4 ms·

What bugs me about crap like this is that it ignores world history, makes these people feel good about doing nothing of consequence, and takes attention away fr

What bugs me about crap like this is that it ignores world history, makes these people feel good about doing nothing of consequence, and takes attention away from things that will actually help. If you are going to help, actually do something that improves the lives of people. Maybe, you should really put some effort into beefing up the Computer Science programs in black high schools and colleges? You are Microsoft, and had a damn policy of only hiring people from certain schools for certain job areas. In 90, one of your damn reps told a classroom of students that they were only good for "help desk" positions because of the school they went to. I'm betting some all black colleges were not on the hire list for actual developer jobs. Actually doing something useful is hard, this is just signalling how cool you are.

floatingatoll 6y ago
A small symbolic thing is still worth doing, even if it doesn't directly improve the lives of people.
- protomyth 6y ago
  No, no it isn't. If it doesn't actually help improve lives, its just an indulgence.
  - _never_k 6y ago
    Props to you for committing to your austerity, but we're not all monks in cells.
    - protomyth 6y ago
      Austerity? Monks in cells? Really, none of that makes any sense? Hell, switching your Amazon account to one of those smile accounts will do more good than signalling.
      - _never_k 6y ago
        >Austerity? Monks in cells? You're complaining about indulgence! You're saying that this change won't help people as much as something else. This is a fair criticism. Changing some technical term is probably not a optimally utilitarian use of resources. However, while you may be trying to live an optimally utilitarian life, the rest of us aren't. I can only speak for myself of course, but evaluating all my life's actions on only that axis is too strict for me. But, like I said, if you want to do that: props.
        protomyth 6y ago
        No, I'm saying that it won't help people at all. Its an indulgence to make the person doing feel like they are doing something. It will not materially improve lives. It would be fine if it just made them feel good, but it substitutes for efforts that would help. Its a personal indulgence taking energy from a system when more is needed. It also is a distraction from actual issues. Nothing is often better than something. > However, while you may be trying to live an optimally utilitarian life, the rest of us aren't. I can only speak for myself of course, but evaluating all my life's actions on only that axis is too strict for me. Yeah, this is wordplay that has nothing to do with me.
        _never_k 6y ago
        You keep complaining about indulging! What's wrong with indulging in something every once in while?
        protomyth 6y ago
        If your indulging hurts others, then it is something worth complaining about.
        _never_k 6y ago
        I don't exactly understand how you're hurt by this, but fair enough. Utilitarianism is a philosophical framework. It's not for me, but based on your comments you might be into it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism
- thinkingemote 6y ago
  This doesn't even indirectly improve things. What it does do is make a few people feel better because they are misinformed and so other things like education would be a better solution, something like "there's no need to feel bad about this word, and here's the logic about why."
- xellisx 6y ago
  And if you look at that it analogy of a tree, what is a "Master branch". Also what is a "Main branch". It's trunk. Of course then it would be called "The trunk branch", which sounds silly too me, and trunk has a couple sexual slangs tied to it. I read on person naming theirs 'prd', 'uat', and 'dev'. Less typing and describes what the branch is for.
  - humanrebar 6y ago
    While we're being pedantic, it's a graph, not a tree.
    - xellisx 6y ago
      So bar, line, pie, scatter, etc. would be good names. Hehe.
clint 6y ago
Little known fact: The single, and only thing being done right now to address systemic racism is github renaming the default branch to master. I wish people would do other stuff like March, and donate money, and goad corporations into donating millions of dollars to minority owned businesses, passing new laws that address historical abuses of power and the police state. But no. We've got 350 million people solely focused on getting this branch name changed. Its a huge waste!
- FriendlyNormie 6y ago
  Jump into the nearest woodchipper you redditor trash.
- shockinglytrue 6y ago
  Please review the HN community guidelines before posting something like this in future
Seb-C 6y ago
I understand that you are trying to be constructive, but I'm quite surprised by your use of "black high school" and "black colleges". Is it still a thing in the US? Wouldn't focusing on fixing this situation be more beneficial than reinforcing it?
- protomyth 6y ago
  I understand that you are trying to be constructive, but I'm quite surprised by your use of "black high school" and "black colleges". Is it still a thing in the US? Yes it is "still a thing". They are mentioned in legislation as Black Colleges. It was an extremely big deal this year when Black Colleges were successful in lobbying for Title III funding. In fact, they are listed officially as Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs). Native American's higher education institutions are referred to officially as Tribal Colleges and Universities (TCUs). Wouldn't focusing on fixing this situation be more beneficial than reinforcing it? So, yes, that is what they are referred to in legislation, so stop trying to imply someone is not using the right words. It really ticks me off when people wordsmith but don't bother actually engaging or knowing any of the history of the people they are being offended for. Maybe if you stopped implying racism where none exists, we would have a better world.
  - Seb-C 6y ago
    Wow, I did not expect so much aggressivity. Sorry if I hit some sensible point, but my question certainly did not aim to imply any kind of judgement. I am not american and never heard about a "black college" before. Are those words (along with the TCUs you mentioned) used for historical reasons, or is there still segregation (wether legally or de-facto)? The meaning of my second question was actually that I disagree that "beefing up the Computer Science programs in black high schools" will help much beyond a little short term relief. Efforts should focus about understanding and fixing the systemic problems, not the symptoms.
    - tracker1 6y ago
      They aren't systematically segregated, mostly by circumstance and clustering by identity group. People tend to cluster in like-cultured communities either by country of origin and/or racial identity. It's not an absolute, but there are communities that are overwhelmingly black, chinese, japanese, etc. Of course most of the real divides come down to income class, which is part of what should take an emphasis in terms of possible distribution of education funding.
tracker1 6y ago
I tend to bring this up in terms of hiring initiatives as well... if there are X% of people are of $identity Z in terms of the field in practice (let's say 20% female in software engineering). And a large company tries to hit 50% in hiring, they're actually reducing diversity across the industry. What they should be doing is scholarship and mentoring programs to increase the base if that is their real goal. But that takes actual effort and costs real money.

floatingatoll 6y ago

A small symbolic thing is still worth doing, even if it doesn't directly improve the lives of people.

protomyth 6y ago
No, no it isn't. If it doesn't actually help improve lives, its just an indulgence.
- _never_k 6y ago
  Props to you for committing to your austerity, but we're not all monks in cells.
  - protomyth 6y ago
    Austerity? Monks in cells? Really, none of that makes any sense? Hell, switching your Amazon account to one of those smile accounts will do more good than signalling.
    - _never_k 6y ago
      >Austerity? Monks in cells? You're complaining about indulgence! You're saying that this change won't help people as much as something else. This is a fair criticism. Changing some technical term is probably not a optimally utilitarian use of resources. However, while you may be trying to live an optimally utilitarian life, the rest of us aren't. I can only speak for myself of course, but evaluating all my life's actions on only that axis is too strict for me. But, like I said, if you want to do that: props.
      - protomyth 6y ago
        No, I'm saying that it won't help people at all. Its an indulgence to make the person doing feel like they are doing something. It will not materially improve lives. It would be fine if it just made them feel good, but it substitutes for efforts that would help. Its a personal indulgence taking energy from a system when more is needed. It also is a distraction from actual issues. Nothing is often better than something. > However, while you may be trying to live an optimally utilitarian life, the rest of us aren't. I can only speak for myself of course, but evaluating all my life's actions on only that axis is too strict for me. Yeah, this is wordplay that has nothing to do with me.
        _never_k 6y ago
        You keep complaining about indulging! What's wrong with indulging in something every once in while?
        protomyth 6y ago
        If your indulging hurts others, then it is something worth complaining about.
        _never_k 6y ago
        I don't exactly understand how you're hurt by this, but fair enough. Utilitarianism is a philosophical framework. It's not for me, but based on your comments you might be into it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism
thinkingemote 6y ago
This doesn't even indirectly improve things. What it does do is make a few people feel better because they are misinformed and so other things like education would be a better solution, something like "there's no need to feel bad about this word, and here's the logic about why."
xellisx 6y ago
And if you look at that it analogy of a tree, what is a "Master branch". Also what is a "Main branch". It's trunk. Of course then it would be called "The trunk branch", which sounds silly too me, and trunk has a couple sexual slangs tied to it. I read on person naming theirs 'prd', 'uat', and 'dev'. Less typing and describes what the branch is for.
- humanrebar 6y ago
  While we're being pedantic, it's a graph, not a tree.
  - xellisx 6y ago
    So bar, line, pie, scatter, etc. would be good names. Hehe.

clint 6y ago

Little known fact: The single, and only thing being done right now to address systemic racism is github renaming the default branch to master. I wish people would do other stuff like March, and donate money, and goad corporations into donating millions of dollars to minority owned businesses, passing new laws that address historical abuses of power and the police state. But no. We've got 350 million people solely focused on getting this branch name changed. Its a huge waste!

FriendlyNormie 6y ago
Jump into the nearest woodchipper you redditor trash.
shockinglytrue 6y ago
Please review the HN community guidelines before posting something like this in future

Seb-C 6y ago

I understand that you are trying to be constructive, but I'm quite surprised by your use of "black high school" and "black colleges". Is it still a thing in the US? Wouldn't focusing on fixing this situation be more beneficial than reinforcing it?

protomyth 6y ago
I understand that you are trying to be constructive, but I'm quite surprised by your use of "black high school" and "black colleges". Is it still a thing in the US? Yes it is "still a thing". They are mentioned in legislation as Black Colleges. It was an extremely big deal this year when Black Colleges were successful in lobbying for Title III funding. In fact, they are listed officially as Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs). Native American's higher education institutions are referred to officially as Tribal Colleges and Universities (TCUs). Wouldn't focusing on fixing this situation be more beneficial than reinforcing it? So, yes, that is what they are referred to in legislation, so stop trying to imply someone is not using the right words. It really ticks me off when people wordsmith but don't bother actually engaging or knowing any of the history of the people they are being offended for. Maybe if you stopped implying racism where none exists, we would have a better world.
- Seb-C 6y ago
  Wow, I did not expect so much aggressivity. Sorry if I hit some sensible point, but my question certainly did not aim to imply any kind of judgement. I am not american and never heard about a "black college" before. Are those words (along with the TCUs you mentioned) used for historical reasons, or is there still segregation (wether legally or de-facto)? The meaning of my second question was actually that I disagree that "beefing up the Computer Science programs in black high schools" will help much beyond a little short term relief. Efforts should focus about understanding and fixing the systemic problems, not the symptoms.
  - tracker1 6y ago
    They aren't systematically segregated, mostly by circumstance and clustering by identity group. People tend to cluster in like-cultured communities either by country of origin and/or racial identity. It's not an absolute, but there are communities that are overwhelmingly black, chinese, japanese, etc. Of course most of the real divides come down to income class, which is part of what should take an emphasis in terms of possible distribution of education funding.

tracker1 6y ago

I tend to bring this up in terms of hiring initiatives as well... if there are X% of people are of $identity Z in terms of the field in practice (let's say 20% female in software engineering). And a large company tries to hit 50% in hiring, they're actually reducing diversity across the industry. What they should be doing is scholarship and mentoring programs to increase the base if that is their real goal. But that takes actual effort and costs real money.