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> told to destroy the blueprints What on earth compelled them to order that? That's just so barbaric. As if they were trying to destroy evidence of a crime. S
by tromp 6y ago
> told to destroy the blueprints
What on earth compelled them to order that? That's just so barbaric. As if they were trying to destroy evidence of a crime.
Surely it makes more sense to preserve them?!
You might even try to sell or license the design to recover some of the $250m invested?
- kstenerud 6y agoWhen you live next to a giant, you do what the giant says.
- TMWNN 6y agoYou didn't read the article, which explicitly disclaims against conspiracy theories of the US ordering the Arrow's cancelation.
- gandalfian 6y agoWhat on earth compelled them to order that? To stop someone trying to reverse the decision and restart the program? Guns or butter, it may have not been the worse choice.
- andromeduck 6y agoYup, same reason why all the plans and tooling was torched for the Saturn V.
- Sanzig 6y agoThe Saturn V plans were not lost. NASA still has them at Marshall. https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/20302/were-the-saturn-v-construction-plans-destroyed https://space.stackexchange.com/questions/20302/were-the-sat...
- rurounijones 6y ago> told to destroy the blueprints Same thing happened to the British TSR2; a program that shares a lot in common with the Avro Arrow. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAC_TSR-2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAC_TSR-2
- sidewndr46 6y agoMy understanding is they weren't actually destroyed, the order was given but not obeyed. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/saved-avro-arrow-blueprints-ordered-destroyed-1.5416554 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/saved-avro-arrow-bl...
- austhrow743 6y agoThe article we're commenting on specifically mentions the blueprints being saved.
- gpvos 6y agoThe question was why the order was given at all.
- BareNakedCoder 6y agoMy father was in the RCAF and was in the running to fly the Arrow if it was built (he did see prototypes). IIRC, he said the Americans wanted the designs destroyed because they feared the Canadians were not secure enough and so it might be stolen by the Soviets. It was during the coldest parts of the cold war after all.
- aerostable_slug 6y agoThis is the reason. One of my mentors was part of this effort; the Canadians were riddled with Soviet agents. EDIT: downvoted for facts. Here's a reference: But until then his assignment was to become Soboloff so convincingly that nobody would ever suspect he was a Soviet spy. Eventually, he was given responsibility for managing five recruited agents, including a Communist Party of Canada member from Toronto who worked for the company developing the Avro Arrow and provided its engineering schematics to the KGB. https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-spy-named-gideon-book-tells-story-of-russian-illegal-sent-to-canada-and-betrayed https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-spy-named-gideon-bo...
- jbay808 6y agoI wonder if Russia might have the best-preserved schematics now?
- coopsmgoops 6y agoAn engineer actually smuggled out a set of plans out. And it only recently came to light. The plans were being exhibited in Winnipeg (I think) just before this whole covid thing happened.
- bregma 6y agoDunno. Dief sold out the Canadian people and their heritage in return for... something....
- totalforge 6y agoFor US aerospace contracts, one of the standard provisions is the disposal and destruction of any remaining products and tooling. This is done for compliance with ITAR regs, to prevent advanced technical information from reaching other countries. No buying a booster prototype at auction for you! What was bizarre about (aboot) the Arrow program is that the entire company staff were fired, and the Canadian military was sent in to destroy all records, drawings, test data, and of course the destruction of the six flyable aircraft. The program was replaced with US made BOMARC missiles, so there's one clue.
- aerostable_slug 6y agoBecause the primary threat identified by American counterintelligence, correctly, was the cost of the Soviet Union taking the Canadian work and running with it (See, among others, agent LIND in the Mitrokhin Archive) was greater than any defense gain from the airplane. It is a backhanded compliment that the material was destroyed.