5 ms·

Consider looking beyond the most sensationalized news coverage.

xenyal 6y ago
Consider looking at the CNN reporting team that was arrested live on television without reason? It's not a good sign if media is being censored like that.
- moduspol 6y ago
  True. Media coverage of these protests has been basically a blackout. We've heard almost nothing. C'mon. Of course they shouldn't have been arrested, but it's not some systemic suppression.
  - nl 6y ago
    There are at least 20 cases of credentialed journalists being attacked or arrested by police in the last 48 hours. While a few of these may have been mistaken identity, many weren't. https://twitter.com/N_Waters89/status/1267037176614838272 https://twitter.com/N_Waters89/status/1267037176614838272
- aww_dang 6y ago
  People can pick and choose where they stand on this incident or perhaps even choose not to participate in the partisan dialectic. I'd just like to point out that the opposing view on that incident would characterize it as exactly the kind of sensationalized coverage which the above poster could be referring to. One narrative suggests that it was staged. Worth looking at it from both sides. As we discuss this, let's not steam roll past those concerns. My personal view is that there's more than a little BS flying from all angles. CNN wouldn't be what I consider hard hitting or informative journalism. I don't know what really happened and I can't jump to any conclusions. Thanks.
  - adjkant 6y ago
    See other threads, but this is not an isolated incident. Trying to argue that it was staged seems incredibly disingenuous and an unreasonable standard of proof given the widespread occurrences of this and police brutality in the past 48 hours. https://twitter.com/GravelInstitute/status/1266929927116468225 https://twitter.com/GravelInstitute/status/12669299271164682...
    - aww_dang 6y ago
      Just to be explicit, I don't take sides, I'm not interested in advancing any argument and I am skeptical of most claims. This goes doubly so for the extreme partisan takes, which are generally unreasonable. I'm sorry this disclaimer is seemingly necessary. My personal views are secondary to the point of my comment, which was: Perhaps we should consider both sides?
      - nl 6y ago
        The interesting thing about these claims is that in many there are multiple film views of the same incident, and in the CNN case there was an apology issued. What exactly are you skeptical about?
        aww_dang 6y ago
        If you must pry, I'll say that CNN (a highly partisan outlet) has every incentive to have their reporter arrested. I'll also say that arresting a journalist is out of line and that the police could have let it ride. However no one is perfect, certainly not myself. Therefore I have little room to pass judgement upon police officers who are clearly under more than a little bit of stress. Similarly, I can't condemn the reporter even if he is indeed (which I can't know with certainty) advancing his career in a very cynical way. For me I'm comfortable just leaving it as an unknown instead of attempting to take sides or claiming an authoritative understanding of the event. Moral grandstanding for either claim would be a further leap too far for me personally. However you are welcome to argue your opinion with someone else. I just can't do that in good faith. Thanks for understanding.
frobozz 6y ago
At what, exactly? The President's announcements? I think I'll stick to those parts of the world where opposing Fascism is legal.
- moduspol 6y ago
  Crime statistics. And then compare them to police brutality statistics to see if the outrage is warranted. Also, opposing fascism is still legal here. We do actually have legally enshrined freedom of speech.
  - nl 6y ago
    Free speech only goes so far when someone is kneeling on your throat.
  - encom 6y ago
    And what fascism is there to oppose in the first place? Not including the non-fascist kind of fascism the unhinged blue checkmarks have invented to fit their narratives.
nl 6y ago
I'm not from the US, but I used to be very much on the "things aren't as bad as they appear" thing too. The last 6-9 months has made me change my mind. The systematic firing of 5 inspector generals and the US Justice Department's reversal on the charges against Flynn and Stone have made me change my mind. The US has always had inequal access to law, but now it appears the rule of law is in doubt. It doesn't matter if you are left or right leaning - if the law is that corrupted there is something to be concerned about.
- moduspol 6y ago
  There is something to be concerned about. We felt that way when Hillary Clinton avoided charges after using her private e-mail server for sending and receiving classified information, after Fast and Furious, and the IRS targeting of conservative organizations. But those weren't framed as "the rule of law is in doubt" because a different guy was in the White House. And if you're seeing the Flynn case as an example of a solid and reasonable case being dropped due to political interference, I don't think you've read enough about it.
  - nl 6y ago
    Did you really just do a "what about Clinton's emails" and think that is an argument? Literally Whataboutism
    - moduspol 6y ago
      I provided clear examples of laws being broken, people not being held accountable, and people like you not caring when it's someone on your side pulling the strings. Now another guy is in charge. This isn't new.
      - nl 6y ago
        Where did you provide clear examples? If you mean Hillary Clinton then you do realize there have been six separate investigations and no charges. Did you know that what happened in the Clinton case is not an uncommon occurrence? Did you know that Bush did the same thing[1]? And Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump did the same?[2] In all these cases it's not the right thing to do, but nor is it criminal. And what is this "people like you" attack? The Marc Rich case is something I'll condemn Bill Clinton for any day of the week - it's a complete miscarriage of justice and I wish there was a way it could be reversed. I'm not aware of anything like that from the Obama era but it's possible I've missed it. Justice matters much more than politics. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_White_House_email_controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_White_House_email_controv... [2] https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/cummings-jared-kushner-and-ivanka-trumps-private-emails-texts-raise-security-concerns https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/cummings-jared-kushner...

Consider looking at the CNN reporting team that was arrested live on television without reason? It's not a good sign if media is being censored like that.

moduspol 6y ago
True. Media coverage of these protests has been basically a blackout. We've heard almost nothing. C'mon. Of course they shouldn't have been arrested, but it's not some systemic suppression.
- nl 6y ago
  There are at least 20 cases of credentialed journalists being attacked or arrested by police in the last 48 hours. While a few of these may have been mistaken identity, many weren't. https://twitter.com/N_Waters89/status/1267037176614838272 https://twitter.com/N_Waters89/status/1267037176614838272
aww_dang 6y ago
People can pick and choose where they stand on this incident or perhaps even choose not to participate in the partisan dialectic. I'd just like to point out that the opposing view on that incident would characterize it as exactly the kind of sensationalized coverage which the above poster could be referring to. One narrative suggests that it was staged. Worth looking at it from both sides. As we discuss this, let's not steam roll past those concerns. My personal view is that there's more than a little BS flying from all angles. CNN wouldn't be what I consider hard hitting or informative journalism. I don't know what really happened and I can't jump to any conclusions. Thanks.
- adjkant 6y ago
  See other threads, but this is not an isolated incident. Trying to argue that it was staged seems incredibly disingenuous and an unreasonable standard of proof given the widespread occurrences of this and police brutality in the past 48 hours. https://twitter.com/GravelInstitute/status/1266929927116468225 https://twitter.com/GravelInstitute/status/12669299271164682...
  - aww_dang 6y ago
    Just to be explicit, I don't take sides, I'm not interested in advancing any argument and I am skeptical of most claims. This goes doubly so for the extreme partisan takes, which are generally unreasonable. I'm sorry this disclaimer is seemingly necessary. My personal views are secondary to the point of my comment, which was: Perhaps we should consider both sides?
    - nl 6y ago
      The interesting thing about these claims is that in many there are multiple film views of the same incident, and in the CNN case there was an apology issued. What exactly are you skeptical about?
      - aww_dang 6y ago
        If you must pry, I'll say that CNN (a highly partisan outlet) has every incentive to have their reporter arrested. I'll also say that arresting a journalist is out of line and that the police could have let it ride. However no one is perfect, certainly not myself. Therefore I have little room to pass judgement upon police officers who are clearly under more than a little bit of stress. Similarly, I can't condemn the reporter even if he is indeed (which I can't know with certainty) advancing his career in a very cynical way. For me I'm comfortable just leaving it as an unknown instead of attempting to take sides or claiming an authoritative understanding of the event. Moral grandstanding for either claim would be a further leap too far for me personally. However you are welcome to argue your opinion with someone else. I just can't do that in good faith. Thanks for understanding.

frobozz 6y ago

At what, exactly? The President's announcements? I think I'll stick to those parts of the world where opposing Fascism is legal.

moduspol 6y ago
Crime statistics. And then compare them to police brutality statistics to see if the outrage is warranted. Also, opposing fascism is still legal here. We do actually have legally enshrined freedom of speech.
- nl 6y ago
  Free speech only goes so far when someone is kneeling on your throat.
- encom 6y ago
  And what fascism is there to oppose in the first place? Not including the non-fascist kind of fascism the unhinged blue checkmarks have invented to fit their narratives.

nl 6y ago

I'm not from the US, but I used to be very much on the "things aren't as bad as they appear" thing too. The last 6-9 months has made me change my mind. The systematic firing of 5 inspector generals and the US Justice Department's reversal on the charges against Flynn and Stone have made me change my mind. The US has always had inequal access to law, but now it appears the rule of law is in doubt. It doesn't matter if you are left or right leaning - if the law is that corrupted there is something to be concerned about.

moduspol 6y ago
There is something to be concerned about. We felt that way when Hillary Clinton avoided charges after using her private e-mail server for sending and receiving classified information, after Fast and Furious, and the IRS targeting of conservative organizations. But those weren't framed as "the rule of law is in doubt" because a different guy was in the White House. And if you're seeing the Flynn case as an example of a solid and reasonable case being dropped due to political interference, I don't think you've read enough about it.
- nl 6y ago
  Did you really just do a "what about Clinton's emails" and think that is an argument? Literally Whataboutism
  - moduspol 6y ago
    I provided clear examples of laws being broken, people not being held accountable, and people like you not caring when it's someone on your side pulling the strings. Now another guy is in charge. This isn't new.
    - nl 6y ago
      Where did you provide clear examples? If you mean Hillary Clinton then you do realize there have been six separate investigations and no charges. Did you know that what happened in the Clinton case is not an uncommon occurrence? Did you know that Bush did the same thing[1]? And Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump did the same?[2] In all these cases it's not the right thing to do, but nor is it criminal. And what is this "people like you" attack? The Marc Rich case is something I'll condemn Bill Clinton for any day of the week - it's a complete miscarriage of justice and I wish there was a way it could be reversed. I'm not aware of anything like that from the Obama era but it's possible I've missed it. Justice matters much more than politics. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_White_House_email_controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_White_House_email_controv... [2] https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/cummings-jared-kushner-and-ivanka-trumps-private-emails-texts-raise-security-concerns https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/cummings-jared-kushner...