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Because in those languages: . dependencies are carefully considered by users . dependencies are not added recursively . dependencies try to be dependency-fre

Because in those languages: . dependencies are carefully considered by users . dependencies are not added recursively . dependencies try to be dependency-free themselves to assist with the previous point . dependencies are not blindly nor automatically updated . dependencies solve important domain problems, they are not trivial one-line-functions . dependencies are typically developed and tested by a known team or company, which you trust, not just someone random . binaries can be signed . support contracts are a thing . etc etc etc...

muratsu 6y ago
What you’ve said has nothing to do with languages. Claiming X devs are better than Y devs is just your bias. Other languages can be more domain specific, have more frictions around using package management, and have less nr of developers.
- jfkebwjsbx 6y ago
  I have nowhere claimed anything about devs being better/worse.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
lol636363 6y ago
This is 100% true especially stupid libraries that are someone's class project. And JavaScript developers are so used to dependency hell that one of my developer imported 3rd party package for date formatting.
- com2kid 6y ago
  JS's built in date formatting/handling is terrible and often do what needs to be one. MomentJS may be a giant import, but it works an it works really well.
  - jakobloekke 6y ago
    It’s the closest thing we have to a useful standard library. Date handling in js without a library is a code smell.
    - lol636363 6y ago
      I am confused, are you using MomentJS for fancy output like 3 days ago etc or for simple output like 5/31/2020? I can see how it is useful in former case but seems overkill in later case.
      - runarberg 6y ago
        Safari is lacking in support (again) but we have `Intl.RelativeTimeFormat`[1] new Intl.RelativeTimeFormat("default").format(-3, "day") 1: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Reference/Global_Objects/Intl/RelativeTimeFormat/RelativeTimeFormat https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Refe...
  - runarberg 6y ago
    Formatting is fine. Take a look at `Intl.DateTimeFormat`[1]. Then there is a proposal for `Temporal`[2] which will make handling a lot easier. [1]: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Reference/Global_Objects/Intl/DateTimeFormat https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Refe... [2]: https://github.com/tc39/proposal-temporal https://github.com/tc39/proposal-temporal
- judge2020 6y ago
  This seems to be a similar situation to the Bootstrap fallacy where you use the same frameworks every time you make something in a language to make it quick and easy for developers to work on all of your company's projects by just learning one. Using the same familiar libraries is great for reducing the amount of time it'll take to train someone to work on and maintain a large portion of your company's tech.
bryanrasmussen 6y ago
the parent said something about problems being solved if there was a standard library, and if perhaps there were a standard library people would be willing to write more code instead of just adding another dependency. I believe these points dependencies are carefully considered by users dependencies try to be dependency-free themselves to assist with the previous point dependencies solve important domain problems, they are not trivial one-line-functions dependencies are typically developed and tested by a known team or company, which you trust, not just someone random would be solved by the parent comment's proposed standard library.
- Volt 6y ago
  True to an extent, but consider Python which has a standard library and has also seen some of these same types of security breaches.
- jfkebwjsbx 6y ago
  A good standard library helps, no doubt. However, it is not required. One of the languages mentioned was C++. That language has a tiny standard lib in comparison to Java. So it is mainly a "cultural" thing and how projects are structured and reviewed.
  - addicted 6y ago
    C++ had a tiny standard library. That’s why Boost exists (although much of its functionality has been subsumed into the std lib now).

muratsu 6y ago

What you’ve said has nothing to do with languages. Claiming X devs are better than Y devs is just your bias. Other languages can be more domain specific, have more frictions around using package management, and have less nr of developers.

jfkebwjsbx 6y ago
I have nowhere claimed anything about devs being better/worse.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

lol636363 6y ago

This is 100% true especially stupid libraries that are someone's class project. And JavaScript developers are so used to dependency hell that one of my developer imported 3rd party package for date formatting.

com2kid 6y ago
JS's built in date formatting/handling is terrible and often do what needs to be one. MomentJS may be a giant import, but it works an it works really well.
- jakobloekke 6y ago
  It’s the closest thing we have to a useful standard library. Date handling in js without a library is a code smell.
  - lol636363 6y ago
    I am confused, are you using MomentJS for fancy output like 3 days ago etc or for simple output like 5/31/2020? I can see how it is useful in former case but seems overkill in later case.
    - runarberg 6y ago
      Safari is lacking in support (again) but we have `Intl.RelativeTimeFormat`[1] new Intl.RelativeTimeFormat("default").format(-3, "day") 1: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Reference/Global_Objects/Intl/RelativeTimeFormat/RelativeTimeFormat https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Refe...
- runarberg 6y ago
  Formatting is fine. Take a look at `Intl.DateTimeFormat`[1]. Then there is a proposal for `Temporal`[2] which will make handling a lot easier. [1]: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Reference/Global_Objects/Intl/DateTimeFormat https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/JavaScript/Refe... [2]: https://github.com/tc39/proposal-temporal https://github.com/tc39/proposal-temporal
judge2020 6y ago
This seems to be a similar situation to the Bootstrap fallacy where you use the same frameworks every time you make something in a language to make it quick and easy for developers to work on all of your company's projects by just learning one. Using the same familiar libraries is great for reducing the amount of time it'll take to train someone to work on and maintain a large portion of your company's tech.

bryanrasmussen 6y ago

the parent said something about problems being solved if there was a standard library, and if perhaps there were a standard library people would be willing to write more code instead of just adding another dependency. I believe these points dependencies are carefully considered by users dependencies try to be dependency-free themselves to assist with the previous point dependencies solve important domain problems, they are not trivial one-line-functions dependencies are typically developed and tested by a known team or company, which you trust, not just someone random would be solved by the parent comment's proposed standard library.

Volt 6y ago
True to an extent, but consider Python which has a standard library and has also seen some of these same types of security breaches.
jfkebwjsbx 6y ago
A good standard library helps, no doubt. However, it is not required. One of the languages mentioned was C++. That language has a tiny standard lib in comparison to Java. So it is mainly a "cultural" thing and how projects are structured and reviewed.
- addicted 6y ago
  C++ had a tiny standard library. That’s why Boost exists (although much of its functionality has been subsumed into the std lib now).