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As a consumer I mostly agree BUT no one forces me to pay for anything, so I avoid dodgy sites. As a developer of an app that is in IAP hell right now I disagre

As a consumer I mostly agree BUT no one forces me to pay for anything, so I avoid dodgy sites. As a developer of an app that is in IAP hell right now I disagree. I don't care for the app store, nor does it provide me with any benefit. All I want is for my existing customers, for who I spent MY marketing money to acquire, to be able to install my app on a device THEY paid money for.

Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
As a consumer in China you can't use an app that doesn't conform to the rules set by CCP. Sideloading is a must. And push notifications must work for sideloaded apps, too. If apple doesn't provide that, devices should have ways to install alternative push providers. All that keeps that from happening is the extreme closeness of iOS
- Bud 6y ago
  13 years of the iPhone being the most popular consumer product in the history of the universe would seem to suggest that sideloading is not "a must"; indeed, some might say it suggests the opposite: that sideloading is in fact a huge plus and part of why the ecosystem is succeeding so well and users' security and stability of their devices is so superior to competing products.
  - MereInterest 6y ago
    Fine. Installing custom software is not an economic "must", but is a moral "must". If I have bought a device, then it is mine to run whatever software I want on it, and the manufacturer of the device has no moral claim over it.
    - Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
      To me it's just a monopoly abusing its position.
      - ajconway 6y ago
        But Apple is not a monopoly.
        Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
        Yeah right. Just today's search in DDG news for 'apple monopoly': https://duckduckgo.com/?q=apple+monopoly&atb=v194-1&iar=news&ia=news https://duckduckgo.com/?q=apple+monopoly&atb=v194-1&iar=news...
    - criddell 6y ago
      If you agree to not side-load software via some EULA, does that change the moral calculus for you?
  - Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
    iPhone is in no way superior to competing products. It can't even run an SSH terminal in a background app! As for success, some slaves do seem to love their chains, if they are shiny enough.
    - criddell 6y ago
      That's like saying a Camry is better than a Ferrari because it has more cup holders.
      - Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
        Actually, Camry is better because it is a car that you can actually drive where I live, unlike Ferrari. However, car metaphors aside, my work requires apps that maintain persistent connection with server. When I carry a supercomputer in my pocket that can totally outperform my PC from 1993 by a factor of 500x or more, I kinda expect it to be able perform basic computing tasks that it is perfectly capable of, hardware-wise. And the only reason I can't is because Apple forbids me, styling it as 'care' about my battery life.
        criddell 6y ago
        Do you think about your phone differently than a gaming console or a DVR?
criddell 6y ago
> I don't care for the app store, nor does it provide me with any benefit. I'm guessing it does provide you with some benefit or else you wouldn't be in it.
- grishka 6y ago
  Well, I mean, you could consider having a presence on iOS a "benefit"? You either go through the app store or you don't have an iOS app — there isn't a third option.
- corkmask 6y ago
  I am in the app store because my customers demanded an app. If I had a way to deliver one similar to android I would stay tf away.

Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago

As a consumer in China you can't use an app that doesn't conform to the rules set by CCP. Sideloading is a must. And push notifications must work for sideloaded apps, too. If apple doesn't provide that, devices should have ways to install alternative push providers. All that keeps that from happening is the extreme closeness of iOS

Bud 6y ago
13 years of the iPhone being the most popular consumer product in the history of the universe would seem to suggest that sideloading is not "a must"; indeed, some might say it suggests the opposite: that sideloading is in fact a huge plus and part of why the ecosystem is succeeding so well and users' security and stability of their devices is so superior to competing products.
- MereInterest 6y ago
  Fine. Installing custom software is not an economic "must", but is a moral "must". If I have bought a device, then it is mine to run whatever software I want on it, and the manufacturer of the device has no moral claim over it.
  - Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
    To me it's just a monopoly abusing its position.
    - ajconway 6y ago
      But Apple is not a monopoly.
      - Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
        Yeah right. Just today's search in DDG news for 'apple monopoly': https://duckduckgo.com/?q=apple+monopoly&atb=v194-1&iar=news&ia=news https://duckduckgo.com/?q=apple+monopoly&atb=v194-1&iar=news...
  - criddell 6y ago
    If you agree to not side-load software via some EULA, does that change the moral calculus for you?
- Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
  iPhone is in no way superior to competing products. It can't even run an SSH terminal in a background app! As for success, some slaves do seem to love their chains, if they are shiny enough.
  - criddell 6y ago
    That's like saying a Camry is better than a Ferrari because it has more cup holders.
    - Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
      Actually, Camry is better because it is a car that you can actually drive where I live, unlike Ferrari. However, car metaphors aside, my work requires apps that maintain persistent connection with server. When I carry a supercomputer in my pocket that can totally outperform my PC from 1993 by a factor of 500x or more, I kinda expect it to be able perform basic computing tasks that it is perfectly capable of, hardware-wise. And the only reason I can't is because Apple forbids me, styling it as 'care' about my battery life.
      - criddell 6y ago
        Do you think about your phone differently than a gaming console or a DVR?

criddell 6y ago

> I don't care for the app store, nor does it provide me with any benefit. I'm guessing it does provide you with some benefit or else you wouldn't be in it.

grishka 6y ago
Well, I mean, you could consider having a presence on iOS a "benefit"? You either go through the app store or you don't have an iOS app — there isn't a third option.
corkmask 6y ago
I am in the app store because my customers demanded an app. If I had a way to deliver one similar to android I would stay tf away.