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I've always wondered how terrible automotive designs make it to production. Engines or transmissions that quickly fail, cars that are just garbage in quality...

I've always wondered how terrible automotive designs make it to production. Engines or transmissions that quickly fail, cars that are just garbage in quality...nobody along the years of development stopped to say "maybe we shouldn't build this..", or perhaps someone did? Did the company building this get their moneys worth when it comes to lessons learned?

Cthulhu_ 6y ago
When it comes to mechanical failures like that, it's never due to incompetence; it's due to cost cutting concerns (e.g. using less material, cheaper / inferior material) and / or planned obsolescence. Automotive engineers are highly competent, and most will have had a lot of education when it comes to materials, strengths, stresses, wear and tear, etcetera. And car companies build up that knowledge over the decades. Definitely not a problem with all cars, but the better built cars are more expensive. I want to say "you get what you pay for", but at the same time I know nowadays there are a lot of products (e.g. electrical tools) where the brand is bought up and the new owner makes big cost cutting measures to maximize their profit margin, the money coming from "brand inertia", that is, a brand is known for being good for a couple years after they start reducing quality and durability.
- reactor4 6y ago
  Nissan's CVT seem to be a counterexample of everything in your first paragraph. I could also bring a lot of counterexamples to your second paragrah (e.g.: many german cars).
  - michaelcampbell 6y ago
    "better built cars are more expensive" is not the same as "expensive cars are better built".
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- dognotdog 6y ago
  I'd say it is due to incompetence, but not as much the individual engineer's as failures of the organization, though I have seen plenty of people not doing the job they're qualified for. These failures stem from plain mis-management, political turf wars, and misaligned incentives -- cost-cutting being the most obnoxious driver, causing a landscape of balkanized teams to fight for resources and engineering concerns becoming an aftertought.
jotm 6y ago
At least for complicated mechanical devices like transmissions, or really anything that has a lot of friction between metals, getting the right alloy is essential. An example from the world of home appliances, Bosch/Siemens have been using the same drum design for a decade, before production was moved from Poland/Spain to China, likely for cost cutting measures. The Chinese made machines (same internal design, new model - they always do that, with a facelift and maybe new electronics) had a very high bearing and spider failure rate. They switched the alloy supplier. Makes sense, why import it from the EU. Either they knew it was lower quality, or were duped, but anyway, their product quality took a massive dive because of a seemingly simple to produce part.

Cthulhu_ 6y ago

When it comes to mechanical failures like that, it's never due to incompetence; it's due to cost cutting concerns (e.g. using less material, cheaper / inferior material) and / or planned obsolescence. Automotive engineers are highly competent, and most will have had a lot of education when it comes to materials, strengths, stresses, wear and tear, etcetera. And car companies build up that knowledge over the decades. Definitely not a problem with all cars, but the better built cars are more expensive. I want to say "you get what you pay for", but at the same time I know nowadays there are a lot of products (e.g. electrical tools) where the brand is bought up and the new owner makes big cost cutting measures to maximize their profit margin, the money coming from "brand inertia", that is, a brand is known for being good for a couple years after they start reducing quality and durability.

reactor4 6y ago
Nissan's CVT seem to be a counterexample of everything in your first paragraph. I could also bring a lot of counterexamples to your second paragrah (e.g.: many german cars).
- michaelcampbell 6y ago
  "better built cars are more expensive" is not the same as "expensive cars are better built".
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
dognotdog 6y ago
I'd say it is due to incompetence, but not as much the individual engineer's as failures of the organization, though I have seen plenty of people not doing the job they're qualified for. These failures stem from plain mis-management, political turf wars, and misaligned incentives -- cost-cutting being the most obnoxious driver, causing a landscape of balkanized teams to fight for resources and engineering concerns becoming an aftertought.

jotm 6y ago

At least for complicated mechanical devices like transmissions, or really anything that has a lot of friction between metals, getting the right alloy is essential. An example from the world of home appliances, Bosch/Siemens have been using the same drum design for a decade, before production was moved from Poland/Spain to China, likely for cost cutting measures. The Chinese made machines (same internal design, new model - they always do that, with a facelift and maybe new electronics) had a very high bearing and spider failure rate. They switched the alloy supplier. Makes sense, why import it from the EU. Either they knew it was lower quality, or were duped, but anyway, their product quality took a massive dive because of a seemingly simple to produce part.