course be great :). The new 32" Apple display would be great of course, but the price is just off. For coding, I don't care how much reference quality the color setup is. My only hope is, that Dell soon offers an affordable display based on that panel.
- JohnBooty 6y ago
  I definitely have zero regrets about the Dell. Some of the best money I've ever spent. Depending on font choice (typically I use Input Mono Compressed) I can fit six or seven 80x100 text windows side-by-side on the Dell with excellent legibility. I can't imagine anybody justifying the cost of that 32" Apple display for coding either. I can't even imagine many high-end creative professionals justifying that. I mean, on one hand... if a person figures they'll get 5+ years out of that Apple monitor and they work 5 days per week... that's less than $4/workday for a $5,000 monitor. From that perspective it's somewhat reasonable. But most people would probably get more benefit from picking a $1000 monitor and spending that $4000 elsewhere.
  - ithkuil 6y ago
    Which model is "that dell"?
    - _ph_ 6y ago
      The Dell 3818 the parent poster named.
  - _ph_ 6y ago
    The funny thing is, I would even think about the 32" Apple display, if Apple made a computer to go with it. But the new Mac Pro at the entry price is 2x of its predecessor and really not a great computer at the entry level specs. It is amazing fully loaded, but I would rather get a Tesla :p. Not sure how well the 32" Apple is supported by Linux :).
chill8 6y ago
Do you use it with Windows or MacOS? If it's Mac, do you experience any compatibility issues? I was researching quite a bit into this Dell 38" in the last few days and discovered that it does not have official Mac support, and it seems to have some issues with the USB-C connection.

JohnBooty 6y ago

What's with the downvotes? HN is turning into Slashdot or Reddit, and that's not a good thing. I clearly stated my point. Maybe you disagree. However, the downvote button is not a "disagree" button. It's for posts that actively detract from the discussion. We need some kind of meta-moderation to ensure frivolous downvoters lose their downvote privileges.

ascar 6y ago
I personally agree that the downvote button should be reserved for low quality comments rather than disagreement and that the diverse and high-quality comments are what makes this site and community awesome. Unfortunately neither the FAQ nor the Guidelines state anything about how to use the vote buttons. So how should HN users know when to use them? Is there even consent anymore (or ever has been?) that downvotes should not be used for disagreement? How did I form the opinion that downvotes should be reserved for low quality rather than disagreement? Somehow along the lines of contributing enough to this site to reach enough karma to downvote. Maybe the guidelines should add a section on how to vote. On the other hand, how can this really be enforced? It's a sad thing. I also stopped posting opinions that might trigger disagreement from a large majority. However, the guidlines clearly state: > Please don't post comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. It's a semi-noob illusion, as old as the hills. [1] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- nkurz 6y ago
  > So how should HN users know when to use them? It's not authoritative, and I don't know dang's feelings on the matter, but it's probably worth noting that long ago the founder of the site clearly stated that it was acceptable to use downvoting to express disagreement: pg: I think it's ok to use the up and down arrows to express agreement. Obviously the uparrows aren't only for applauding politeness, so it seems reasonable that the downarrows aren't only for booing rudeness. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=117171 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=117171
  - nkurz 6y ago
    For completeness, here's the primary moderator 'dang' very explicitly confirming that downvoting for disagreement is still allowed at least as of 2 years ago: dang: Downvoting for disagreement has always been ok on HN. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17666145 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17666145
    - JohnBooty 6y ago
      That's an awful policy. I don't care about the imaginary internet points, but it doesn't take many downvotes to bury/kill/whatever a post. If a few early responders "downvote disagree" then nobody will ever see it. It's almost as if they thought, "How can we best encourage groupthink?" and this was the answer.
      - nkurz 6y ago
        And yet, years after Dan took over as moderator, and over a decade after Paul posted his comment, the site is still going strong, and arguably is one of the best places for discussion on the internet. There is clearly a tension between allowing people to "bury" unfavorable opinions and denying them the ability to express themselves at all, but somehow it mostly works. One thing I'd recommend, if you haven't done so already, is to at least occasionally browse with "Showdead" turned on (accessible through your profile link in the upper right). The majority of the things that are dead deserve to be, but the others can often be rescued by vouching for them. It also may help if you think of voting as "rearranging the page" rather than killing an opinion. The opinions are still there for those who wish to upvote them, they are just at the bottom. Like the dead comments, most of the things greyed out at the bottom deserve to be there---but the rest one can try to rescue with an upvote.

santoshalper 6y ago

Legibility is a funny thing. When you're paying attention, your standards for legibility will be very low. I was totally happy to read text on a 1024x768 17" MAG monitor for years. When you're paying attention to something else, like designing the code you are about to type, I think crispness and clarity of text absolutely matters. Microsoft Research did a lot of work on this when they released ClearType. They seemed to believe strongly that clearer text measurably improved speed to recognize characters.

ascar 6y ago

Well, it's really about personal preference and while I know a couple of collegues with your preference, I feel it's the minority. I take two 16:9 screens over one 3840x1600 screen anytime. No need to setup some additional inner-mintor split-window management. Split-monitor management and workspaces works very well and I can even turn the 2nd monitor off, when I don't need it and want full focus mode (i.e. reading). Also I prefer my main monitor exactly in the middle in front of me and an actual 2nd monitor to the right. If I have the luxury of a 3rd monitor, it's to the left (usually the laptop that powers the 2 big screens). Setting one half of an ultra-wide in the middle just feels wrong. And splitting in 3 is too small for me and again the inner-monitor window management issue. While I also strongly believed my old 1920x1080 24" (~92ppi) screens were good, I had the opportunity to use qhd 27" (~110ppi) screens for 3 months abroad and I was baffled when going home how incredibly bad text looked on my old 24" monitors.

slg 6y ago
The benefit of a 3840x1600 screen over two monitors with lower resolution is that 3840/2 = 1920 and 3840/3 = 1280. Those are horizontal resolutions for 1080p and 720p respectively. The fact that these are standard resolutions means basically every app works as designed regardless of whether you have 2 or 3 windows side by side. This isn't true for ultrawides with resolutions like 3440x1440 that don't divide cleanly into other standard resolutions. The default software that comes with the Dell mentioned above handles everything. If I want to simulate two 1080p monitors, I just do the standards Windows drag to the side of the screen. If I want to simulate three 720p monitors I can press shift while dragging and that tells the Dell software to take over. It is more versatile than having individual monitors.
- WorldMaker 6y ago
  That Dell tool sounds a lot like Microsoft's PowerTool FancyZones. Have you tried FancyZones? It can optionally take over the Win+Left/Right shortcuts from Aero snap (the drag to side/quadrants tool built into Windows). I've been drooling over the Samsung curved ultra-wides since like January as a possibility for my gaming desktop. In March one of my gaming desktop's monitors blew so I've been done to just one monitor and started to use FancyZones and regular usage of FancyZones has got me much more convinced I'd be happy with the ultra-wide, now I'm just hesitant for merely financial reasons.

robertoandred 6y ago

Blurry, pixellated text is not a coder's paradise.

JohnBooty 6y ago
I'm in my 40s and my eyes aren't great. But I have zero issues with legibility on the non-high-DPI Dell 38". Depending on font choice (typically I use Input Mono Compressed) I can fit six or seven 80x100 text windows side-by-side on the Dell with excellent legibility. That is up to 800 total lines of code and/or terminal output on my screen at once. That really is my idea of coder's paradise. You, of course, are entitled to your own idea. No two coders like the same thing. Ever.

_ph_ 6y ago

That Dell would be the screen I would buy right now for coding. I am currently using a 5k iMac at home and a 30" Dell (2560x1600) at work. I really loved the resolution of the iMac, but for my work, I need screen estate. The font rendering on the 30" at 1x scaling is good enough, and having a lot of screen estate is essential for me. Having 50% more horizontal space would of course be great :). The new 32" Apple display would be great of course, but the price is just off. For coding, I don't care how much reference quality the color setup is. My only hope is, that Dell soon offers an affordable display based on that panel.

JohnBooty 6y ago
I definitely have zero regrets about the Dell. Some of the best money I've ever spent. Depending on font choice (typically I use Input Mono Compressed) I can fit six or seven 80x100 text windows side-by-side on the Dell with excellent legibility. I can't imagine anybody justifying the cost of that 32" Apple display for coding either. I can't even imagine many high-end creative professionals justifying that. I mean, on one hand... if a person figures they'll get 5+ years out of that Apple monitor and they work 5 days per week... that's less than $4/workday for a $5,000 monitor. From that perspective it's somewhat reasonable. But most people would probably get more benefit from picking a $1000 monitor and spending that $4000 elsewhere.
- ithkuil 6y ago
  Which model is "that dell"?
  - _ph_ 6y ago
    The Dell 3818 the parent poster named.
- _ph_ 6y ago
  The funny thing is, I would even think about the 32" Apple display, if Apple made a computer to go with it. But the new Mac Pro at the entry price is 2x of its predecessor and really not a great computer at the entry level specs. It is amazing fully loaded, but I would rather get a Tesla :p. Not sure how well the 32" Apple is supported by Linux :).

chill8 6y ago

Do you use it with Windows or MacOS? If it's Mac, do you experience any compatibility issues? I was researching quite a bit into this Dell 38" in the last few days and discovered that it does not have official Mac support, and it seems to have some issues with the USB-C connection.