4 ms·

Unless you can tell me ahead of time which police reports are going to end in violence, I suggest you reconsider your thinking. Sometimes something as innocent

Unless you can tell me ahead of time which police reports are going to end in violence, I suggest you reconsider your thinking. Sometimes something as innocent as a speeding ticket turns into a shooting. Watch some episodes of actual police incidents. Drunk people can be armed. Domestically abused people can live in dangerous neighborhoods with gangs present. Sorry, a camera is not going to defend you from the Latin Kings. Violent criminals do not care about your unicorn ideals. If they sense police are nerfed, they will fill that power vacuum with gang violence and drive out the police. You tell me why Ciudad Juarez is one of the most dangerous cities in the world but El Paso, directly across the U.S.-Mexico border is relatively safe. That's policing.

viklove 6y ago
> You tell me why Ciudad Juarez is one of the most dangerous cities in the world but El Paso, directly across the U.S.-Mexico border is relatively safe. That's policing. Lol, it's not because police are engaging in shoot-outs with the cartel. It's because we have a judicial system that will not stop going after you, and that is all done non-violently.
- chrisco255 6y ago
  Mexico has a judicial system, too.
  - viklove 6y ago
    One that is very susceptible to bribery and threats. If you threaten a judge in the US, you're in for a world of hurt.
cwkoss 6y ago
> Watch some episodes of actual police incidents. It sounds like your perspective is formed form viewing the TV show "Cops". This is not representative of reality. 106 police officers died while on duty in 2018 (of all causes, not just violence from public - 55 officers were feloniously killed while 51 died accidentally). 986 citizens were fatally shot by police in the same year. Situations where police are able to survive only because they were able to quickdraw and shoot a criminal first like some sort of cowboy are vanishingly rare and possibly purely fantasy. Is trading the lives of a few hundred citizens worth saving the 0-2 cops in these rare situations per year? Call in the cavalry when needed, but most cops do not need to be armed all the time.
- chrisco255 6y ago
  No, I come from a family of first responders. Paramedics, firefighters and cops. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/12/27/police-deaths-144-killed-line-duty-2018/2423797002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/12/27/police-deaths... 144 died in 2018. 96 already in 2020 and we're not half done. https://www.odmp.org/search/year https://www.odmp.org/search/year 986 citizens, of which 47 were un-armed. Twisting stats to feed your narrative won't change reality. They're only vanishingly rare in the least dangerous neighborhoods, which incidentally need less policing than the most dangerous ones such as St. Louis, Memphis, and Baltimore. Yes, armed people threatening innocent lives deserve to be shot and killed. You can't wait for the cavalry when someone is armed and dangerous. If you're police you are the cavalry.
  - jakelazaroff 6y ago
    > 986 citizens, of which 47 were un-armed. Twisting stats to feed your narrative won't change reality. This argument baffles me. Do the Second and Fifth Amendments not exist? Possessing a firearm is not grounds for summary execution.
    - hkai 6y ago
      Come on, don't twist the facts. We can do better than that. Today I received an email from Coursera advocating for a black transgender man who was "executed". Or, as it turned out, he killed a person and then pointed a gun at the police. Before that, he also posted his intentions on Facebook. Is that your hero? Second amendment allows you to carry a weapon. You will be shot immediately when you point a gun at the police. Both statements are true and are not going to change. They do not contradict each other. Which part of that do you disagree with?
      - jakelazaroff 6y ago
        You think that in every single one of the 939 remaining cases in which the victims were armed, they were using their weapons to threaten the police? I find it far more likely that in many of those cases, officers were unwilling to accept the risk that ostensibly comes with the job and simply opened fire when they realized the victim was armed. We know this happens; see for example Philando Castile. By black trans man, I assume you’re referring to Tony McDade. The only account of his killing so far has come from the police themselves, who avoid accountability like the plague, so let’s begin by taking that with a massive shaker of salt. But even if their account is true, the ideal outcome would have been for him to be arrested alive. Why is it too much to ask police to attempt to deescalate the situation before resorting to lethal force?

viklove 6y ago

> You tell me why Ciudad Juarez is one of the most dangerous cities in the world but El Paso, directly across the U.S.-Mexico border is relatively safe. That's policing. Lol, it's not because police are engaging in shoot-outs with the cartel. It's because we have a judicial system that will not stop going after you, and that is all done non-violently.

chrisco255 6y ago
Mexico has a judicial system, too.
- viklove 6y ago
  One that is very susceptible to bribery and threats. If you threaten a judge in the US, you're in for a world of hurt.

cwkoss 6y ago

> Watch some episodes of actual police incidents. It sounds like your perspective is formed form viewing the TV show "Cops". This is not representative of reality. 106 police officers died while on duty in 2018 (of all causes, not just violence from public - 55 officers were feloniously killed while 51 died accidentally). 986 citizens were fatally shot by police in the same year. Situations where police are able to survive only because they were able to quickdraw and shoot a criminal first like some sort of cowboy are vanishingly rare and possibly purely fantasy. Is trading the lives of a few hundred citizens worth saving the 0-2 cops in these rare situations per year? Call in the cavalry when needed, but most cops do not need to be armed all the time.

chrisco255 6y ago
No, I come from a family of first responders. Paramedics, firefighters and cops. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/12/27/police-deaths-144-killed-line-duty-2018/2423797002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/12/27/police-deaths... 144 died in 2018. 96 already in 2020 and we're not half done. https://www.odmp.org/search/year https://www.odmp.org/search/year 986 citizens, of which 47 were un-armed. Twisting stats to feed your narrative won't change reality. They're only vanishingly rare in the least dangerous neighborhoods, which incidentally need less policing than the most dangerous ones such as St. Louis, Memphis, and Baltimore. Yes, armed people threatening innocent lives deserve to be shot and killed. You can't wait for the cavalry when someone is armed and dangerous. If you're police you are the cavalry.
- jakelazaroff 6y ago
  > 986 citizens, of which 47 were un-armed. Twisting stats to feed your narrative won't change reality. This argument baffles me. Do the Second and Fifth Amendments not exist? Possessing a firearm is not grounds for summary execution.
  - hkai 6y ago
    Come on, don't twist the facts. We can do better than that. Today I received an email from Coursera advocating for a black transgender man who was "executed". Or, as it turned out, he killed a person and then pointed a gun at the police. Before that, he also posted his intentions on Facebook. Is that your hero? Second amendment allows you to carry a weapon. You will be shot immediately when you point a gun at the police. Both statements are true and are not going to change. They do not contradict each other. Which part of that do you disagree with?
    - jakelazaroff 6y ago
      You think that in every single one of the 939 remaining cases in which the victims were armed, they were using their weapons to threaten the police? I find it far more likely that in many of those cases, officers were unwilling to accept the risk that ostensibly comes with the job and simply opened fire when they realized the victim was armed. We know this happens; see for example Philando Castile. By black trans man, I assume you’re referring to Tony McDade. The only account of his killing so far has come from the police themselves, who avoid accountability like the plague, so let’s begin by taking that with a massive shaker of salt. But even if their account is true, the ideal outcome would have been for him to be arrested alive. Why is it too much to ask police to attempt to deescalate the situation before resorting to lethal force?