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I started using the pipenv this weekend and it seems like it's pretty good for at least maintaining an environment within a project. I found it friendly at leas

I started using the pipenv this weekend and it seems like it's pretty good for at least maintaining an environment within a project. I found it friendly at least. That being said, I'll admit I don't know much about what it means to be pythonic. What do you think the drawbacks are to pipenv-type approach and what would be more pythonic in your mind ?

atoav 6y ago
What I mean by pythonic is the "batteries included" paradigma: if you want to — say — quickly script something up that does some time calculations you just go and import datetime. There is no need to research what datetime libraries are ok, download and install dependecies etc. You are able to go and (with the included batteries) solve your problem. I wish I could just as easily say: ahh this script I made should become a package that I can reuse on my server. But then the server has Python 3.6 while your script has 3.8, so you end up installing another python, painstakingly watch not to install over the old one etc. When installing modules you have to do the same or set up a venv/pipenv. All along the road there are possible ways to shoot yourself into the leg. Meanwhile in Rust you do a cargo new foobar, work on it, add dependecies to the cargo.toml, copy it to the server, build a binary with cargo build --release and copy the binary into the PATH. You spent zero brainpower on not breaking things and had capacity to think about other stuff. The closest thing we have in those terms in pythonland is poetry, which is a very good start. But this should be part of the language, not something one has to do extra.
- necrotic_comp 6y ago
  Got it - that makes sense. I actually ended up with a smattering of the version problems when I was working with pipenv for the first time, and figured it was my fault in some way because I hadn't set up the "correct" python version on my system. That's somewhat disheartening to hear that it's a consistent problem. Thanks for the insight and clarification.

atoav 6y ago

What I mean by pythonic is the "batteries included" paradigma: if you want to — say — quickly script something up that does some time calculations you just go and import datetime. There is no need to research what datetime libraries are ok, download and install dependecies etc. You are able to go and (with the included batteries) solve your problem. I wish I could just as easily say: ahh this script I made should become a package that I can reuse on my server. But then the server has Python 3.6 while your script has 3.8, so you end up installing another python, painstakingly watch not to install over the old one etc. When installing modules you have to do the same or set up a venv/pipenv. All along the road there are possible ways to shoot yourself into the leg. Meanwhile in Rust you do a cargo new foobar, work on it, add dependecies to the cargo.toml, copy it to the server, build a binary with cargo build --release and copy the binary into the PATH. You spent zero brainpower on not breaking things and had capacity to think about other stuff. The closest thing we have in those terms in pythonland is poetry, which is a very good start. But this should be part of the language, not something one has to do extra.

necrotic_comp 6y ago
Got it - that makes sense. I actually ended up with a smattering of the version problems when I was working with pipenv for the first time, and figured it was my fault in some way because I hadn't set up the "correct" python version on my system. That's somewhat disheartening to hear that it's a consistent problem. Thanks for the insight and clarification.