6 ms·

Imagine a world in which we don't need individual cars, because public transport is sufficient; passengers and cargo are pooled into compartments; compartments

by dmos62 6y ago

Imagine a world in which we don't need individual cars, because public transport is sufficient; passengers and cargo are pooled into compartments; compartments pooled and unpooled mid-trip as needed to maximize total efficiency; where traffic runs underground and on a rail where that makes sense; where stations can be very large or very small based on traffic; where the economics of laying out the tunnels is such that it makes sense to build small stations; where car roads are a rarity; where safety is not relient on human judgment, skill or reaction time; where transportation is not dependent on fossil fuels. Aah, those things are pleasant to imagine.

chasd00 6y ago
then imagine when politics declares reason to turn it off and everyone is basically trapped. Maybe a global pandemic or something...
einpoklum 6y ago
> Imagine a world in which we don't need individual cars, because public transport is sufficient This is already true when you augment public transport with bike lanes, cheap or public bicycles, and slow narrow vehicles for the movement-impaired which can go on bike lanes. ... that is, in many cities in the world, especially in Europe. The Netherlands is particularly good in this respect.
gonzo41 6y ago
Or, Imagine where we toll everyone daily who get's on a highway in a car, and instead provide sheltered lanes for bicycles. And those bikes are simple sturdy steel bikes with wire cage panniers and can hold a ton. And in this utopian world a lot of health related issues are reduced because of the incidental exercise that people get on commuting around.
- dmos62 6y ago
  True. Once you get rid of cars, the world is a bicycle lane.
- ajuc 6y ago
  That world is called Europe :) Taxation is indirect, gasoline is taxed.
  - gruez 6y ago
    There's taxes on gasoline in the us and most other countries as well
  - gindely 6y ago
    Which is great for all those people who fill up on electricity. Mostly rich people.
    - ajuc 6y ago
      Many more people ride bikes than drive electric vehicles.
    - gambiting 6y ago
      I mean, it is cheaper but it's not that cheap. There was recently a post here showing very clearly that for example in Germany electricity is so expensive that a good diesel car beats it in terms of cost easily. Even here in the UK if I were to charge at public points it would again be cheaper to just drive a diesel. It only becomes cheaper when I charge at home with a good tariff. Besides, seeing as our roads are exclusively maintained from fuel taxes, I cannot see this going on forever - the government will have to find a way to tax the electricity going into electric cars somehow.
      - JoeAltmaier 6y ago
        I imagine an odometer reading would do the trick. Like a gas meter, but on electric cars.
        gambiting 6y ago
        I mean the car I have(volvo phev) currently has a deal where Volvo pays me back for the 1st year of electricity used by the car, they do it by having the car automatically upload the number of kWh used to Volvo servers, then they will pay me back based on the number of kWh I've used during that year. I don't see why something similar couldn't be done for taxes - the car keeps track of kWh used and you just pay tax based on how much you used. Obviously, that runs into certain immediate problems - like, what if you drive abroad? Normally you'd simply buy fuel while abroad, so therefore contribute to taxes there - but with this system this wouldn't work anymore.
- m0xte 6y ago
  Better plan for all the hip and knee replacements. Nothing is utopia. In fact any utopia is probably a dystopia.
  - TopHand 6y ago
    Bicycling is actually good for your hip and knees. https://creakyjoints.org/diet-exercise/cycling-and-arthritis/ https://creakyjoints.org/diet-exercise/cycling-and-arthritis...
    - m0xte 6y ago
      I suggest you look for more than just arthritis related information. The amount of mechanical wear it causes is significant over time. That is not to say it doesn't have benefits but to suggest the entire population can haul their arse on a bike doing a 20mi round trip every day for 40 years and be hopping along nicely is a dream. Not to mention the incidental injuries of which my colleagues suffer from, and myself going back a few years (hospital wasn't much fun)
      - gindely 6y ago
        No, come on, provide something concrete. Searching for "cycling joint wear" just provides unreliable sources saying you don't use your joints up, but it doesn't provide unreliable (or reliable) sources saying the opposite. It is easy to avoid incidental injuries, and everyone would much rather the trauma of an incidental cycling accident than the trauma of a highspeed car crash. Mentioning them in just scaremongering. Ride at a safe speed on a proper path and look where your going. If you can't look where you're going, you're going too fast; slow down. (You can't say "proper paths don't exist", because we're talking about the dreamland in which they do, therefore, by definition, they do.) 20 mi round trips are unlikely. You get long trips in cities developed for cars.
        kaybe 6y ago
        And get a properly fitted bike. Japan, I'm looking at you.

by dmos62 6y ago

chasd00 6y ago

then imagine when politics declares reason to turn it off and everyone is basically trapped. Maybe a global pandemic or something...

einpoklum 6y ago

> Imagine a world in which we don't need individual cars, because public transport is sufficient This is already true when you augment public transport with bike lanes, cheap or public bicycles, and slow narrow vehicles for the movement-impaired which can go on bike lanes. ... that is, in many cities in the world, especially in Europe. The Netherlands is particularly good in this respect.

gonzo41 6y ago

Or, Imagine where we toll everyone daily who get's on a highway in a car, and instead provide sheltered lanes for bicycles. And those bikes are simple sturdy steel bikes with wire cage panniers and can hold a ton. And in this utopian world a lot of health related issues are reduced because of the incidental exercise that people get on commuting around.

dmos62 6y ago
True. Once you get rid of cars, the world is a bicycle lane.
ajuc 6y ago
That world is called Europe :) Taxation is indirect, gasoline is taxed.
- gruez 6y ago
  There's taxes on gasoline in the us and most other countries as well
- gindely 6y ago
  Which is great for all those people who fill up on electricity. Mostly rich people.
  - ajuc 6y ago
    Many more people ride bikes than drive electric vehicles.
  - gambiting 6y ago
    I mean, it is cheaper but it's not that cheap. There was recently a post here showing very clearly that for example in Germany electricity is so expensive that a good diesel car beats it in terms of cost easily. Even here in the UK if I were to charge at public points it would again be cheaper to just drive a diesel. It only becomes cheaper when I charge at home with a good tariff. Besides, seeing as our roads are exclusively maintained from fuel taxes, I cannot see this going on forever - the government will have to find a way to tax the electricity going into electric cars somehow.
    - JoeAltmaier 6y ago
      I imagine an odometer reading would do the trick. Like a gas meter, but on electric cars.
      - gambiting 6y ago
        I mean the car I have(volvo phev) currently has a deal where Volvo pays me back for the 1st year of electricity used by the car, they do it by having the car automatically upload the number of kWh used to Volvo servers, then they will pay me back based on the number of kWh I've used during that year. I don't see why something similar couldn't be done for taxes - the car keeps track of kWh used and you just pay tax based on how much you used. Obviously, that runs into certain immediate problems - like, what if you drive abroad? Normally you'd simply buy fuel while abroad, so therefore contribute to taxes there - but with this system this wouldn't work anymore.
m0xte 6y ago
Better plan for all the hip and knee replacements. Nothing is utopia. In fact any utopia is probably a dystopia.
- TopHand 6y ago
  Bicycling is actually good for your hip and knees. https://creakyjoints.org/diet-exercise/cycling-and-arthritis/ https://creakyjoints.org/diet-exercise/cycling-and-arthritis...
  - m0xte 6y ago
    I suggest you look for more than just arthritis related information. The amount of mechanical wear it causes is significant over time. That is not to say it doesn't have benefits but to suggest the entire population can haul their arse on a bike doing a 20mi round trip every day for 40 years and be hopping along nicely is a dream. Not to mention the incidental injuries of which my colleagues suffer from, and myself going back a few years (hospital wasn't much fun)
    - gindely 6y ago
      No, come on, provide something concrete. Searching for "cycling joint wear" just provides unreliable sources saying you don't use your joints up, but it doesn't provide unreliable (or reliable) sources saying the opposite. It is easy to avoid incidental injuries, and everyone would much rather the trauma of an incidental cycling accident than the trauma of a highspeed car crash. Mentioning them in just scaremongering. Ride at a safe speed on a proper path and look where your going. If you can't look where you're going, you're going too fast; slow down. (You can't say "proper paths don't exist", because we're talking about the dreamland in which they do, therefore, by definition, they do.) 20 mi round trips are unlikely. You get long trips in cities developed for cars.
      - kaybe 6y ago
        And get a properly fitted bike. Japan, I'm looking at you.