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I cannot write applications for the Xbox, Playstation or Switch without going through their manufacturers and paying them a part of my revenue. In the mean time

I cannot write applications for the Xbox, Playstation or Switch without going through their manufacturers and paying them a part of my revenue. In the mean time, Sony and Microsoft and Nintendo have their own studios as well. Their stores are also curated and gated. If I want an open gaming device I take a PC. If I want a more open phone, I take an Android. Is this different than the situation with iPhone? (Sidenote: I can put whatever I want on my iPhone using Xcode)

ReptileMan 6y ago
I think it is different because gaming consoles are single purpose devices. Whereas smartphones are marketed as general purpose. I am all for forcing the manufacturers of the gaming consoles to allow running of arbitrary unsigned code in a different sandbox than their DRM. Also I believe in the right to have root on all devices you have.
- izacus 6y ago
  Interesting how being allowed to run your own software is now a downvotable opinion here on HN.
  - messe 6y ago
    I can't understand why that comment is being downvoted. It's a constructive comment, featuring an opinion that I would have genuinely thought would be well supported on HN.
- AnthonyMouse 6y ago
  > I think it is different because gaming consoles are single purpose devices. Gaming consoles aren't single purpose devices. They're still general purpose computers. The only thing that makes them "single purpose" is the manufacturer restrictions on what you can install on them, which shouldn't be allowed any more than it is for Apple.
  - swiley 6y ago
    On principle I agree with you, it should be easy for me to reflash the firmware on my oven or car because they’re both running software. In practice I think there’s a significant difference between the restrictions on smartphone software vs entertainment system software making your point part of a slightly different (but related and important) conversation.
    - AnthonyMouse 6y ago
      > In practice I think there’s a significant difference between the restrictions on smartphone software vs entertainment system software Such as?
brmgb 6y ago
It is not particularly different, no and it's not difficult to find a discussion where video game producers complain about publishing costs. It's generally aimed at Steam. Apple is being investigated here because: - Spotify and Rakuten formally complained about the store; - some banks formally complained about Apple Pay; - they are the biggest. A condamnation of Apple here would most likely have significant implications for app publishing as a whole. Something I personally applaud.
- rahkiin 6y ago
  I am not against more access to the phone, as long as it is a completely manual opt in. I don't want to download apps from the web browser. And I don't want banks or any other company to say: 'we require you to use our app, and we also require you to do that outside the App Store and thus make your own phone unsafe'. As long as things don't get worse for some, I am fine with it getting better for others. I am not sure that can be the case though.
izacus 6y ago
A gaming console isn't a payment device, news reading device, web browsing device and it certanly doesn't end up in hands of as many people as iPhones do. There's a staggering difference of scale and thus influence on free market when Apple throws its weight around. They decide to kill of whole companies of dozens of economic sectors and curbing such power is why anti-monopoly laws were created.
dzonga 6y ago
remember, you can buy xbox games via disk. not all games have to be via the store. independent publishers have a way to get you those games without going through microsoft. something you can't do with apple. and don't get started me with browsers. how can a user with 400+$ device, not be able to choose their own browser. n by the way, was an iOS dev, before I got enlightened that the browser is the only way
- einr 6y ago
  remember, you can buy xbox games via disk. not all games have to be via the store. independent publishers have a way to get you those games without going through microsoft. The Xbox is a closed system that will only run approved and signed code. Whether it is on a disc or a digital download is irrelevant. You can only publish Xbox discs if you are approved by Microsoft, go through their system and pay their fees. If you somehow found a way to circumvent the DRM and published discs with Xbox compatible games 1) you would be sued into oblivion and 2) Microsoft would immediately push updates to the OS that would disable your games from working.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

ReptileMan 6y ago

I think it is different because gaming consoles are single purpose devices. Whereas smartphones are marketed as general purpose. I am all for forcing the manufacturers of the gaming consoles to allow running of arbitrary unsigned code in a different sandbox than their DRM. Also I believe in the right to have root on all devices you have.

izacus 6y ago
Interesting how being allowed to run your own software is now a downvotable opinion here on HN.
- messe 6y ago
  I can't understand why that comment is being downvoted. It's a constructive comment, featuring an opinion that I would have genuinely thought would be well supported on HN.
AnthonyMouse 6y ago
> I think it is different because gaming consoles are single purpose devices. Gaming consoles aren't single purpose devices. They're still general purpose computers. The only thing that makes them "single purpose" is the manufacturer restrictions on what you can install on them, which shouldn't be allowed any more than it is for Apple.
- swiley 6y ago
  On principle I agree with you, it should be easy for me to reflash the firmware on my oven or car because they’re both running software. In practice I think there’s a significant difference between the restrictions on smartphone software vs entertainment system software making your point part of a slightly different (but related and important) conversation.
  - AnthonyMouse 6y ago
    > In practice I think there’s a significant difference between the restrictions on smartphone software vs entertainment system software Such as?

brmgb 6y ago

It is not particularly different, no and it's not difficult to find a discussion where video game producers complain about publishing costs. It's generally aimed at Steam. Apple is being investigated here because: - Spotify and Rakuten formally complained about the store; - some banks formally complained about Apple Pay; - they are the biggest. A condamnation of Apple here would most likely have significant implications for app publishing as a whole. Something I personally applaud.

rahkiin 6y ago
I am not against more access to the phone, as long as it is a completely manual opt in. I don't want to download apps from the web browser. And I don't want banks or any other company to say: 'we require you to use our app, and we also require you to do that outside the App Store and thus make your own phone unsafe'. As long as things don't get worse for some, I am fine with it getting better for others. I am not sure that can be the case though.

izacus 6y ago

A gaming console isn't a payment device, news reading device, web browsing device and it certanly doesn't end up in hands of as many people as iPhones do. There's a staggering difference of scale and thus influence on free market when Apple throws its weight around. They decide to kill of whole companies of dozens of economic sectors and curbing such power is why anti-monopoly laws were created.

dzonga 6y ago

remember, you can buy xbox games via disk. not all games have to be via the store. independent publishers have a way to get you those games without going through microsoft. something you can't do with apple. and don't get started me with browsers. how can a user with 400+$ device, not be able to choose their own browser. n by the way, was an iOS dev, before I got enlightened that the browser is the only way

einr 6y ago
remember, you can buy xbox games via disk. not all games have to be via the store. independent publishers have a way to get you those games without going through microsoft. The Xbox is a closed system that will only run approved and signed code. Whether it is on a disc or a digital download is irrelevant. You can only publish Xbox discs if you are approved by Microsoft, go through their system and pay their fees. If you somehow found a way to circumvent the DRM and published discs with Xbox compatible games 1) you would be sued into oblivion and 2) Microsoft would immediately push updates to the OS that would disable your games from working.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]