5 ms·

I wonder how many hops it will actually remove. I just tested it, and from my apartment in Mountain View, CA to my VPS in a data center ~20 miles away in Fremon

I wonder how many hops it will actually remove. I just tested it, and from my apartment in Mountain View, CA to my VPS in a data center ~20 miles away in Fremont, CA I get 14(!) hops.

kbenson 6y ago
It's all about peering. Once they're in more exchanges, and it becomes cost effective to set up peering with them, more traffic will reach them directly asdifferent providers set up peering to both reduce costs across other links and provide better access.
dahfizz 6y ago
> I wonder how many hops it will actually remove. Hopefully a lot! Fun fact, IPv4 and IPv6 have a maximum network size. Because of the TTL field in v4 (renamed max hops in v6), a path through an IP network can never be more than 255 hops long.
- xxpor 6y ago
  You can tunnel though, so the actual amount of hops could be infinite. Routers can also rewrite the field.
  - dahfizz 6y ago
    And just like NAT with IPv4, we will use hacks to get around implementing a proper solution for decades (and counting). With satellite internet taking off, and actual interest in extraterrestrial colonies from e.g. NASA and SpaceX, I think we need a proper space communication protocol. Maybe it can all be solved in L2, but I think we will soon be looking at 255 hops the way we look at the limited address space of v4.
    - nitrogen 6y ago
      It seems people are working on this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Internet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Internet
      - rmdashrfstar 6y ago
        Thanks for posting this, reading about all the progress made with delay tolerant networking is exciting!
      - AdrianoKF 6y ago
        Interesting (but probably not too surprising) to see that DTN research is alive and kicking! I wrote a short seminar paper on DTN protocols as an undergrad in '09, so thanks for the trip down memory lane!
- tinus_hn 6y ago
  Hops are artificial, as long as you are 100% sure you’re not introducing loops you can just tell routers not to decrease the TTL and they’ll be invisible. It’s just that if you do that and you do introduce a loop the packets will keep looping and the network will very quickly overflow.
aeyes 6y ago
It all depends on peering, I get 13 hops to some networks in Europe which is some 12.000km away from here (7500 freedom units).
shaklee3 6y ago
Mentioned above, but it won't. The hops are up and down to boats instead of routers.

I wonder how many hops it will actually remove. I just tested it, and from my apartment in Mountain View, CA to my VPS in a data center ~20 miles away in Fremont, CA I get 14(!) hops.

kbenson 6y ago

It's all about peering. Once they're in more exchanges, and it becomes cost effective to set up peering with them, more traffic will reach them directly asdifferent providers set up peering to both reduce costs across other links and provide better access.

dahfizz 6y ago

> I wonder how many hops it will actually remove. Hopefully a lot! Fun fact, IPv4 and IPv6 have a maximum network size. Because of the TTL field in v4 (renamed max hops in v6), a path through an IP network can never be more than 255 hops long.

xxpor 6y ago
You can tunnel though, so the actual amount of hops could be infinite. Routers can also rewrite the field.
- dahfizz 6y ago
  And just like NAT with IPv4, we will use hacks to get around implementing a proper solution for decades (and counting). With satellite internet taking off, and actual interest in extraterrestrial colonies from e.g. NASA and SpaceX, I think we need a proper space communication protocol. Maybe it can all be solved in L2, but I think we will soon be looking at 255 hops the way we look at the limited address space of v4.
  - nitrogen 6y ago
    It seems people are working on this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Internet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interplanetary_Internet
    - rmdashrfstar 6y ago
      Thanks for posting this, reading about all the progress made with delay tolerant networking is exciting!
    - AdrianoKF 6y ago
      Interesting (but probably not too surprising) to see that DTN research is alive and kicking! I wrote a short seminar paper on DTN protocols as an undergrad in '09, so thanks for the trip down memory lane!
tinus_hn 6y ago
Hops are artificial, as long as you are 100% sure you’re not introducing loops you can just tell routers not to decrease the TTL and they’ll be invisible. It’s just that if you do that and you do introduce a loop the packets will keep looping and the network will very quickly overflow.

aeyes 6y ago

It all depends on peering, I get 13 hops to some networks in Europe which is some 12.000km away from here (7500 freedom units).

shaklee3 6y ago

Mentioned above, but it won't. The hops are up and down to boats instead of routers.