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Whataboutism is usually done to defend something by making it look better in comparison but what the OP was arguing is that we should be pursuing end to end enc
by laumars 6y ago
Whataboutism is usually done to defend something by making it look better in comparison but what the OP was arguing is that we should be pursuing end to end encrypted solutions exclusively because it’s not just the Chinese government who are doing the snooping. ie he’s not defending Zoom nor the Chinese government but suggesting the complaint against Zoom/China doesn’t go far enough
- seppin 6y agoIf the company itself is compromised, e-2-e doesn't matter.
- frabbit 6y agoExactly. Assume that governments and large companies can and will spy on you and act accordingly. Do not get suckered into some simplistic nationalistic narrative in which "our" side is good.
- Veen 6y agoThere's two problems with that line of thought. First, "our side" is not good but it is better. Notwithstanding the current unpleasantness, the US government isn't locking up and "reeducating" hundreds of thousands of its own citizens. Second, good or bad, it is our side and the CCP is the other side: only an ethically and intellectually challenged person offers tacit support for the "other side" because their own side fails some specious purity test.
- frabbit 6y agothe US government isn't locking up and "reeducating" hundreds of thousands of its own citizens. Discuss.
- Veen 6y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinjiang_re-education_camps https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinjiang_re-education_camps > As of 2018, it was estimated that the Chinese authorities may have detained hundreds of thousands, perhaps a million, Uyghurs, Kazakhs, Kyrgyz and other ethnic Turkic Muslims, Christians as well as some foreign citizens such as Kazakhstanis, who are being held in these secretive internment camps which are located throughout the region. In May 2018, Randall Schriver of the United States Department of Defense repeated claims that "at least a million but likely closer to three million citizens" were imprisoned in detention centers in a strong condemnation of the "concentration camps"
- laumars 6y agoI don’t personally see it as a competition about which side is worse. I see the lack of end to end encryption as more like a security hole that needs fixing irrespective of whether you trust one side more than the other.
- a1369209993 6y ago> the US government isn't locking up and "reeducating" hundreds of thousands of its own citizens. Uhh, yes it is? Primarily urban black males. > only an ethically and intellectually challenged person offers tacit support for [one side] because [the other] side fails some specious purity test. This is very true though. Both sides are very evil, and laumars[0] has the right of it: we need to not trust either of them. 0: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23482044 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23482044
- ethanbond 6y agoOP was in fact not making that argument when I posted my comment. Obviously I agree that E2E should be the default and that ideally you have no governments snooping. The initial comment was a far less substantive, “US spies too.”