3 ms·

Old wives tale. Even the stackoverflow answers say as much. Most of the thermal ramping occurs in the first five minutes and then stabilizes after cache is exh

Old wives tale. Even the stackoverflow answers say as much. Most of the thermal ramping occurs in the first five minutes and then stabilizes after cache is exhausted. As all these dslr’s allow you to record 29m50s videos back to back all day long it’s also indicative that it’s not a big enough issue in returns to warrant addressing in their firmware. As you’re not writing to the SD card, hdmi passthrough should yield an overall lower operating temperature after an hour than writing to the SD card when recording video after even 10 minutes. I tried getting to the source of this rumor. Didn’t find one particular origin, just speculation amongst Redditors and Twitch users about the 30 minute limit and bypassing it with the Nikon or Canon firmware mods will void your warranty. It will however introduce more noise. Particularly at higher ISO’s. Astronomy photographers (a major driver of the firmware hacks in the first place - see “Nikon stareater bypass”) have cooling solutions available there too.

myself248 6y ago
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the 30m limit is due to some taxes or regulations on "video cameras", right? Edit: Yup. https://petapixel.com/2012/05/21/30-minute-video-limit-in-digital-cameras-may-be-on-its-way-out/ https://petapixel.com/2012/05/21/30-minute-video-limit-in-di... > At present [2012], digital cameras' video cuts off after 30 minutes to avoid them being classified as video cameras (which attract 5.4% duty because they are considered to be video recorders
- koolba 6y ago
  Reminds me of those light trucks that get ripped apart to create passenger cars. EDIT: I had it backwards. The tax is on trucks and it gets circumvented by importing them as passenger cars: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax
  - triangleman 6y ago
    Nah, light trucks are in a whole other category (or exempt, I don't know) in "CAFE" standards, so that's why you see so many SUV's in America.
- Ductapemaster 6y ago
  That's a really interesting piece of knowledge — thank you for sharing!
- fomine3 6y ago
  Economic Partnership Agreement between Japan and EU had signed that abolishes the video camera tax. Most camera brands are in Japan but I don't know how many cameras made in Japan. This Japanese article describing the agreement especially for cameras. I can't find English articles like this. https://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/zooma/1171774.html https://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/zooma/1171774.htm... This is the original agreement text that's too long didn't read. https://www.mofa.go.jp/ecm/ie/page4e_000875.html https://www.mofa.go.jp/ecm/ie/page4e_000875.html
Ductapemaster 6y ago
At the end of the day, it's just a calculated risk and this is one opinion on one side. My DSLR was quite expensive and I love using it for photography, so if there is any risk of damaging the sensor I will not be taking it. YMMV.
- serf 6y ago
  >..if there is any risk of damaging the sensor I will not be taking it. YMMV. curious. what would it take for you to be convinced it does no harm? Just a psychological curiosity -- not trying to annoy you. The opinions seem fairly stacked, and the corporations seem to be fairly non-chalantly enabling video/high-volume sampling on these sensors. The only person in your linked SO thread said "it might wear out the sensor because it wasn't designed for that amount of sampling", so one google's 'Can you wear out a CMOS image sensor from over-use?', and get linked to another SO thread where it's more-or-less concluded that the CMOS sensor doesn't wear practically.[0] I can understand the 'calculated risk' mentality, but honestly it seems like physical jostling from unpacking the equipment from its' case or exposure to a mid-high level humidity environment, stuff that's done every day by photographers around the world, would be many times more damaging to the investment that just running the solid-state components more often. Not many DSLR appliance failures are from solid-state device failures. [0] : https://photo.stackexchange.com/questions/15127/do-sensors-wear-out https://photo.stackexchange.com/questions/15127/do-sensors-w...
  - Ductapemaster 6y ago
    Not annoyed at all! I enjoy chatting about these things. In my dream scenario? I think I'd love to see a scientific analysis on the topic and some real data. A blog post with someone taking apart a DSLR, instrumenting the sensor and the surrounding electronics with a thermocouple to measure how hot it really gets over time, and proving it doesn't get to a point of damage would go a long way for me, and I would generally be interested in it. How hot does it actually get?? The wishy-washy "wear out" arguments I don't find particularly convincing (I did FPGA design for an endoscopic camera company for a couple years, so I am familiar with CMOS sensors in general). These DSLR sensors are quite large and I imagine can produce a significant amount of heat, and for all intents and purposes are built into systems that are intended for periodic use with photography. The manufacturing tolerances needed to build a system safe for continuous sampling/use don't particularly make sense when designing a photography camera ($$$). I'm dubious the manufacturers actually did the design optimizing for video use, and I presume this is why there are warnings in the manuals about continuous video use and limitations in the firmware. Maybe there's enough tolerance to handle some video, but not all the time. I think I was a little careless in specifically calling out "sensor damage" — I'd actually be more concerned about the surrounding components than the sensor itself. Capacitors age and change tolerance in response to temperature cycling, for example.

myself248 6y ago

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the 30m limit is due to some taxes or regulations on "video cameras", right? Edit: Yup. https://petapixel.com/2012/05/21/30-minute-video-limit-in-digital-cameras-may-be-on-its-way-out/ https://petapixel.com/2012/05/21/30-minute-video-limit-in-di... > At present [2012], digital cameras' video cuts off after 30 minutes to avoid them being classified as video cameras (which attract 5.4% duty because they are considered to be video recorders

koolba 6y ago
Reminds me of those light trucks that get ripped apart to create passenger cars. EDIT: I had it backwards. The tax is on trucks and it gets circumvented by importing them as passenger cars: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax
- triangleman 6y ago
  Nah, light trucks are in a whole other category (or exempt, I don't know) in "CAFE" standards, so that's why you see so many SUV's in America.
Ductapemaster 6y ago
That's a really interesting piece of knowledge — thank you for sharing!
fomine3 6y ago
Economic Partnership Agreement between Japan and EU had signed that abolishes the video camera tax. Most camera brands are in Japan but I don't know how many cameras made in Japan. This Japanese article describing the agreement especially for cameras. I can't find English articles like this. https://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/zooma/1171774.html https://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/zooma/1171774.htm... This is the original agreement text that's too long didn't read. https://www.mofa.go.jp/ecm/ie/page4e_000875.html https://www.mofa.go.jp/ecm/ie/page4e_000875.html

Ductapemaster 6y ago

At the end of the day, it's just a calculated risk and this is one opinion on one side. My DSLR was quite expensive and I love using it for photography, so if there is any risk of damaging the sensor I will not be taking it. YMMV.

serf 6y ago
>..if there is any risk of damaging the sensor I will not be taking it. YMMV. curious. what would it take for you to be convinced it does no harm? Just a psychological curiosity -- not trying to annoy you. The opinions seem fairly stacked, and the corporations seem to be fairly non-chalantly enabling video/high-volume sampling on these sensors. The only person in your linked SO thread said "it might wear out the sensor because it wasn't designed for that amount of sampling", so one google's 'Can you wear out a CMOS image sensor from over-use?', and get linked to another SO thread where it's more-or-less concluded that the CMOS sensor doesn't wear practically.[0] I can understand the 'calculated risk' mentality, but honestly it seems like physical jostling from unpacking the equipment from its' case or exposure to a mid-high level humidity environment, stuff that's done every day by photographers around the world, would be many times more damaging to the investment that just running the solid-state components more often. Not many DSLR appliance failures are from solid-state device failures. [0] : https://photo.stackexchange.com/questions/15127/do-sensors-wear-out https://photo.stackexchange.com/questions/15127/do-sensors-w...
- Ductapemaster 6y ago
  Not annoyed at all! I enjoy chatting about these things. In my dream scenario? I think I'd love to see a scientific analysis on the topic and some real data. A blog post with someone taking apart a DSLR, instrumenting the sensor and the surrounding electronics with a thermocouple to measure how hot it really gets over time, and proving it doesn't get to a point of damage would go a long way for me, and I would generally be interested in it. How hot does it actually get?? The wishy-washy "wear out" arguments I don't find particularly convincing (I did FPGA design for an endoscopic camera company for a couple years, so I am familiar with CMOS sensors in general). These DSLR sensors are quite large and I imagine can produce a significant amount of heat, and for all intents and purposes are built into systems that are intended for periodic use with photography. The manufacturing tolerances needed to build a system safe for continuous sampling/use don't particularly make sense when designing a photography camera ($$$). I'm dubious the manufacturers actually did the design optimizing for video use, and I presume this is why there are warnings in the manuals about continuous video use and limitations in the firmware. Maybe there's enough tolerance to handle some video, but not all the time. I think I was a little careless in specifically calling out "sensor damage" — I'd actually be more concerned about the surrounding components than the sensor itself. Capacitors age and change tolerance in response to temperature cycling, for example.