2 ms·

I'm not really sure what you're arguing for. It seemed to be that "the police are more of a threat than criminals", which is factually untrue, even today, befor

I'm not really sure what you're arguing for. It seemed to be that "the police are more of a threat than criminals", which is factually untrue, even today, before any so-called abolition of the police (which is what people are calling for.) Also, I am not "on a side" and my original comment was calling out this attempt to make it a black-and-white issue. There are more than two options.

stormbrew 6y ago
That the police are more of a threat to criminals to specific subsets of the population is absolutely, unquestionably, factually true. There is more than enough personal attestation to the experiences of black and queer people (including those who otherwise have privilege in some ways) in the US with police to say this with confidence. They aren't to you perhaps. And again, when people call for abolition of the police they are not talking about leaving a complete vacuum of every function they serve in society. They are calling for dismantling police departments completely and replacing their functions in society with other, more directly capable, social systems. You may want to actually read some of what's been written on the topic instead of having a knee jerk reaction that assumes the worst.
- ceilingcorner 6y ago
  Any statistic is true of a small subset of the population. To use your example of black people: Killed in 2018: Black or African American 2,925 Police killed 1,098 people in 2019. (I can't find exact numbers by race) Again, I'm not arguing that there isn't police bias against minorities, that they aren't disportionally affected, or anything like this. But the facts simply show that the police kill less people than other people do, so it seems like a stretch to say they're more of a threat. In regards to the other point: that may be the case, but that isn't what "abolish" and "dismantle" mean. I still don't see how you avoid some amount of armed protective personnel (to deal with shootings or robberies) which are basically police.
  - xnyan 6y ago
    > But the facts simply show that the police kill less people than other people do The total number of police is a fraction of the population of the united states. Do you really not understand even the most basic math or is this argument in bad faith?

stormbrew 6y ago

That the police are more of a threat to criminals to specific subsets of the population is absolutely, unquestionably, factually true. There is more than enough personal attestation to the experiences of black and queer people (including those who otherwise have privilege in some ways) in the US with police to say this with confidence. They aren't to you perhaps. And again, when people call for abolition of the police they are not talking about leaving a complete vacuum of every function they serve in society. They are calling for dismantling police departments completely and replacing their functions in society with other, more directly capable, social systems. You may want to actually read some of what's been written on the topic instead of having a knee jerk reaction that assumes the worst.

ceilingcorner 6y ago
Any statistic is true of a small subset of the population. To use your example of black people: Killed in 2018: Black or African American 2,925 Police killed 1,098 people in 2019. (I can't find exact numbers by race) Again, I'm not arguing that there isn't police bias against minorities, that they aren't disportionally affected, or anything like this. But the facts simply show that the police kill less people than other people do, so it seems like a stretch to say they're more of a threat. In regards to the other point: that may be the case, but that isn't what "abolish" and "dismantle" mean. I still don't see how you avoid some amount of armed protective personnel (to deal with shootings or robberies) which are basically police.
- xnyan 6y ago
  > But the facts simply show that the police kill less people than other people do The total number of police is a fraction of the population of the united states. Do you really not understand even the most basic math or is this argument in bad faith?