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I am involved with a business that is attempting to do a lot of the same things that Internet Archive is doing. I think they do a lot of really good things, and

I am involved with a business that is attempting to do a lot of the same things that Internet Archive is doing. I think they do a lot of really good things, and I'm happy that they exist, but I believe they are on the wrong side in this matter. I don't know what they were thinking. I'd love to hear how they arrived at the decision to just brazenly flout copyright law like this. I fear that they have put a lot of their other efforts in danger. I hope that my "archive and access" efforts will not be effected.

Simulacra 6y ago
Tell us about your business! Do you have a profitability model yet?
- pontifier 6y ago
  It leverages the first sale doctrine to allow individual owners to access digitized versions of the media they own. I recently bought out another company that was doing the same thing and ran out of money. I'm still trying to get everything up and running before I start charging people, but my burn rate and cost structure should be manageable.
VonGuard 6y ago
They did it because the pandemic has closed libraries coast to coast, and it was a nice thing to do for people. Imagine that, making a decision not based on money or liability. I know, fuck them, right? /s
- Mindwipe 6y ago
  > They did it because the pandemic has closed libraries coast to coast, and it was a nice thing to do for people. Imagine that, making a decision not based on money or liability. You mean a stupid one that endangers everything else you do, yes? Robbing a bank and giving away the money is a decision not based on money or liability, but you shouldn't be very surprised you still get put in prison for it.
  - ghaff 6y ago
    To say nothing of the fact that there are about 20,000 books at Project Gutenberg and countless other (legal) short stories, books, articles, etc. around the web. (And that's before talking video and other multimedia.) It's not like there is some critical shortage of things to read online in the absence of the IA.
    - VonGuard 6y ago
      You're both so right. The only thing that matters is money.
      - ghaff 6y ago
        You are free to give away whatever you want so long as it's yours to give away. For example, the ACM has opened up their pubs during this health emergency which is a nice move on their part. Do I think it would have been preferable for the publishers and IA to reach some sort of agreement? Of course. But, much as I'm a fan of the IA, they shouldn't IMO be doing this unilaterally.
        VonGuard 6y ago
        Again, libraries are closed. Libraries do this every day. People are locked in their homes with nothing to do, so they opened their archives as a gesture of goodwill and generocity to a nation of people who cannot get books from libraries. While this may not be legal, it is humane. The problem with this country is that the humane thing is often illegal. We cannot give this food to the hungry, we could be liable. It's honestly what sucks most about this country: if someone is making money on it, everyone else who comes near it is powerless against it. Yes, they are breaking copyright law. Who gives a flying fuck about copyright law when there are 100,000 dead people and riots in the streets?
        SpelingBeeChamp 6y ago
        " Who gives a flying fuck about copyright law when there are 100,000 dead people and riots in the streets?" Plenty of people. Perhaps you haven't heard the news, but it's possible to care about two things at once.
sah2ed 6y ago
> I don't know what they were thinking. I'd love to hear how they arrived at the decision to just brazenly flout copyright law like this. In a previous HN discussion [0], @Apocryphon linked to [1] speculation on a possible explanation: that the IA leadership is perhaps hoping for a landmark court ruling [2] that challenges the first-sale doctrine as it applies to ebooks. Physical books can be lent out freely by libraries but digital goods like ebooks cannot because they are exempted from the first sale doctrine [3]. This forces libraries to enter into separate licensing agreements with rights holders, which is why the IA is purportedly trying to challenge the rent extraction from libraries, albeit in a less than ideal way. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22731472 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22731472 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22734145 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22734145 [2] https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1244257620548038656.html?refreshed=1585629738 https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1244257620548038656.html?... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine#Application_to_digital_copies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine#Applicatio...

Simulacra 6y ago

Tell us about your business! Do you have a profitability model yet?

pontifier 6y ago
It leverages the first sale doctrine to allow individual owners to access digitized versions of the media they own. I recently bought out another company that was doing the same thing and ran out of money. I'm still trying to get everything up and running before I start charging people, but my burn rate and cost structure should be manageable.

VonGuard 6y ago

They did it because the pandemic has closed libraries coast to coast, and it was a nice thing to do for people. Imagine that, making a decision not based on money or liability. I know, fuck them, right? /s

Mindwipe 6y ago
> They did it because the pandemic has closed libraries coast to coast, and it was a nice thing to do for people. Imagine that, making a decision not based on money or liability. You mean a stupid one that endangers everything else you do, yes? Robbing a bank and giving away the money is a decision not based on money or liability, but you shouldn't be very surprised you still get put in prison for it.
- ghaff 6y ago
  To say nothing of the fact that there are about 20,000 books at Project Gutenberg and countless other (legal) short stories, books, articles, etc. around the web. (And that's before talking video and other multimedia.) It's not like there is some critical shortage of things to read online in the absence of the IA.
  - VonGuard 6y ago
    You're both so right. The only thing that matters is money.
    - ghaff 6y ago
      You are free to give away whatever you want so long as it's yours to give away. For example, the ACM has opened up their pubs during this health emergency which is a nice move on their part. Do I think it would have been preferable for the publishers and IA to reach some sort of agreement? Of course. But, much as I'm a fan of the IA, they shouldn't IMO be doing this unilaterally.
      - VonGuard 6y ago
        Again, libraries are closed. Libraries do this every day. People are locked in their homes with nothing to do, so they opened their archives as a gesture of goodwill and generocity to a nation of people who cannot get books from libraries. While this may not be legal, it is humane. The problem with this country is that the humane thing is often illegal. We cannot give this food to the hungry, we could be liable. It's honestly what sucks most about this country: if someone is making money on it, everyone else who comes near it is powerless against it. Yes, they are breaking copyright law. Who gives a flying fuck about copyright law when there are 100,000 dead people and riots in the streets?
        SpelingBeeChamp 6y ago
        " Who gives a flying fuck about copyright law when there are 100,000 dead people and riots in the streets?" Plenty of people. Perhaps you haven't heard the news, but it's possible to care about two things at once.

sah2ed 6y ago

> I don't know what they were thinking. I'd love to hear how they arrived at the decision to just brazenly flout copyright law like this. In a previous HN discussion [0], @Apocryphon linked to [1] speculation on a possible explanation: that the IA leadership is perhaps hoping for a landmark court ruling [2] that challenges the first-sale doctrine as it applies to ebooks. Physical books can be lent out freely by libraries but digital goods like ebooks cannot because they are exempted from the first sale doctrine [3]. This forces libraries to enter into separate licensing agreements with rights holders, which is why the IA is purportedly trying to challenge the rent extraction from libraries, albeit in a less than ideal way. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22731472 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22731472 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22734145 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22734145 [2] https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1244257620548038656.html?refreshed=1585629738 https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1244257620548038656.html?... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine#Application_to_digital_copies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine#Applicatio...