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Hitchens is one of the leading intellectuals of our time Sorry, I couldn't downmod that hard or fast enough. Hitchens is a warmed-over Trotskyist. The fact tha

Hitchens is one of the leading intellectuals of our time Sorry, I couldn't downmod that hard or fast enough. Hitchens is a warmed-over Trotskyist. The fact that he ever had doubts about water torture's status as torture should give you a clue into his mental state.

gruseom 18y ago
Really? I'm curious why you say that, and also why you think the two ("warmed-over Trotskyist" and "leading intellectual") must automatically be incompatible. I certainly don't admire him in every respect. But he changed a lot since 1968, and even then had an individualist streak that was a little deviant for the hard left. Edit (responding to your edit :)) - I don't know of any evidence that he doubted it before. I would guess the point of the experiment was more to be able to write about it from experience.
- mynameishere 18y ago
  I guess I've just recoiled against everything he's said. For a sample, look under the heading "On the 2003 invasion of Iraq". http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Christopher_Hitchens http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Christopher_Hitchens It doesn't warrant much elaboration. I mean, I, for one, will not have [the Vietcong] insulted by any comparison to the forces of Zarqawi, the Fedayeen Saddam, and the criminal underworld now arrayed against us. These depraved elements are the Iraqi Khmer Rouge. Well, whatever. The vietcong [1] are still great heroes to him, I suppose. Fine. But the motivations of ordinary men don't change from place to place, and the various arab defenders and the vietnamese communists are almost surely identical morally. His defense of the Iraqi war is pure mind-fuck. I'm not completely against the war, but I understand its grand strategic purpose: To secure vast and necessary oil reserves from encroachment by Russia and China (the latter has been securing incredible resources in Africa, for example. This is no small threat.) But what's his motivation?--it's impossible to say. He just seems inspired by dead ideology. [1] There was no shortage of atrocities or terrorist acts committed by the vietcong. I understand this as asymmetrical warfare. Hitchens understands this as good vs. evil. Specifically, good.
  - gruseom 18y ago
    It seems we share a distaste for ideologues. You just think Hitchens is more of one than I do. You could be right. Hitchens on the Iraq war is a little puzzling, I agree. I think it has perhaps more to do with his own evolution than with the matter as such. It's hard to imagine him supporting that war many years earlier. Anyway, as I said, I like his writing. Looking over that quote page you linked to, I ran across this quintessential statement, about Michael Moore: Europeans think Americans are fat, vulgar, greedy, stupid, ambitious and ignorant and so on. And they've taken as their own, as their representative American, someone who actually embodies all of those qualities. I just think that's brilliant. And it makes me laugh. Ok, now I'm really going to get flamed... I had better stop.
    - andreyf 18y ago
      Ok, now I'm really going to get flamed... I had better stop. He's a skillful writer, is very opinionated, and has a hobby of arguing well against fashionable opinion - Mother Teresa, for example. One person here likes him, another doesn't? That's not much of a shocker...
      - gruseom 18y ago
        No, I was expecting to get flamed because the discussion was political (enough), offensive (to somebody, surely), and not about startups or Google or Lisp. "Flamed" was hyperbolic. But I'm glad I was wrong.
gruseom 18y ago
Hitchens is one of the leading intellectuals of our time Funnily, after I turned my computer off and went to bed this line popped back into my head and I went, Wait a minute... I don't think that! I could care less about who is a "leading intellectual"! What does that even mean!? I hate platitudes! Noooooo... I was wrong on the internet... But the discussion was fun. K bye.

gruseom 18y ago

Really? I'm curious why you say that, and also why you think the two ("warmed-over Trotskyist" and "leading intellectual") must automatically be incompatible. I certainly don't admire him in every respect. But he changed a lot since 1968, and even then had an individualist streak that was a little deviant for the hard left. Edit (responding to your edit :)) - I don't know of any evidence that he doubted it before. I would guess the point of the experiment was more to be able to write about it from experience.

mynameishere 18y ago
I guess I've just recoiled against everything he's said. For a sample, look under the heading "On the 2003 invasion of Iraq". http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Christopher_Hitchens http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Christopher_Hitchens It doesn't warrant much elaboration. I mean, I, for one, will not have [the Vietcong] insulted by any comparison to the forces of Zarqawi, the Fedayeen Saddam, and the criminal underworld now arrayed against us. These depraved elements are the Iraqi Khmer Rouge. Well, whatever. The vietcong [1] are still great heroes to him, I suppose. Fine. But the motivations of ordinary men don't change from place to place, and the various arab defenders and the vietnamese communists are almost surely identical morally. His defense of the Iraqi war is pure mind-fuck. I'm not completely against the war, but I understand its grand strategic purpose: To secure vast and necessary oil reserves from encroachment by Russia and China (the latter has been securing incredible resources in Africa, for example. This is no small threat.) But what's his motivation?--it's impossible to say. He just seems inspired by dead ideology. [1] There was no shortage of atrocities or terrorist acts committed by the vietcong. I understand this as asymmetrical warfare. Hitchens understands this as good vs. evil. Specifically, good.
- gruseom 18y ago
  It seems we share a distaste for ideologues. You just think Hitchens is more of one than I do. You could be right. Hitchens on the Iraq war is a little puzzling, I agree. I think it has perhaps more to do with his own evolution than with the matter as such. It's hard to imagine him supporting that war many years earlier. Anyway, as I said, I like his writing. Looking over that quote page you linked to, I ran across this quintessential statement, about Michael Moore: Europeans think Americans are fat, vulgar, greedy, stupid, ambitious and ignorant and so on. And they've taken as their own, as their representative American, someone who actually embodies all of those qualities. I just think that's brilliant. And it makes me laugh. Ok, now I'm really going to get flamed... I had better stop.
  - andreyf 18y ago
    Ok, now I'm really going to get flamed... I had better stop. He's a skillful writer, is very opinionated, and has a hobby of arguing well against fashionable opinion - Mother Teresa, for example. One person here likes him, another doesn't? That's not much of a shocker...
    - gruseom 18y ago
      No, I was expecting to get flamed because the discussion was political (enough), offensive (to somebody, surely), and not about startups or Google or Lisp. "Flamed" was hyperbolic. But I'm glad I was wrong.

gruseom 18y ago

Hitchens is one of the leading intellectuals of our time Funnily, after I turned my computer off and went to bed this line popped back into my head and I went, Wait a minute... I don't think that! I could care less about who is a "leading intellectual"! What does that even mean!? I hate platitudes! Noooooo... I was wrong on the internet... But the discussion was fun. K bye.