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I have a new X1 Carbon 7th gen, and it was definitely a lot of work to get it set up. But after tinkering and some kernel updates (Fedora >> Ubuntu for new hard

I have a new X1 Carbon 7th gen, and it was definitely a lot of work to get it set up. But after tinkering and some kernel updates (Fedora >> Ubuntu for new hardware) I couldn't be happier. Incredible performance, all day battery life, etc. I have a friend who got their finger print sensor working but I never bothered to try. I also have had great experience with fwup. I've gotten tons of bios, firmware, microcode etc updates from Lenovo and they all apply seamlessly. I think Linux support of new hardware is always going to be shaky unless we can get vendors to care and support it themselves. Otherwise, we have to wait and let the open source devs make drivers after the hardware is released.

jhoechtl 6y ago
I have a Lenovo Yoga 720-13ikb. Firmware updates are distributed as Windows Executables only. It's the first time that I have heard of fwup. Will fwup help me to install Firmware (Bios/UEFI) Updates? It's the only reason I have not yet wiped Windows. All hardware worked except the fingerprint reader I do not care for anyway.
- dahfizz 6y ago
  I do not know about your specific machine, but Lenovo is pretty good about supporting fwupd, so its worth a try. Install fwupd for your distro and run `fwupdmgr get-devices` to see what on your machine is supported. When I run that, I see System Firmware, thunderbolt controller, UEFI firmware, touchpad, etc etc listed.
- 4cao 6y ago
  You should be able to extract the BIOS update .fd file with InnoExtract [1] or InnoUnp [2], and then use the BIOS vendor's flashing tools, which are usually available for a number of other platforms, including Linux. If this laptop has Insyde BIOS, the relevant utility is called "H2OFFT-L" (Insyde H2O Firmware Flash Tool - Linux). In the worst case, you might have to run a tool from DOS. 1. https://constexpr.org/innoextract/ https://constexpr.org/innoextract/ 2. http://innounp.sourceforge.net/ http://innounp.sourceforge.net/
- fluffything 6y ago
  I don't have your Yoga, but fwup has worked perfectly for me. That's something Lenovo should be proud of.
Delk 6y ago
I've also got the impression that even just slightly older hardware might be easier to get working than the very latest generation. This may be even more true for distros that don't ship new kernels in a rolling release style. (Fedora continuously updates to new minor/patch versions of the kernel as they're released; I'm not sure what Ubuntu does nowadays but I think they used to only patch the kernel version that was shipped at the time of the release.) I think the idea of $random_component_vendor maintaining an up-to-date Linux driver themselves may be unrealistic, and laptop vendors probably won't be doing that for all of their components either. At least on Linux that tends to involve being a competent kernel developer, too, at least if you want to be the maintainer of the driver in kernel upstream. If the OEMs that are interested in Linux support collaborated with distros and/or kernel/driver developers before the new hardware hits the shelves, even if they didn't plan on writing and supporting the drivers themselves, that might work. Otherwise there's always catching up to do, as you said. For years now, I've also had nothing that didn't work on my now fairly old X240. Everything's pretty dandy. At some point the clickpad didn't work after resuming from suspend, though, and that was a major issue that really shouldn't happen on a laptop series that's supposed to have great Linux support. Other than that (and the fingerprint reader initially not working even though it was supposed to be supported, but that wasn't a big deal), there's really been nothing that didn't work.
- dahfizz 6y ago
  > I think the idea of $random_component_vendor maintaining an up-to-date Linux driver themselves may be unrealistic I agree. I wonder what the Windows model is, and is there a way to emulate that in Linux?
  - corty 6y ago
    The windows model is that you get a binary-only driver that works with the current (certified for that component, etc) version of windows. You maybe get one or two updates over the next half a year. Then nothing. If there is a bug, exploit, whatever, good luck. If there is a newer version of the component with a minor difference (e.g. different range of serial numbers, different device id, etc) usually the newer driver won't work, so no bugfixes for you. However, you can keep on upgrading your windows version, at least within the same Service Pack and major version, sometimes longer, because the age-old driver will continue to work. The way to emulate it would be "have a binary compatibility layer for kernel modules". However, this gets you old, broken, weird and incompatible drivers that just happen to run with the new version if you are lucky. Also, because every vendor will reinvent the wheel while doing the minimum amount possible, drivers will be less capable, come with weird special tools, crapware and a generally bad compatibility to devices from other vendors. Believe me, the grass isn't greener on the other side, just different.
fluffything 6y ago
Maybe the X1 Carbon 7th gen has a bit better support than the Yoga I have, but that gives me hopes that everything will work one day (although some user below has your exact same Laptop and they complain below that Audio does not work for them, which is the same problem I used to have with Ubuntu, so maybe this is a Debian/Ubuntu issue that others distros do not have). FWIW, I've also used fwup and it has worked perfectly, so that's something that Lenovo did get right. > I think Linux support of new hardware is always going to be shaky unless we can get vendors to care and support it themselves. This is what I actually expect from a Ubuntu-certified laptop. That the manufacturer makes sure that the Laptop actually works with Ubuntu. That's the same bar I have for Apple and windows laptops. Otherwise they should just call them "Linux tinkerer friendly" or similar.
- dahfizz 6y ago
  The sound card just needs the up to date SOF driver. It works out of the box on Fedora 32.
  - fluffything 6y ago
    Fedora 32 was released in April 21 2020. This laptop was released in october 2019. Waiting 7 months to be able to use sound was not an option for me. I needed to use the microphone and headphones for work. Luckily I managed to get Arch set up, which came with a recent enough kernel and SOF driver. As of June 2020, Ubuntu still does not.

jhoechtl 6y ago

I have a Lenovo Yoga 720-13ikb. Firmware updates are distributed as Windows Executables only. It's the first time that I have heard of fwup. Will fwup help me to install Firmware (Bios/UEFI) Updates? It's the only reason I have not yet wiped Windows. All hardware worked except the fingerprint reader I do not care for anyway.

dahfizz 6y ago
I do not know about your specific machine, but Lenovo is pretty good about supporting fwupd, so its worth a try. Install fwupd for your distro and run `fwupdmgr get-devices` to see what on your machine is supported. When I run that, I see System Firmware, thunderbolt controller, UEFI firmware, touchpad, etc etc listed.
4cao 6y ago
You should be able to extract the BIOS update .fd file with InnoExtract [1] or InnoUnp [2], and then use the BIOS vendor's flashing tools, which are usually available for a number of other platforms, including Linux. If this laptop has Insyde BIOS, the relevant utility is called "H2OFFT-L" (Insyde H2O Firmware Flash Tool - Linux). In the worst case, you might have to run a tool from DOS. 1. https://constexpr.org/innoextract/ https://constexpr.org/innoextract/ 2. http://innounp.sourceforge.net/ http://innounp.sourceforge.net/
fluffything 6y ago
I don't have your Yoga, but fwup has worked perfectly for me. That's something Lenovo should be proud of.

Delk 6y ago

I've also got the impression that even just slightly older hardware might be easier to get working than the very latest generation. This may be even more true for distros that don't ship new kernels in a rolling release style. (Fedora continuously updates to new minor/patch versions of the kernel as they're released; I'm not sure what Ubuntu does nowadays but I think they used to only patch the kernel version that was shipped at the time of the release.) I think the idea of $random_component_vendor maintaining an up-to-date Linux driver themselves may be unrealistic, and laptop vendors probably won't be doing that for all of their components either. At least on Linux that tends to involve being a competent kernel developer, too, at least if you want to be the maintainer of the driver in kernel upstream. If the OEMs that are interested in Linux support collaborated with distros and/or kernel/driver developers before the new hardware hits the shelves, even if they didn't plan on writing and supporting the drivers themselves, that might work. Otherwise there's always catching up to do, as you said. For years now, I've also had nothing that didn't work on my now fairly old X240. Everything's pretty dandy. At some point the clickpad didn't work after resuming from suspend, though, and that was a major issue that really shouldn't happen on a laptop series that's supposed to have great Linux support. Other than that (and the fingerprint reader initially not working even though it was supposed to be supported, but that wasn't a big deal), there's really been nothing that didn't work.

dahfizz 6y ago
> I think the idea of $random_component_vendor maintaining an up-to-date Linux driver themselves may be unrealistic I agree. I wonder what the Windows model is, and is there a way to emulate that in Linux?
- corty 6y ago
  The windows model is that you get a binary-only driver that works with the current (certified for that component, etc) version of windows. You maybe get one or two updates over the next half a year. Then nothing. If there is a bug, exploit, whatever, good luck. If there is a newer version of the component with a minor difference (e.g. different range of serial numbers, different device id, etc) usually the newer driver won't work, so no bugfixes for you. However, you can keep on upgrading your windows version, at least within the same Service Pack and major version, sometimes longer, because the age-old driver will continue to work. The way to emulate it would be "have a binary compatibility layer for kernel modules". However, this gets you old, broken, weird and incompatible drivers that just happen to run with the new version if you are lucky. Also, because every vendor will reinvent the wheel while doing the minimum amount possible, drivers will be less capable, come with weird special tools, crapware and a generally bad compatibility to devices from other vendors. Believe me, the grass isn't greener on the other side, just different.

fluffything 6y ago

Maybe the X1 Carbon 7th gen has a bit better support than the Yoga I have, but that gives me hopes that everything will work one day (although some user below has your exact same Laptop and they complain below that Audio does not work for them, which is the same problem I used to have with Ubuntu, so maybe this is a Debian/Ubuntu issue that others distros do not have). FWIW, I've also used fwup and it has worked perfectly, so that's something that Lenovo did get right. > I think Linux support of new hardware is always going to be shaky unless we can get vendors to care and support it themselves. This is what I actually expect from a Ubuntu-certified laptop. That the manufacturer makes sure that the Laptop actually works with Ubuntu. That's the same bar I have for Apple and windows laptops. Otherwise they should just call them "Linux tinkerer friendly" or similar.

dahfizz 6y ago
The sound card just needs the up to date SOF driver. It works out of the box on Fedora 32.
- fluffything 6y ago
  Fedora 32 was released in April 21 2020. This laptop was released in october 2019. Waiting 7 months to be able to use sound was not an option for me. I needed to use the microphone and headphones for work. Luckily I managed to get Arch set up, which came with a recent enough kernel and SOF driver. As of June 2020, Ubuntu still does not.