4 ms·

Fascinating how alternative policing ideas went from a fringe to mainstream overnight. Whomever said "slowly at first then at all once" wasn't lying. Another i

by amasad 6y ago

Fascinating how alternative policing ideas went from a fringe to mainstream overnight. Whomever said "slowly at first then at all once" wasn't lying. Another interesting book for those who are curious about these topics is The Private Production of Defense by Hans Hoppe which is also available for free: https://mises.org/library/private-production-defense https://mises.org/library/private-production-defense

ardy42 6y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans-Hermann_Hoppe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans-Hermann_Hoppe: > In 2001, Hoppe published Democracy: The God That Failed which examines various social and economic phenomena which, Hoppe argues, are problems caused by democratic forms of government. He attributes democracy's failures to pressure groups which seek to increase government expenditures and regulations. Hoppe proposes alternatives and remedies, including secession, decentralization of government, and "complete freedom of contract, occupation, trade and migration". Hoppe argues that monarchy would preserve individual liberty more effectively than democracy.... > In Democracy Hoppe describes a fully libertarian society of "covenant communities" made up of residents who have signed an agreement defining the nature of that community. Hoppe writes "There would be little or no 'tolerance' and 'openmindedness' so dear to left-libertarians. Instead, one would be on the right path toward restoring the freedom of association and exclusion implied in the institution of private property". Hoppe writes that towns and villages could have warning signs saying "no beggars, bums, or homeless, but also no homosexuals, drug users, Jews, Moslems, Germans, or Zulus".... > As a self-proclaimed anarchist who favors abolishing the nation-state, Hoppe believes that as long as states exist, they should impose some restrictions on immigration. Hoppe has equated free immigration to "forced integration" which violates the rights of native peoples, since if land were privately owned, immigration would not be unhindered but would only occur with the consent of private property owners. Hoppe's Mises Institute colleague Walter Block has characterized Hoppe as an "anti-open immigration activist" who argues that, though all public property is "stolen" by the state from taxpayers, "the state compounds the injustice when it allows immigrants to use [public] property, thus further "invading" the private property rights of the original owners".
- amasad 6y ago
  > The genetic fallacy (also known as the fallacy of origins or fallacy of virtue) is a fallacy of irrelevance that is based solely on someone's or something's history, origin, or source rather than its current meaning or context. This overlooks any difference to be found in the present situation, typically transferring the positive or negative esteem from the earlier context. In other words, a claim is ignored in favor of attacking or championing its source. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy
  - ardy42 6y ago
    Huh? I was merely pointing out some relevant context of the work you cited. Context that people might want to be aware of as they consider its arguments and perspectives.
    - amasad 6y ago
      You're actually breaking the HN guidelines which I suggest you read https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive. > When disagreeing, please reply to the argument And a few other relevant things.
      - manicdee 6y ago
        Posting a quote of a logical fallacy is breaking your own rules. Consider pointing out which rules you think are being broke and why (the “why” being the important part of that sentence). Note that the genetic fallacy is similar to Godwin’s Law: it specifically doesn’t apply when pointing out a pattern of behaviour. For example, pointing out that the author of a particular philosophical piece is from a certain school of philosophy is important to people who do not understand the background of philosophical schools. It’s a form of reality check: would you accept relationship advice from a person who has never had a meaningful relationship?

by amasad 6y ago

ardy42 6y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans-Hermann_Hoppe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans-Hermann_Hoppe: > In 2001, Hoppe published Democracy: The God That Failed which examines various social and economic phenomena which, Hoppe argues, are problems caused by democratic forms of government. He attributes democracy's failures to pressure groups which seek to increase government expenditures and regulations. Hoppe proposes alternatives and remedies, including secession, decentralization of government, and "complete freedom of contract, occupation, trade and migration". Hoppe argues that monarchy would preserve individual liberty more effectively than democracy.... > In Democracy Hoppe describes a fully libertarian society of "covenant communities" made up of residents who have signed an agreement defining the nature of that community. Hoppe writes "There would be little or no 'tolerance' and 'openmindedness' so dear to left-libertarians. Instead, one would be on the right path toward restoring the freedom of association and exclusion implied in the institution of private property". Hoppe writes that towns and villages could have warning signs saying "no beggars, bums, or homeless, but also no homosexuals, drug users, Jews, Moslems, Germans, or Zulus".... > As a self-proclaimed anarchist who favors abolishing the nation-state, Hoppe believes that as long as states exist, they should impose some restrictions on immigration. Hoppe has equated free immigration to "forced integration" which violates the rights of native peoples, since if land were privately owned, immigration would not be unhindered but would only occur with the consent of private property owners. Hoppe's Mises Institute colleague Walter Block has characterized Hoppe as an "anti-open immigration activist" who argues that, though all public property is "stolen" by the state from taxpayers, "the state compounds the injustice when it allows immigrants to use [public] property, thus further "invading" the private property rights of the original owners".

amasad 6y ago
> The genetic fallacy (also known as the fallacy of origins or fallacy of virtue) is a fallacy of irrelevance that is based solely on someone's or something's history, origin, or source rather than its current meaning or context. This overlooks any difference to be found in the present situation, typically transferring the positive or negative esteem from the earlier context. In other words, a claim is ignored in favor of attacking or championing its source. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_fallacy
- ardy42 6y ago
  Huh? I was merely pointing out some relevant context of the work you cited. Context that people might want to be aware of as they consider its arguments and perspectives.
  - amasad 6y ago
    You're actually breaking the HN guidelines which I suggest you read https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive. > When disagreeing, please reply to the argument And a few other relevant things.
    - manicdee 6y ago
      Posting a quote of a logical fallacy is breaking your own rules. Consider pointing out which rules you think are being broke and why (the “why” being the important part of that sentence). Note that the genetic fallacy is similar to Godwin’s Law: it specifically doesn’t apply when pointing out a pattern of behaviour. For example, pointing out that the author of a particular philosophical piece is from a certain school of philosophy is important to people who do not understand the background of philosophical schools. It’s a form of reality check: would you accept relationship advice from a person who has never had a meaningful relationship?