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> Low tax dividends and capital gains benifit individuals without active participation in the value creation. Presumably, actively working (like with a job) to

> Low tax dividends and capital gains benifit individuals without active participation in the value creation. Presumably, actively working (like with a job) to generate wealth to invest in other enterprises is 'active participation in the value creation'. I mean, sure, if you want to introduce steep capital gains on invested capital that was inherited, or won, or whatever, that's fine.

s1artibartfast 6y ago
>Presumably, actively working (like with a job) to generate wealth to invest in other enterprises is 'active participation in the value creation'. This is my exact point. Working (like with a job) creates value. Investing money in a secondary market for stocks generates no value whatsoever. Perhaps it keeps some stock brokers emplayed
- tathougies 6y ago
  > Investing money in a secondary market for stocks generates no value whatsoever. Great, then let's open the primary market (which does generate value) up to individual investors. Unfortunately, this value generating mechanism has been legislated away.
  - s1artibartfast 6y ago
    Im open to lessinging restrictings on accredited investors to allow more access. That said, it is worth pointing out that public investors do have access to primary market IPOs. That said, I do think this is somewhat beside the point of how capital gains should be taxed. I think that stock appreciation profit should be taxed at least as high as personal income.
    - tathougies 6y ago
      > I think that stock appreciation profit should be taxed at least as high as personal income. I don't understand why... if I invest money I worked to earn, the profit from putting that money to use should be taxed three times: once while paying the employee the company hires to carry out business, twice after profit is calculated and corporate income tax taken, and then thrice when they tax me for the dividend. Surely twice is enough? > That said, it is worth pointing out that public investors do have access to primary market IPOs. Not quite, the have access to the resellers of the primary market IPO. The original buyers of the equity are the underwriters plus whoever registered during the road show -- and they must be accredited I believe.
      - s1artibartfast 6y ago
        >I don't understand why... if I invest money I worked to earn, the profit from putting that money to use should be taxed three times: once while paying the employee the company hires to carry out business, twice after profit is calculated and corporate income tax taken, and then thrice when they tax me for the dividend. Surely twice is enough? My point is that if you are investing in a secondary market, you are not putting that money to use. It goes into the pocket of whoever sold you the stock and the company doesn't see a dime from the transaction. If we must have taxes, I would rather have them not come from earned income (like a job), which takes labor and creates value. Income from the secondary market require no labor, and create no value. If you believe rewarding and incentivizing value creation is more moral and socially desirable. Rewarding individuals for simply possessing assets is at best neutral.

s1artibartfast 6y ago

>Presumably, actively working (like with a job) to generate wealth to invest in other enterprises is 'active participation in the value creation'. This is my exact point. Working (like with a job) creates value. Investing money in a secondary market for stocks generates no value whatsoever. Perhaps it keeps some stock brokers emplayed

tathougies 6y ago
> Investing money in a secondary market for stocks generates no value whatsoever. Great, then let's open the primary market (which does generate value) up to individual investors. Unfortunately, this value generating mechanism has been legislated away.
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  Im open to lessinging restrictings on accredited investors to allow more access. That said, it is worth pointing out that public investors do have access to primary market IPOs. That said, I do think this is somewhat beside the point of how capital gains should be taxed. I think that stock appreciation profit should be taxed at least as high as personal income.
  - tathougies 6y ago
    > I think that stock appreciation profit should be taxed at least as high as personal income. I don't understand why... if I invest money I worked to earn, the profit from putting that money to use should be taxed three times: once while paying the employee the company hires to carry out business, twice after profit is calculated and corporate income tax taken, and then thrice when they tax me for the dividend. Surely twice is enough? > That said, it is worth pointing out that public investors do have access to primary market IPOs. Not quite, the have access to the resellers of the primary market IPO. The original buyers of the equity are the underwriters plus whoever registered during the road show -- and they must be accredited I believe.
    - s1artibartfast 6y ago
      >I don't understand why... if I invest money I worked to earn, the profit from putting that money to use should be taxed three times: once while paying the employee the company hires to carry out business, twice after profit is calculated and corporate income tax taken, and then thrice when they tax me for the dividend. Surely twice is enough? My point is that if you are investing in a secondary market, you are not putting that money to use. It goes into the pocket of whoever sold you the stock and the company doesn't see a dime from the transaction. If we must have taxes, I would rather have them not come from earned income (like a job), which takes labor and creates value. Income from the secondary market require no labor, and create no value. If you believe rewarding and incentivizing value creation is more moral and socially desirable. Rewarding individuals for simply possessing assets is at best neutral.