3 ms·

Could you expand on "I completely see where they're coming from"? I kind of learned this over time. So when someone shows off something lame, I just keep quiet

• dorkwood 6y ago
  I think if you're posting your work with the goal of getting feedback, then that's totally fine. I'm not trying to say that all critique has to sound nice (I actually don't believe this at all). But if you are going to seek out critique online, I would like to offer some advice. Something I see a lot of beginners doing after they post up a piece of work is say "if anyone has any critique or feedback, I would love to hear it!". I have a couple of problems with this approach: 1) You should be able to discern what's wrong with your own work. In order to improve, you need to complete the feedback loop of 'making an attempt, recognising where improvement is needed, studying how to improve that thing, and then making another attempt'. You need to learn to identify your own weaknesses, as well as your strengths, and not expect other people to do it for you. 2) It's not specific enough. If you're going to ask for feedback, mention a particular thing you've been working on that you're still struggling with. For an artist, it might be that the perspective feels off in their image, but they can't figure out why. For a writer, maybe they've been trying to work out an ending to their story, but they can't quite crack it. Asking for 'any suggestions for improvements' is well-meaning, and signals that you're interested in learning, but unfairly puts the burden on other people to decide what's wrong with your work (and often with beginners, the list is far too long to even know where to begin).
  • tayo42 6y ago
    > You should be able to discern what's wrong with your own work. I think thats why people ask for critique or feedback, because they don't know yet. If you had a teacher they would be right there to help you lean the words and how to figure that out. Asking for feedback is really just trying to use the internet as a replacement for a teacher or mentor.
    • dorkwood 6y ago
      I understand what you're saying, that to beginners there are a lot of "unknown unknowns", but not everything should fall into that category. Even with a real-life teacher or mentor I'd give the same advice: go to them with a problem you're having or something you're trying to work on, rather than asking for general tips on how to get better. We might have different fields of study in mind. In everything I've studied, even a beginner should be able to compare their work to the work of others and identify things that they need to work on. Do you have an example of a field of study where a beginner could look at their own work and not be able to identify anything that needs improving?
      • tayo42 6y ago
        I was thinking about my experiences drawing and painting. If you do something like impressionistic it can be hard to judge, did I do to much detail, not enough detail. With pen drawing it took me awhile to realize how much more depth i needed to add by using darker values. It did take me a while to have that click. I suspect it would have been obvious if I took a drawing I did and one I considered well done to compare and asked someone experienced to point out the differences. But also personally when writing it helps to get feedback to a vague question like what do you think. The writing I've done is non fiction, technical blog like stuff. I think the vague question of "what do you think", "how can i make it better" works there because it stands alone. Even when presenting a picture I can almost kind of prime you're reaction with a blurb about it. > go to them with a problem you're having or something you're trying to work on, rather than asking for general tips on how to get better. I agree with that, you does help to have a goal when asking for help to make it effective
  • thewebcount 6y ago
    > 1) You should be able to discern what's wrong with your own work. In order to improve, you need to complete the feedback loop of 'making an attempt, recognising where improvement is needed, studying how to improve that thing, and then making another attempt'. You need to learn to identify your own weaknesses, as well as your strengths, and not expect other people to do it for you. That's a pretty insane thing to expect from someone trying to learn. It's something you eventually get to, but to get there, sometimes you need help finding the way. This is like saying, "I'm not going to teach you to read until you can read this sentence." Um... Thanks? You often don't know what you don't know. > often with beginners, the list is far too long to even know where to begin That's a pretty defeatist attitude. You don't have to tell them everything that's wrong with their work. You wouldn't tell a small child who drew you a picture that their light logic is wrong. You can pick a single thing that you think is the biggest problem and explain that.