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Why shouldn’t they? People were browbeaten for having the audacity to want to return to work. Now politicians are out marching shoulder to shoulder with thousan

Why shouldn’t they? People were browbeaten for having the audacity to want to return to work. Now politicians are out marching shoulder to shoulder with thousands of other people. We also were told that Georgia was going to be a disaster for reopening too soon and that has not come to pass. It’s good to know that “believe science” and “stay home stay safe” are completely negotiable based on what is politically expedient.

goatinaboat 6y ago
The “open letter” signed by 1200 experts stating that protesting was no risk, except for protests against the lockdown itself, was also mind boggling in its audacity.
- mberning 6y ago
  Right. As if the virus has its own agency and cares why you are gathering.
  - goatinaboat 6y ago
    What I don’t get is if the virus is so woke, why it was infecting people without their consent?
- robocat 6y ago
  "One in every 1,000 Black men and boys can expect to be killed by police in this country". If we presume average years of life lost per black person’s death is 50 years, then Covid is less deadly. To lower risk, black people could stay at home and wait for better times...
  - mberning 6y ago
    That is so stupid. There are some 40 million black folks in the US. Assume half are men. 20,000,000 divided by 1,000 is 20,000. The actual number of unarmed blacks killed by the police per year is generally 20 or less. Last year it was like 10. You can look it up on the Washington Post database.
    - robocat 6y ago
      Perhaps you could rewrite that to avoid implying I am stupid? Your facts don’t affect the argument.
    - dang 6y ago
      If you continue to break the site guidelines we will ban you. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. "That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2, not 3." Your comment would be fine without the first sentence.
      - mberning 6y ago
        Please do. If you could completely delete my account that would be even better.
  - geomark 6y ago
    Those numbers seem to be vastly more than reported numbers of police killings. Whom are you quoting? Because I like to keep track of who makes such exaggerated claims.
    - robocat 6y ago
      This references the source data: https://theconversation.com/police-are-more-likely-to-kill-men-and-women-of-color-121158 https://theconversation.com/police-are-more-likely-to-kill-m... It says that between 2013 and 2018, about 96 in 100,000 (approx 1 in 1000) African American men were killed by police in the U.S. Death from Covid is also lifetime risk. It is a commonly reported statistic if you want to find other publications that say the same thing. Did you try googling for it — for example google: "1000 black men and boys" police
monadic2 6y ago
> We also were told that Georgia was going to be a disaster for reopening too soon and that has not come to pass. Tell that to the families of the dead. I’m sure they’ll be happy to know they died propping up your portfolios while people starve on the streets. It’s the most american thing ever to insist on returning to work above all other values—there’s that death cult for you. The dow demands blood!
- SPQT 6y ago
  You do understand that the poor are the one that suffer from the lockdown and its side effects? I'm making sweet sweet benjies while "working" from 3 bed home with garden and managed to gobble up stocks on the cheap when we were in sky is falling mode.
  - monadic2 6y ago
    Sure, but that was a choice by our government to not bail out the people—again, the death cult.
    - umanwizard 6y ago
      Do you have an example of any economic system in any country in the world, past or present, that could survive the majority of able-bodied people not working for a long period of time?
      - monadic2 6y ago
        How do you figure—where would the threat come from? We can certainly still produce necessary goods while the majority of the workforce stays home. In that light—every industrialized country, probably. Certainly other countries every where you look on every continent seem to be doing markedly better at this than the US, including countries that are opening back up. Our best parallels are the goddamn UK and Iran, the former of which is trying to hang itself and the latter we've been trying to choke out for 40+ years. Anyway, I can't even guess how you think the economy works if you think we need to open up or something bad will happen that nobody ever names. Oh no, a U shaped recovery and not a V shaped recovery? How will my 401k ever recover in the next six months?!? Think about all that risk to my capital! :'( How can this country ever recover from such a critical loss of portfolio value? Instead of actually ensuring people can survive this crisis, we've bought corporate debt and told people to get back to work. It's a goddamn joke of any understanding of economics. Honey, every person that's ever read adam smith could do better than that. "developing countries" are putting us to shame, and good for them, because we're on the bus in Speed.
dang 6y ago
Please don't post in the flamewar style to HN. We're here for curious conversation, not tendentious snark. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- gbpz 6y ago
  It is snarky, but an accurate representation of the current climate.
  - dang 6y ago
    Even if that were true, it's not enough.
wwweston 6y ago
I'm team "stay home" and I have an uneasy relationship with these protests: I don't love protest as a form of engagement in the first place (it has its place, but its has a lot of limits), and an epidemic wouldn't be my choice for timing it. That said: * We had the "I don't wanna stay at home" and "masks are tyranny" protestors a month ago, too... but as far as I know, most governments pretty much let those happen. Hell, they let a lot of those happened with the protestors heavily armed. Protestors drew a lot of criticism but more or less got to do what they wanted. * Similarly, it's pretty clear that most governments aren't thrilled about BLM protest crowds from a public health standpoint, but have adopted a range of tactics from "cooperate and keep peace" to "actively suppress." Protestors have drawn a mix of support and criticism and... in some cases got a beat down and trip through arrest processing, but in other cases kinda got to do what they wanted. It's not like social justice was just given a pass here; in some ways it actually has faced heavier resistance. * If we're comparing motives here, are we weighing "the audacity to want to return to work"? Or the audacity to want other people to return to work? And how would we compare that with, say, the desire to be free from being murdered or otherwise singled out for selective enforcement or brutality by officers of state? * Government direction didn't cause a retreat from social/economic engagement, it coordinated it. Most people would have done exactly the same thing they're doing now absent official direction, just at different times/thresholds, leading to the same eventual economic results but less effective epidemic mitigation. And the only thing that will get everyone back to work is either nihilism or trust that risks are well-managed.
sadsadsadsad 6y ago
GA is one of the ~10 or so states that has gone above 1.0 rt again, lol.

goatinaboat 6y ago

The “open letter” signed by 1200 experts stating that protesting was no risk, except for protests against the lockdown itself, was also mind boggling in its audacity.

mberning 6y ago
Right. As if the virus has its own agency and cares why you are gathering.
- goatinaboat 6y ago
  What I don’t get is if the virus is so woke, why it was infecting people without their consent?
robocat 6y ago
"One in every 1,000 Black men and boys can expect to be killed by police in this country". If we presume average years of life lost per black person’s death is 50 years, then Covid is less deadly. To lower risk, black people could stay at home and wait for better times...
- mberning 6y ago
  That is so stupid. There are some 40 million black folks in the US. Assume half are men. 20,000,000 divided by 1,000 is 20,000. The actual number of unarmed blacks killed by the police per year is generally 20 or less. Last year it was like 10. You can look it up on the Washington Post database.
  - robocat 6y ago
    Perhaps you could rewrite that to avoid implying I am stupid? Your facts don’t affect the argument.
  - dang 6y ago
    If you continue to break the site guidelines we will ban you. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. "That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2, not 3." Your comment would be fine without the first sentence.
    - mberning 6y ago
      Please do. If you could completely delete my account that would be even better.
- geomark 6y ago
  Those numbers seem to be vastly more than reported numbers of police killings. Whom are you quoting? Because I like to keep track of who makes such exaggerated claims.
  - robocat 6y ago
    This references the source data: https://theconversation.com/police-are-more-likely-to-kill-men-and-women-of-color-121158 https://theconversation.com/police-are-more-likely-to-kill-m... It says that between 2013 and 2018, about 96 in 100,000 (approx 1 in 1000) African American men were killed by police in the U.S. Death from Covid is also lifetime risk. It is a commonly reported statistic if you want to find other publications that say the same thing. Did you try googling for it — for example google: "1000 black men and boys" police

monadic2 6y ago

> We also were told that Georgia was going to be a disaster for reopening too soon and that has not come to pass. Tell that to the families of the dead. I’m sure they’ll be happy to know they died propping up your portfolios while people starve on the streets. It’s the most american thing ever to insist on returning to work above all other values—there’s that death cult for you. The dow demands blood!

SPQT 6y ago
You do understand that the poor are the one that suffer from the lockdown and its side effects? I'm making sweet sweet benjies while "working" from 3 bed home with garden and managed to gobble up stocks on the cheap when we were in sky is falling mode.
- monadic2 6y ago
  Sure, but that was a choice by our government to not bail out the people—again, the death cult.
  - umanwizard 6y ago
    Do you have an example of any economic system in any country in the world, past or present, that could survive the majority of able-bodied people not working for a long period of time?
    - monadic2 6y ago
      How do you figure—where would the threat come from? We can certainly still produce necessary goods while the majority of the workforce stays home. In that light—every industrialized country, probably. Certainly other countries every where you look on every continent seem to be doing markedly better at this than the US, including countries that are opening back up. Our best parallels are the goddamn UK and Iran, the former of which is trying to hang itself and the latter we've been trying to choke out for 40+ years. Anyway, I can't even guess how you think the economy works if you think we need to open up or something bad will happen that nobody ever names. Oh no, a U shaped recovery and not a V shaped recovery? How will my 401k ever recover in the next six months?!? Think about all that risk to my capital! :'( How can this country ever recover from such a critical loss of portfolio value? Instead of actually ensuring people can survive this crisis, we've bought corporate debt and told people to get back to work. It's a goddamn joke of any understanding of economics. Honey, every person that's ever read adam smith could do better than that. "developing countries" are putting us to shame, and good for them, because we're on the bus in Speed.

dang 6y ago

Please don't post in the flamewar style to HN. We're here for curious conversation, not tendentious snark. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

gbpz 6y ago
It is snarky, but an accurate representation of the current climate.
- dang 6y ago
  Even if that were true, it's not enough.

wwweston 6y ago

I'm team "stay home" and I have an uneasy relationship with these protests: I don't love protest as a form of engagement in the first place (it has its place, but its has a lot of limits), and an epidemic wouldn't be my choice for timing it. That said: * We had the "I don't wanna stay at home" and "masks are tyranny" protestors a month ago, too... but as far as I know, most governments pretty much let those happen. Hell, they let a lot of those happened with the protestors heavily armed. Protestors drew a lot of criticism but more or less got to do what they wanted. * Similarly, it's pretty clear that most governments aren't thrilled about BLM protest crowds from a public health standpoint, but have adopted a range of tactics from "cooperate and keep peace" to "actively suppress." Protestors have drawn a mix of support and criticism and... in some cases got a beat down and trip through arrest processing, but in other cases kinda got to do what they wanted. It's not like social justice was just given a pass here; in some ways it actually has faced heavier resistance. * If we're comparing motives here, are we weighing "the audacity to want to return to work"? Or the audacity to want other people to return to work? And how would we compare that with, say, the desire to be free from being murdered or otherwise singled out for selective enforcement or brutality by officers of state? * Government direction didn't cause a retreat from social/economic engagement, it coordinated it. Most people would have done exactly the same thing they're doing now absent official direction, just at different times/thresholds, leading to the same eventual economic results but less effective epidemic mitigation. And the only thing that will get everyone back to work is either nihilism or trust that risks are well-managed.

sadsadsadsad 6y ago

GA is one of the ~10 or so states that has gone above 1.0 rt again, lol.