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> When Alex finally gets home, he takes his scrubs off outside our front door and stuffs them into a plastic bag that he ties off tightly. He takes his hospital

> When Alex finally gets home, he takes his scrubs off outside our front door and stuffs them into a plastic bag that he ties off tightly. He takes his hospital clogs off and leaves them outside, along with his backpack and coat. Why do doctors and nurses walk around outside in their hospital scrubs? It was unsanitary even before COVID and I just don't get it. How hard can it be to change into street clothes before leaving the hospital? I see nurses and doctors in scrubs on public transit, in coffee shops, cafeterias... they are either taking whatever illnesses were in the hospital outside, or taking the dirt and grime of the outside world into the hospital. It's baffling that this behavior is so normalized that it's described as heroic in TFA.

throwawaylalala 6y ago
It's actually not easy; not every place has facilities for that. Wife is a nurse, and we went through this discussion of the best process when she was an ICU nurse during the Ebola scare five years ago. Remember too, sometimes folks are on the way to work in their scrubs, not necessarily leaving work.
- el_nahual 6y ago
  What "facilities"? We're talking about changing clothes. Shower curtain ought to be enough! And the point about going to work in scrubs is also bad: scrubs should be as much about keeping stuff out of the hospital as in. If a neighborhood yoga studio can provide a place to change, pretty sure any healthcare facility can too.
  - akiselev 6y ago
    When's the last time you saw a yoga studio the size of an average hospital? Most hospitals have staff numbering into the hundreds or thousands with 24/7 operations [1]. We're talking large locker room facilities all over the place with many departments getting their own, especially after COVID, which themselves become central points for disease spread since shift changes aren't evenly spread out. I don't think it's a bad idea to make big investments into such infrastructure now but I think it's completely reasonable it wasn't a priority before. [1] The average hospital with 50 to 99 beds has a FT+PT staff of about 400 ( beckershospitalreview.com/hospital-management-administration/50-things-to-know-about-hospital-staffing.html ) and half of all hospitals in the US have under 100 beds.
    - lefstathiou 6y ago
      Most bathrooms in hospitals are private.
  - skwb 6y ago
    The argument that's usually given is that changing 2x more per day is too much. I used to work for a research doctor and he would regularly hold meetings in his scrubs with high profile scientists.
    - dantheman 6y ago
      Yeah, like washing your have is a big chore too.
- thaumasiotes 6y ago
  > Remember too, sometimes folks are on the way to work in their scrubs, not necessarily leaving work. This is a weird thing to remind the parent of, considering the original comment says >> they are either taking whatever illnesses were in the hospital outside, or taking the dirt and grime of the outside world into the hospital
- smabie 6y ago
  It's really not that hard to change your clothes in a bathroom. Especially in a hospital, where they certainly have a wheelchair accessible large private one. Also, many large hospitals also have a gym, so you could just change there.
  - SilasX 6y ago
    The entire staff, though? When they all have to do it at the same time, when a shift changes?
  - dillonmckay 6y ago
    How sanitary is that? A small room that is aerosolizing feces and urine after each flush? I doubt there is a lid on the toilet.
- GoOnThenDoTell 6y ago
  Why are they getting their scrubs exposed to the ‘outside’ at all?
  - s1artibartfast 6y ago
    Because it isn’t meaningfully dangerous. The inside of hospitals are not sterile. If there is a need for additional cleanliness, scrubs are covered with something that actually is sterile
fongitosous 6y ago
most of them want to show to other people they are doctor.
syntheticnature 6y ago
Leaving aside the question of changing facilities... Where do the scrubs get washed, then? Do they need to bring a special bag to transport the scrubs so they can wash them at home? Does the bag need to be washed, too? If they leave the scrubs in the lockers if they "aren't too bad" (ha), how are the lockers cleaned to ensure that they are sanitary when they put their street clothes in? How do you ensure they are sanitary when their street clothes are removed? How does all of this adapt to them changing to street clothes to eat lunch, like you suggest? Are you willing to pay for more doctors/nurses/etc. to cover the changing time for lunch?
- el_nahual 6y ago
  Ideally they would get washed at the hospital. Hospitals wash massive amounts of linens anyway, I can't imagine the additional expense being material. Mesh bag + name tag costs what, $1? And if for some reason the clinic doesn't wash linens, well, presumably the scrubs are being washed at home now, so that's always an option. The "special bag" you refer to can be gym bag or a disposable plastic bag. That is still miles less gross than the status quo. If a gym-goer can be expected to not work out in street clothes/shoes, surely similar standards of hygiene can be expected of healthcare practitioners!
- thescriptkiddie 6y ago
  This is anecdotal, but a friend of mine who works in healthcare once complained that hospitals used to (years ago) provide a cleaning service for scrubs and lab coats, but now the staff are expected to wash theirs at home.
  - fhsm 6y ago
    True procedural scrubs are still washed by the hospital (really in most cases by a contract service provider). Scrubs you see (assuming you don’t work in a procedural space) are not procedural scrubs. They are just clothing. You can be forgiven for being confused as many of those suits are taken / borrowed / stolen from the procedural scrub supply. This problem is serious enough in some places that scrubs are distributed with a vending machine system that tracks your (limited) allowed balance of outstanding sets. A long time ago , when nurses and house officers worn uniforms and laundry was on site , non procedural clinical staff were wearing hospital laundered clothing. The uniforms, and the laundry service that went with it, went away decades ago though. What to wear instead, in non procedural spaces, wasn’t every really clarified. I suspect Grays Anatomy and Scrubs helped to sort it out for this generation (although it’s highly regional and reasonably local) as did the economic importance of procedures.
wahern 6y ago
The fact they're worn around so freely should be a hint that they merely look like surgical scrubs, not intended to be used like surgical scrubs. Realistically, I would think scrubs are common because 1) they've become emblematic of healthcare occupations[1] and 2) they're easier to clean and relatively cheap--they protect the wearer from spills and contamination, not the other way around, and in contrast to traditional nursing uniforms, doctors' white lab coats, etc, they're comparatively disposal, so you can wash them in hot water after every use and then discard them after the fabric wears out. [1] Undoubtedly because of their association with surgery. I'd bet it all started with some cool surgeon lazily wearing his scrubs around the hospital.
- el_nahual 6y ago
  Yes, I know surgeons actually change into sterile scrubs before going into surgery, but even "normal" parts of hospitals are biologically filthy. Even the possibility of bringing MRSA into the outside world should merit a change of clothes.
  - wahern 6y ago
    Clothing is probably the least problematic thing. Every time some nurse or doctor uses a keyboard I want to scream. I regularly see doctors use the keyboard, wash their hands, and then use the keyboard again before beginning an examine. Recently I've started to see plastic covers on the keyboards, as if that mattered relative to the order of touching things. Realistically, cross-contamination in the hospital is almost certainly far more dangerous and consequential. Hospitals are full of infectious people, afterall, and why MRSA is more common in hospitals than in other environments. I'd rather be treated by a garbage man fresh off his route who's more mindful about what he touches after washing his hands and after touching something possibly contaminated, even if his clothes are filthy.
    - throwaway1777 6y ago
      The plastic cover can be taken off and washed (in theory) so it should be much less dirty.
robbiep 6y ago
Outside of theatres the function as a uniform. In operating theatres (most places I’ve worked) if you go outside in theatre scrubs you have to change when you come back in
reubens 6y ago
I can only speak for the docs, but this has something to do with compassion fatigue. The job is hard, and extending your frame of thought to public health concerns like this can be beyond the mental energy we're capable of in a day. Bad analogy, but its like using a car to get to work instead of riding your bike. Most do it, knowing its worse for the environment.
naveen99 6y ago
Not disagreeing, but Doctors frequently wear suits into and out of hospitals also. And those get washed less frequently than scrubs.

throwawaylalala 6y ago

It's actually not easy; not every place has facilities for that. Wife is a nurse, and we went through this discussion of the best process when she was an ICU nurse during the Ebola scare five years ago. Remember too, sometimes folks are on the way to work in their scrubs, not necessarily leaving work.

el_nahual 6y ago
What "facilities"? We're talking about changing clothes. Shower curtain ought to be enough! And the point about going to work in scrubs is also bad: scrubs should be as much about keeping stuff out of the hospital as in. If a neighborhood yoga studio can provide a place to change, pretty sure any healthcare facility can too.
- akiselev 6y ago
  When's the last time you saw a yoga studio the size of an average hospital? Most hospitals have staff numbering into the hundreds or thousands with 24/7 operations [1]. We're talking large locker room facilities all over the place with many departments getting their own, especially after COVID, which themselves become central points for disease spread since shift changes aren't evenly spread out. I don't think it's a bad idea to make big investments into such infrastructure now but I think it's completely reasonable it wasn't a priority before. [1] The average hospital with 50 to 99 beds has a FT+PT staff of about 400 ( beckershospitalreview.com/hospital-management-administration/50-things-to-know-about-hospital-staffing.html ) and half of all hospitals in the US have under 100 beds.
  - lefstathiou 6y ago
    Most bathrooms in hospitals are private.
- skwb 6y ago
  The argument that's usually given is that changing 2x more per day is too much. I used to work for a research doctor and he would regularly hold meetings in his scrubs with high profile scientists.
  - dantheman 6y ago
    Yeah, like washing your have is a big chore too.
thaumasiotes 6y ago
> Remember too, sometimes folks are on the way to work in their scrubs, not necessarily leaving work. This is a weird thing to remind the parent of, considering the original comment says >> they are either taking whatever illnesses were in the hospital outside, or taking the dirt and grime of the outside world into the hospital
smabie 6y ago
It's really not that hard to change your clothes in a bathroom. Especially in a hospital, where they certainly have a wheelchair accessible large private one. Also, many large hospitals also have a gym, so you could just change there.
- SilasX 6y ago
  The entire staff, though? When they all have to do it at the same time, when a shift changes?
- dillonmckay 6y ago
  How sanitary is that? A small room that is aerosolizing feces and urine after each flush? I doubt there is a lid on the toilet.
GoOnThenDoTell 6y ago
Why are they getting their scrubs exposed to the ‘outside’ at all?
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  Because it isn’t meaningfully dangerous. The inside of hospitals are not sterile. If there is a need for additional cleanliness, scrubs are covered with something that actually is sterile

fongitosous 6y ago

most of them want to show to other people they are doctor.

syntheticnature 6y ago

Leaving aside the question of changing facilities... Where do the scrubs get washed, then? Do they need to bring a special bag to transport the scrubs so they can wash them at home? Does the bag need to be washed, too? If they leave the scrubs in the lockers if they "aren't too bad" (ha), how are the lockers cleaned to ensure that they are sanitary when they put their street clothes in? How do you ensure they are sanitary when their street clothes are removed? How does all of this adapt to them changing to street clothes to eat lunch, like you suggest? Are you willing to pay for more doctors/nurses/etc. to cover the changing time for lunch?

el_nahual 6y ago
Ideally they would get washed at the hospital. Hospitals wash massive amounts of linens anyway, I can't imagine the additional expense being material. Mesh bag + name tag costs what, $1? And if for some reason the clinic doesn't wash linens, well, presumably the scrubs are being washed at home now, so that's always an option. The "special bag" you refer to can be gym bag or a disposable plastic bag. That is still miles less gross than the status quo. If a gym-goer can be expected to not work out in street clothes/shoes, surely similar standards of hygiene can be expected of healthcare practitioners!
thescriptkiddie 6y ago
This is anecdotal, but a friend of mine who works in healthcare once complained that hospitals used to (years ago) provide a cleaning service for scrubs and lab coats, but now the staff are expected to wash theirs at home.
- fhsm 6y ago
  True procedural scrubs are still washed by the hospital (really in most cases by a contract service provider). Scrubs you see (assuming you don’t work in a procedural space) are not procedural scrubs. They are just clothing. You can be forgiven for being confused as many of those suits are taken / borrowed / stolen from the procedural scrub supply. This problem is serious enough in some places that scrubs are distributed with a vending machine system that tracks your (limited) allowed balance of outstanding sets. A long time ago , when nurses and house officers worn uniforms and laundry was on site , non procedural clinical staff were wearing hospital laundered clothing. The uniforms, and the laundry service that went with it, went away decades ago though. What to wear instead, in non procedural spaces, wasn’t every really clarified. I suspect Grays Anatomy and Scrubs helped to sort it out for this generation (although it’s highly regional and reasonably local) as did the economic importance of procedures.

wahern 6y ago

The fact they're worn around so freely should be a hint that they merely look like surgical scrubs, not intended to be used like surgical scrubs. Realistically, I would think scrubs are common because 1) they've become emblematic of healthcare occupations[1] and 2) they're easier to clean and relatively cheap--they protect the wearer from spills and contamination, not the other way around, and in contrast to traditional nursing uniforms, doctors' white lab coats, etc, they're comparatively disposal, so you can wash them in hot water after every use and then discard them after the fabric wears out. [1] Undoubtedly because of their association with surgery. I'd bet it all started with some cool surgeon lazily wearing his scrubs around the hospital.

el_nahual 6y ago
Yes, I know surgeons actually change into sterile scrubs before going into surgery, but even "normal" parts of hospitals are biologically filthy. Even the possibility of bringing MRSA into the outside world should merit a change of clothes.
- wahern 6y ago
  Clothing is probably the least problematic thing. Every time some nurse or doctor uses a keyboard I want to scream. I regularly see doctors use the keyboard, wash their hands, and then use the keyboard again before beginning an examine. Recently I've started to see plastic covers on the keyboards, as if that mattered relative to the order of touching things. Realistically, cross-contamination in the hospital is almost certainly far more dangerous and consequential. Hospitals are full of infectious people, afterall, and why MRSA is more common in hospitals than in other environments. I'd rather be treated by a garbage man fresh off his route who's more mindful about what he touches after washing his hands and after touching something possibly contaminated, even if his clothes are filthy.
  - throwaway1777 6y ago
    The plastic cover can be taken off and washed (in theory) so it should be much less dirty.

robbiep 6y ago

Outside of theatres the function as a uniform. In operating theatres (most places I’ve worked) if you go outside in theatre scrubs you have to change when you come back in

reubens 6y ago

I can only speak for the docs, but this has something to do with compassion fatigue. The job is hard, and extending your frame of thought to public health concerns like this can be beyond the mental energy we're capable of in a day. Bad analogy, but its like using a car to get to work instead of riding your bike. Most do it, knowing its worse for the environment.

naveen99 6y ago

Not disagreeing, but Doctors frequently wear suits into and out of hospitals also. And those get washed less frequently than scrubs.