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Snap support is evolving. There are keys to configure when, and if, you get updates, https://snapcraft.io/docs/keeping-snaps-up-to-date https://snapcraft.io/do

by simosx 6y ago

Snap support is evolving. There are keys to configure when, and if, you get updates, https://snapcraft.io/docs/keeping-snaps-up-to-date https://snapcraft.io/docs/keeping-snaps-up-to-date The total Linux desktop installation base is around 2.7%. Without automation, the Linux desktop does not look like it will attract any significant number of Windows users.

jnurmine 6y ago
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but one cannot hold off updating the snaps indefinitely. Thus there is no "if". One gets a maximum of 60 days, that is all. Through a snap proxy it's possible to hold off longer, but then the proxy needs to talk with the snap store periodically. Why people are upset is, I believe, that Canonical forces people to accept any and all changes to the installed software, without being able to guarantee perfect backwards compatibility for all upgrades. Obviously, neither Canonical nor anyone else can make that kind of promise for all software out there. Canonical should not force updates on people; let people take care of backwards compatibility; let users turn the auto-update on and off and allow users also to freeze package versions (and their system configuration), if the users so please. Also, not sure I understand the point about automation. There is automation already today in Ubuntu through autoupdating .deb packages. It is nothing inherently new in Snaps. One problem with measuring Linux desktop installation base is that Linux users are often the people who turn off telemetry, call-home, employ DNT, run ad blockers, run third party script blockers, and so on. I wonder how much this skews the results.
- simosx 6y ago
  Lenovo cited NetMarketShare for the stats on the desktop Linux, https://news.lenovo.com/pressroom/press-releases/lenovo-brings-linux-certification-to-thinkpad-and-thinkstation-workstation-portfolio-easing-deployment-for-developers-data-scientists/ https://news.lenovo.com/pressroom/press-releases/lenovo-brin... You can "snap download" and "snap install" to bypass any updates.
johnp_ 6y ago
> and if Do you mean the obvious `sudo snap set system refresh.hold="$(date --date=+100years +%Y-%m-%dT%H:%M:%S%:z)"`? (no error) edit: Ah, that silently stops working after 60 days, nvm.
kjs3 6y ago
Snap support is evolving. So we're the beta testers for Snap. Awesome. Nothing I want to do more on my day-to-day desktop than to be an outsource QA team to debug Ubuntu's software. Thanks for making 'beta test' the default, just like with pulseaudio and systemd. I look forward to the one day in the future when snap doesn't suck too. Except, nope. No more Ubuntu. I guess tossing Windows in there is some ad homen attempt to deflect, because the comment doesn't otherwise make any sense. Is "we'll screw our users until our software works reliably" somehow an answer to the M$ hegemony?
- sergeykish 6y ago
  It is popular idea that to attract users one has be Steve Jobs. Vote with your legs.
inshadows 6y ago
It'll still update behind your back after 60 days. It's deliberately designed so that the users does not have complete control over what their devices run. It's designed in a way that even experienced sysadmins will have hard time taking back control of their devices. Ultimately these knobs are just farce. What they are doing could be easily achieved by cron or any other task scheduler, but that would not allow Canonical to keep control of user devices.

by simosx 6y ago

jnurmine 6y ago

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but one cannot hold off updating the snaps indefinitely. Thus there is no "if". One gets a maximum of 60 days, that is all. Through a snap proxy it's possible to hold off longer, but then the proxy needs to talk with the snap store periodically. Why people are upset is, I believe, that Canonical forces people to accept any and all changes to the installed software, without being able to guarantee perfect backwards compatibility for all upgrades. Obviously, neither Canonical nor anyone else can make that kind of promise for all software out there. Canonical should not force updates on people; let people take care of backwards compatibility; let users turn the auto-update on and off and allow users also to freeze package versions (and their system configuration), if the users so please. Also, not sure I understand the point about automation. There is automation already today in Ubuntu through autoupdating .deb packages. It is nothing inherently new in Snaps. One problem with measuring Linux desktop installation base is that Linux users are often the people who turn off telemetry, call-home, employ DNT, run ad blockers, run third party script blockers, and so on. I wonder how much this skews the results.

simosx 6y ago
Lenovo cited NetMarketShare for the stats on the desktop Linux, https://news.lenovo.com/pressroom/press-releases/lenovo-brings-linux-certification-to-thinkpad-and-thinkstation-workstation-portfolio-easing-deployment-for-developers-data-scientists/ https://news.lenovo.com/pressroom/press-releases/lenovo-brin... You can "snap download" and "snap install" to bypass any updates.

johnp_ 6y ago

> and if Do you mean the obvious `sudo snap set system refresh.hold="$(date --date=+100years +%Y-%m-%dT%H:%M:%S%:z)"`? (no error) edit: Ah, that silently stops working after 60 days, nvm.

kjs3 6y ago

Snap support is evolving. So we're the beta testers for Snap. Awesome. Nothing I want to do more on my day-to-day desktop than to be an outsource QA team to debug Ubuntu's software. Thanks for making 'beta test' the default, just like with pulseaudio and systemd. I look forward to the one day in the future when snap doesn't suck too. Except, nope. No more Ubuntu. I guess tossing Windows in there is some ad homen attempt to deflect, because the comment doesn't otherwise make any sense. Is "we'll screw our users until our software works reliably" somehow an answer to the M$ hegemony?

sergeykish 6y ago
It is popular idea that to attract users one has be Steve Jobs. Vote with your legs.

inshadows 6y ago

It'll still update behind your back after 60 days. It's deliberately designed so that the users does not have complete control over what their devices run. It's designed in a way that even experienced sysadmins will have hard time taking back control of their devices. Ultimately these knobs are just farce. What they are doing could be easily achieved by cron or any other task scheduler, but that would not allow Canonical to keep control of user devices.