11 ms·

Pinebook Pro, First Impressions

141 points by TekMol 6y ago

JonathanBeuys 6y ago
Since Linux can be installed on pretty much every laptop, I am not sure what is special about this one. Maybe the HN gang can enlighten me? What fascinates me about Pine64 is that we might finally see Linux on phones and tablets. I ordered a PinePhone a few days ago. Can't wait to try it. I wonder when they will ship it. I got an email "Your order has been received and is now being processed." but no info when they will send it out. Any idea how fast they will ship?
- amock 6y ago
  I don't know about the PinePhone in particular, but the time to shipment for my PineBook Pro was very long since it was done in batches after orders came in.
- rbanffy 6y ago
  There are a couple things going for this machine: - It's fairly inexpensive, even when compared to cheaper build machines. - It's very open and easy to hack - It's fast to the point of being actually useful - It has a six-core asymmetric CPU (two fast A72 cores, 4 low-power A53 ones). That's not available on any x86 based laptop. - It's almost completely Windows-proof.
  - paulryanrogers 6y ago
    > - It's almost completely Windows-proof. What does this mean? And why is that good?
    - hedora 6y ago
      I’m not the person you replied to, but it’s definitely free of brain damaged bios junk that’s windows specific, and also unremovable enterprise malware, such as the Intel Management Engine.
  - sukilot 6y ago
    What does asymmetry achieve? Intel/AMD can downclock themselves.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
      x86 can go to lower clock speeds, but does that get them as low on power use? I was under the impression that Intel failed in the mobile space because they couldn't make x86 fit in a phone's power envelope.
      - Gibbon1 6y ago
        I think not that they couldn't but as they say, you don't have be able to outrun the bear, just the guy with you. Not that they couldn't, just they couldn't beat ARM. And ARM already had a solid footing in the dumb phone space. I think four things. Two Technical and two business. 0x86's innate power consumption per bit of state change is higher than ARM's. Lack of experience with low power process. No one wants to pay the Intel Tax. And Intel isn't very nice to their customers.
        rbanffy 6y ago
        If they spread their investment to compete against AMD in the current x86 niches and with ARM in the low-power spectrum, there won't be enough money to succeed in either.
    - rbanffy 6y ago
      If you like to play with OSs and how they allocate work, it's a very interesting machine. Also, remember that Intel doesn't have asymmetric multi-core parts right now, but they already announced Lakefield, which has Tremont and Sunny Cove cores on a single package. In a sense, it's like playing with Intel's future chip, but with an ARM ISA.
- BracketMaster 6y ago
  This is an ARM laptop. Since it isn't intel, that means you can have access to the MOBO schematics as well as the processor data sheet. This means that the average person can design a computer around the processor without paying a couple million to intel in NDA agreements. This is a being deal for the FOSS hardware community - I myself am actually working on a project to make an open processor with a GPU. https://systemeslibres.org https://systemeslibres.org
  - sukilot 6y ago
    That's great for Pinebook company but why is it good for their customers? The main thing I see is that it enabled a $200 laptop which is amazing (except for the dodgy keyboard and trackpad undermining it)
    - BracketMaster 6y ago
      Well, my friend has a Pinebook Pro. He's capable of writing drivers himself and designing MOBOs for CPUs. He's actually designed a CPU and written a compiler for it. Being able to get to the core of the system matters very much to him - being able to trust his hardware. Releasing MOBO files strengthens that trust. In addition, he can repair the MOBO himself if need be. I suppose me and my friend represent a minority of users though.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
  - mbreese 6y ago
    > the average person can design a computer around the processor I'm not quite sure that's the case... I get what you mean, but to be clear -- this is not a computer for the average person (nor is it meant to be).
    - usr1106 6y ago
      Not the op, but I guess they meant the person with far more than average system design skills, but with an average 1 person budget for a hobby project.
- ipnon 6y ago
  Installing Linux on low end laptops is difficult because of obscured proprietary firmware. Chromebook BIOS is an example.
  - jasonvorhe 6y ago
    Chromebooks boot using coreboot. As far as I know that's pretty open.
    - nextos 6y ago
      Check latest Chromebooks, it's really hard to use native Linux on them unlike on previous iterations. For example, they use weird soundcards. This is sad, because they were easy-to-buy and inexpensive Linux machines. Pixelbook Go is very nice, and the price is reasonable.
      - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
        How did they manage to screw that up? I mean, Chromebooks literally run Linux just with a weird userland on top, and even if they're using weird out-of-tree drivers, if they're in-kernel they still have to be released, so worst case you should be able to reuse their patches. Or has the joy of drivers running at least partially in userspace also hit ChromeOS?
        ipnon 6y ago
        I think the hardware is sold at a loss to recoup once budget laptop users are locked into the Google ecosystem. I don't think Linux was conspired against but compatibility with Linux was an afterthought or discouraged.
        yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
        But that's what I don't understand; "compatibility with Linux" can't be an afterthought when the stock OS uses a Linux kernel. Even on Android, it's rare for the problem to be getting drivers for hardware; the drivers might be terrible and hard to rebase onto a newer kernel, but they're at least available.
- branon 6y ago
  Shipping information for Pine64 products is generally available at https://www.pine64.org/shipping/ https://www.pine64.org/shipping/ Shipping schedules for Pinebook Pro and Pinephone do fluctuate since they are produced and shipped in batches.
  - JonathanBeuys 6y ago
    Well the page you linked to says "Estimate to be dispatch in late May, 2020". Considering that it's the last day of May today, I can't say that tells me much.
- f00_ 6y ago
  Maybe I'm a retard but isn't Android linux?
  - __MatrixMan__ 6y ago
    Technically, but have you ever worked at a shell on an Android device? It feels alien, and all the interesting stuff is wrapped up in the JVM so the fact that it's wrapped in Linux doesn't gain you much.
    - h4waii 6y ago
      You should give Termux a try. It's an honest to goodness "Linux environment" with a full package manager for many many popular tools and utilities, including the build essentials if you want to compile software directly on your device.
      - inportb 6y ago
        I like Termux too, but... even that stuff is going away https://github.com/termux/termux-app/issues/1072 https://github.com/termux/termux-app/issues/1072 So it makes sense to use Linux if that's what you prioritize.
  - trav4225 6y ago
    Android uses a forked Linux kernel.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
      Android tends to use patched kernels, but the diffs are getting smaller (Google made it an explicit goal to bring their fork back to mainline). The bigger issue is the weird userland; a Linux kernel is one thing, but bionic is not a libc meant to run anything but Android, and toybox is no GNU coreutils.
      - trav4225 6y ago
- iagovar 6y ago
  I currently have an Acer B115m with Intel N2940, SSD and 8GB LDDR3. I use this laptop mostly to work outdoors. I get somewhere nice, surrounded by nature, open the laptop, plug in my 4G modem and work from there. It gets me about 6h of real usage, but sometimes I can't charge it up to 100%. I'd also like to have a brighter scree so I deal better with sunlight. Most of the times I go to places you can't reach by car, so I go on bike or walking, therefore I need to be careful with what I carry with me, be it weight or volume. An ARM laptop would be a nice upgrade for my battery anxiety, but having everything soldered makes me uneasy, and 64 Gb HD + 4Gb Ram is not enough for me. Also, I wasn't able to find info about the screen brightness.
  - hedora 6y ago
    I have an old, similar Acer. It’s a great form factor. Would pay more for 4K, smaller bezels and faster CPU/more dram, but only if it remained fanless, and kept the 8 hour battery life. (I paid $189.)
- ferzul 6y ago
  if you ordered before the 22nd may, it will be shipping soon and you'll get an email when it starts (they said shipping began on 28th, but i haven't received my email yet). if it was after that date, you'll have to wait for the next batch - no idea when that is scheduled.
- blihp 6y ago
  Two things others have mentioned: - It's an open device so you're not locked out of or into anything (Android devices don't cut it on this front) - It's ARM-based One thing they haven't: - You don't pay for a Windows license you'll never use That last thing has annoyed some of us for decades: funding (even in a minor way) a company that has been actively hostile to the platform we want to use. Plus it adds some amount of cost to the device. Believe what you will about their recent change of stance, some of us still don't want to send money their way unnecessarily.
- DNied 6y ago
  No spying technologies built into the CPU, at least as far as we know. That one is a big deal.
- JeremyNT 6y ago
  It's a reasonable question. The main reason is a desire to support the "open" development model of the hardware. I think most people interested in a device like this would be better served with a Chromebook, of which there are numerous, with much more diverse hardware options. They already run Coreboot and are about the most open laptop devices currently sold in large quantities.
Ardon 6y ago
This is pretty much my experience as well. The trackpad is my only complaint about the machine. There is some ongoing work to reverse-engineer the trackpad firmware (which is apparently behaving badly) from this guy: https://github.com/akirakyle/pinebook-pro-keyboard-updater/tree/master/firmware/disassembly https://github.com/akirakyle/pinebook-pro-keyboard-updater/t... There's also apparently a bounty: https://www.bountysource.com/issues/88375235-reverse-engineer-touchpad-firmware https://www.bountysource.com/issues/88375235-reverse-enginee... If there is a firmware solution, then I think I'll have no complaints left for the pinebook pro :)
- j-pb 6y ago
  I wish you could get it with a marble sized trackball instead of the trackpad :D
- itsspring 6y ago
  Are you able to use bluetooth trackpads, like Apple's Magic Trackpad, with it? Asking for myself before I buy..
  - nextos 6y ago
    Probably, the Magic Trackpad works quite well with a Linux mainline kernel.
  - kevincox 6y ago
    I use a Wacom Intuos (USB) as as a trackpad which works out of the box. It is nice and big and you can always pick up the pen when it is convenient.
- seltzered_ 6y ago
  There's also discussions on fundraising/bringing more help to libinput: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235609 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235609
- m463 6y ago
  I have a linux laptop with a trackpad, and I thought most of the pain was the default settings. Once I turned off the "click in this area for button x" stuff and turned on tap to click, it became 10x more usable. (I'm not familiar with the pinebook trackpad, so it could be more that just configuration)
amock 6y ago
I've had a PineBook Pro for a few months. I added an NVMe drive for extra storage and overall I'm happy with it as a secondary machine since I usually use my desktop. The one thing that I think is much worse than it should be is the trackpad and my view is much more negative than in this review. For me, it's terrible and often borders on unusable for anything that doesn't have a large clickable area. It is such a contrast to the keyboard that is much better than I expected and probably the best laptop keyboard I've used in a long time.
- pahool 6y ago
  Did you take much of a battery life hit with the addition of the NVMe drive?
  - amock 6y ago
    I haven't done much testing, but the battery life is still very good.
type-2 6y ago
> The display resolution is 1920x1080, equivalent to about 100 dpi Maybe a typo? Should be around 157dpi for a 14 inch screen. Though I absolutely agree with the general idea, high dpi screens (over 200 dpi) do make the experience much much better.
eeereerews 6y ago
> a barrel connector power supply What's wrong with this?
- paulryanrogers 6y ago
  Perhaps USB-C is considered more modern or convenient
  - saurik 6y ago
    USB-C means that I get to use any charger I have and can trivially replace it; a barrel-connector is some one-off component that is precious: if I lose it or damage it I am _screwed_. The article says the device also support some charging over USB-C... why even bother including a barrel-connector? It feels wrong.
    - cybernabjo 6y ago
      It's cheaper to get some replacement barrel-connector cables then USB-C
    - detaro 6y ago
      universal PSUs with all of the few common barrel connector sizes are commonly and cheaply available. I personally prefer USB-C too, just because I have more devices with it, but barrel connectors aren't that weird.
  - traverseda 6y ago
    It has USB-C charging as well. I think that's sort of the best of both worlds, it's not like a barrel connection adds much to the board, and it means you can run it from a much less complex power supply. It does mean it has an extra port that you might find unnecessary, but at the kind of prices they're selling this at including a usb-c charger would actually add a fair bit to their costs, and you can buy an aftermarket one pretty easily.
  - userbinator 6y ago
    I doubt relatively flimsy and tiny USB-C connectors will hold up to the same kind of abuse as a big robust barrel plug. No one seems to complain about their 120/240 mains plugs not being "modern" either...
candiddevmike 6y ago
I wish they had options with more RAM. 4GB is just not enough for serious work these days.
- metta2uall 6y ago
  Yes, I would expect much more from a "Pro" model, at least 8GB, preferably 16-32GB personally.. Running VMs and containers is quite necessary for high security & software development work..
  - whereistimbo 6y ago
    The RK3399 doesn't support more than 8GB RAM CMIIW. Also RK3399 seems very underpowered for software development work, you might want to wait for snapdragon Chromebook or Google's custom Exynos Chromebook.
hestefisk 6y ago
Such an inexpensive machine and reviewer complains about lack of 4K... :) 1080p is pretty decent in a little laptop like this.
- TylerE 6y ago
  I mean, a $35 RaspPI does 4k...
  - bronco21016 6y ago
    4K display not included... I mean that’s not even a fair comparison.
  - cushychicken 6y ago
    It also doesn't include a monitor.
    - hestefisk 6y ago
      Yeah and no scsi controller. Lame.
    - ferzul 6y ago
      but it would be nice to pay a bit more and get 4k.
      - zamadatix 6y ago
        I don't think it makes much sense to "pay a bit more and get 4k" on a device which costs $199. If people are looking to "pay a bit more" to get 4k then they should probably look at a device which can actually handle 4k decently not expect it as an upgrade option on one of the cheapest laptops available.
  - andrepd 6y ago
    That's completely not the point. They're talking about the display, not video-out capabilities.
seba_dos1 6y ago
I have one. It seems to be a pretty nice machine with a good performance for buck ratio. However, the touchpad and keyboard make it completely unusable for me. The keyboard doesn't register some key combos at all, and I've never used a touchpad this bad...
- bufferoverflow 6y ago
  Get a bluetooth mouse?
  - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
    If you need an external mouse and keyboard to use a laptop, it's not much of a laptop.
  - seba_dos1 6y ago
    In situations where I'd be comfortable using a Bluetooth mouse, I'd probably have my much more powerful amd64 laptop with me. But well, I don't even need a mouse to comfortably use that one :P
arprocter 6y ago
I wish the author expanded on how Midori is "really testing my patience" - kind of a showstopper if you can't browse with what is a very lightweight browser
neurostimulant 6y ago
> There are upgrade kits available, for example an adapter to add an NVMe disk instead of the eMMC. For the original Pinebook, there has been an upgrade kit with a better processor even. I didn't know you could add nvme disk to the pinebook pro. The emmc storage was turning me off, but with this the machine seem to be more attractive to me. If it has upgradable cpu as well I would seriously consider using this laptop, just need to figure out shipping as international shipping is usually handled by the awful state-owned postal company here, which for some reason can't successfully deliver anything to my address.
seoirsewalker 6y ago
I received pinebook pro last week and initially I was really disappointed with the trackpad, double tap was only working 30% of the time, laggy movement, urgh. After some experimentation and someone on the forums pointing me to https://wiki.pine64.org/index.php/Pinebook_Pro#X-Windows_.26_trackpad_settings https://wiki.pine64.org/index.php/Pinebook_Pro#X-Windows_.26... I am getting decent performance.
sam_lowry_ 6y ago
> The keyboard is an absolute joy to use. The keyboard is a cheap no-name, far worse than a Thinkpad keyboard or an Apple keyboard. I had trouble with the button S since the beginning. But this is fine for such a cheap laptop.

141 points by TekMol 6y ago

Since Linux can be installed on pretty much every laptop, I am not sure what is special about this one. Maybe the HN gang can enlighten me? What fascinates me about Pine64 is that we might finally see Linux on phones and tablets. I ordered a PinePhone a few days ago. Can't wait to try it. I wonder when they will ship it. I got an email "Your order has been received and is now being processed." but no info when they will send it out. Any idea how fast they will ship?

amock 6y ago
I don't know about the PinePhone in particular, but the time to shipment for my PineBook Pro was very long since it was done in batches after orders came in.
rbanffy 6y ago
There are a couple things going for this machine: - It's fairly inexpensive, even when compared to cheaper build machines. - It's very open and easy to hack - It's fast to the point of being actually useful - It has a six-core asymmetric CPU (two fast A72 cores, 4 low-power A53 ones). That's not available on any x86 based laptop. - It's almost completely Windows-proof.
- paulryanrogers 6y ago
  > - It's almost completely Windows-proof. What does this mean? And why is that good?
  - hedora 6y ago
    I’m not the person you replied to, but it’s definitely free of brain damaged bios junk that’s windows specific, and also unremovable enterprise malware, such as the Intel Management Engine.
- sukilot 6y ago
  What does asymmetry achieve? Intel/AMD can downclock themselves.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
    x86 can go to lower clock speeds, but does that get them as low on power use? I was under the impression that Intel failed in the mobile space because they couldn't make x86 fit in a phone's power envelope.
    - Gibbon1 6y ago
      I think not that they couldn't but as they say, you don't have be able to outrun the bear, just the guy with you. Not that they couldn't, just they couldn't beat ARM. And ARM already had a solid footing in the dumb phone space. I think four things. Two Technical and two business. 0x86's innate power consumption per bit of state change is higher than ARM's. Lack of experience with low power process. No one wants to pay the Intel Tax. And Intel isn't very nice to their customers.
      - rbanffy 6y ago
        If they spread their investment to compete against AMD in the current x86 niches and with ARM in the low-power spectrum, there won't be enough money to succeed in either.
  - rbanffy 6y ago
    If you like to play with OSs and how they allocate work, it's a very interesting machine. Also, remember that Intel doesn't have asymmetric multi-core parts right now, but they already announced Lakefield, which has Tremont and Sunny Cove cores on a single package. In a sense, it's like playing with Intel's future chip, but with an ARM ISA.
BracketMaster 6y ago
This is an ARM laptop. Since it isn't intel, that means you can have access to the MOBO schematics as well as the processor data sheet. This means that the average person can design a computer around the processor without paying a couple million to intel in NDA agreements. This is a being deal for the FOSS hardware community - I myself am actually working on a project to make an open processor with a GPU. https://systemeslibres.org https://systemeslibres.org
- sukilot 6y ago
  That's great for Pinebook company but why is it good for their customers? The main thing I see is that it enabled a $200 laptop which is amazing (except for the dodgy keyboard and trackpad undermining it)
  - BracketMaster 6y ago
    Well, my friend has a Pinebook Pro. He's capable of writing drivers himself and designing MOBOs for CPUs. He's actually designed a CPU and written a compiler for it. Being able to get to the core of the system matters very much to him - being able to trust his hardware. Releasing MOBO files strengthens that trust. In addition, he can repair the MOBO himself if need be. I suppose me and my friend represent a minority of users though.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- mbreese 6y ago
  > the average person can design a computer around the processor I'm not quite sure that's the case... I get what you mean, but to be clear -- this is not a computer for the average person (nor is it meant to be).
  - usr1106 6y ago
    Not the op, but I guess they meant the person with far more than average system design skills, but with an average 1 person budget for a hobby project.
ipnon 6y ago
Installing Linux on low end laptops is difficult because of obscured proprietary firmware. Chromebook BIOS is an example.
- jasonvorhe 6y ago
  Chromebooks boot using coreboot. As far as I know that's pretty open.
  - nextos 6y ago
    Check latest Chromebooks, it's really hard to use native Linux on them unlike on previous iterations. For example, they use weird soundcards. This is sad, because they were easy-to-buy and inexpensive Linux machines. Pixelbook Go is very nice, and the price is reasonable.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
      How did they manage to screw that up? I mean, Chromebooks literally run Linux just with a weird userland on top, and even if they're using weird out-of-tree drivers, if they're in-kernel they still have to be released, so worst case you should be able to reuse their patches. Or has the joy of drivers running at least partially in userspace also hit ChromeOS?
      - ipnon 6y ago
        I think the hardware is sold at a loss to recoup once budget laptop users are locked into the Google ecosystem. I don't think Linux was conspired against but compatibility with Linux was an afterthought or discouraged.
        yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
        But that's what I don't understand; "compatibility with Linux" can't be an afterthought when the stock OS uses a Linux kernel. Even on Android, it's rare for the problem to be getting drivers for hardware; the drivers might be terrible and hard to rebase onto a newer kernel, but they're at least available.
branon 6y ago
Shipping information for Pine64 products is generally available at https://www.pine64.org/shipping/ https://www.pine64.org/shipping/ Shipping schedules for Pinebook Pro and Pinephone do fluctuate since they are produced and shipped in batches.
- JonathanBeuys 6y ago
  Well the page you linked to says "Estimate to be dispatch in late May, 2020". Considering that it's the last day of May today, I can't say that tells me much.
f00_ 6y ago
Maybe I'm a retard but isn't Android linux?
- __MatrixMan__ 6y ago
  Technically, but have you ever worked at a shell on an Android device? It feels alien, and all the interesting stuff is wrapped up in the JVM so the fact that it's wrapped in Linux doesn't gain you much.
  - h4waii 6y ago
    You should give Termux a try. It's an honest to goodness "Linux environment" with a full package manager for many many popular tools and utilities, including the build essentials if you want to compile software directly on your device.
    - inportb 6y ago
      I like Termux too, but... even that stuff is going away https://github.com/termux/termux-app/issues/1072 https://github.com/termux/termux-app/issues/1072 So it makes sense to use Linux if that's what you prioritize.
- trav4225 6y ago
  Android uses a forked Linux kernel.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
    Android tends to use patched kernels, but the diffs are getting smaller (Google made it an explicit goal to bring their fork back to mainline). The bigger issue is the weird userland; a Linux kernel is one thing, but bionic is not a libc meant to run anything but Android, and toybox is no GNU coreutils.
    - trav4225 6y ago
iagovar 6y ago
I currently have an Acer B115m with Intel N2940, SSD and 8GB LDDR3. I use this laptop mostly to work outdoors. I get somewhere nice, surrounded by nature, open the laptop, plug in my 4G modem and work from there. It gets me about 6h of real usage, but sometimes I can't charge it up to 100%. I'd also like to have a brighter scree so I deal better with sunlight. Most of the times I go to places you can't reach by car, so I go on bike or walking, therefore I need to be careful with what I carry with me, be it weight or volume. An ARM laptop would be a nice upgrade for my battery anxiety, but having everything soldered makes me uneasy, and 64 Gb HD + 4Gb Ram is not enough for me. Also, I wasn't able to find info about the screen brightness.
- hedora 6y ago
  I have an old, similar Acer. It’s a great form factor. Would pay more for 4K, smaller bezels and faster CPU/more dram, but only if it remained fanless, and kept the 8 hour battery life. (I paid $189.)
ferzul 6y ago
if you ordered before the 22nd may, it will be shipping soon and you'll get an email when it starts (they said shipping began on 28th, but i haven't received my email yet). if it was after that date, you'll have to wait for the next batch - no idea when that is scheduled.
blihp 6y ago
Two things others have mentioned: - It's an open device so you're not locked out of or into anything (Android devices don't cut it on this front) - It's ARM-based One thing they haven't: - You don't pay for a Windows license you'll never use That last thing has annoyed some of us for decades: funding (even in a minor way) a company that has been actively hostile to the platform we want to use. Plus it adds some amount of cost to the device. Believe what you will about their recent change of stance, some of us still don't want to send money their way unnecessarily.
DNied 6y ago
No spying technologies built into the CPU, at least as far as we know. That one is a big deal.
JeremyNT 6y ago
It's a reasonable question. The main reason is a desire to support the "open" development model of the hardware. I think most people interested in a device like this would be better served with a Chromebook, of which there are numerous, with much more diverse hardware options. They already run Coreboot and are about the most open laptop devices currently sold in large quantities.

Ardon 6y ago

This is pretty much my experience as well. The trackpad is my only complaint about the machine. There is some ongoing work to reverse-engineer the trackpad firmware (which is apparently behaving badly) from this guy: https://github.com/akirakyle/pinebook-pro-keyboard-updater/tree/master/firmware/disassembly https://github.com/akirakyle/pinebook-pro-keyboard-updater/t... There's also apparently a bounty: https://www.bountysource.com/issues/88375235-reverse-engineer-touchpad-firmware https://www.bountysource.com/issues/88375235-reverse-enginee... If there is a firmware solution, then I think I'll have no complaints left for the pinebook pro :)

j-pb 6y ago
I wish you could get it with a marble sized trackball instead of the trackpad :D
itsspring 6y ago
Are you able to use bluetooth trackpads, like Apple's Magic Trackpad, with it? Asking for myself before I buy..
- nextos 6y ago
  Probably, the Magic Trackpad works quite well with a Linux mainline kernel.
- kevincox 6y ago
  I use a Wacom Intuos (USB) as as a trackpad which works out of the box. It is nice and big and you can always pick up the pen when it is convenient.
seltzered_ 6y ago
There's also discussions on fundraising/bringing more help to libinput: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235609 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235609
m463 6y ago
I have a linux laptop with a trackpad, and I thought most of the pain was the default settings. Once I turned off the "click in this area for button x" stuff and turned on tap to click, it became 10x more usable. (I'm not familiar with the pinebook trackpad, so it could be more that just configuration)

amock 6y ago

I've had a PineBook Pro for a few months. I added an NVMe drive for extra storage and overall I'm happy with it as a secondary machine since I usually use my desktop. The one thing that I think is much worse than it should be is the trackpad and my view is much more negative than in this review. For me, it's terrible and often borders on unusable for anything that doesn't have a large clickable area. It is such a contrast to the keyboard that is much better than I expected and probably the best laptop keyboard I've used in a long time.

pahool 6y ago
Did you take much of a battery life hit with the addition of the NVMe drive?
- amock 6y ago
  I haven't done much testing, but the battery life is still very good.

type-2 6y ago

> The display resolution is 1920x1080, equivalent to about 100 dpi Maybe a typo? Should be around 157dpi for a 14 inch screen. Though I absolutely agree with the general idea, high dpi screens (over 200 dpi) do make the experience much much better.

eeereerews 6y ago

> a barrel connector power supply What's wrong with this?

paulryanrogers 6y ago
Perhaps USB-C is considered more modern or convenient
- saurik 6y ago
  USB-C means that I get to use any charger I have and can trivially replace it; a barrel-connector is some one-off component that is precious: if I lose it or damage it I am _screwed_. The article says the device also support some charging over USB-C... why even bother including a barrel-connector? It feels wrong.
  - cybernabjo 6y ago
    It's cheaper to get some replacement barrel-connector cables then USB-C
  - detaro 6y ago
    universal PSUs with all of the few common barrel connector sizes are commonly and cheaply available. I personally prefer USB-C too, just because I have more devices with it, but barrel connectors aren't that weird.
- traverseda 6y ago
  It has USB-C charging as well. I think that's sort of the best of both worlds, it's not like a barrel connection adds much to the board, and it means you can run it from a much less complex power supply. It does mean it has an extra port that you might find unnecessary, but at the kind of prices they're selling this at including a usb-c charger would actually add a fair bit to their costs, and you can buy an aftermarket one pretty easily.
- userbinator 6y ago
  I doubt relatively flimsy and tiny USB-C connectors will hold up to the same kind of abuse as a big robust barrel plug. No one seems to complain about their 120/240 mains plugs not being "modern" either...

candiddevmike 6y ago

I wish they had options with more RAM. 4GB is just not enough for serious work these days.

metta2uall 6y ago
Yes, I would expect much more from a "Pro" model, at least 8GB, preferably 16-32GB personally.. Running VMs and containers is quite necessary for high security & software development work..
- whereistimbo 6y ago
  The RK3399 doesn't support more than 8GB RAM CMIIW. Also RK3399 seems very underpowered for software development work, you might want to wait for snapdragon Chromebook or Google's custom Exynos Chromebook.

hestefisk 6y ago

Such an inexpensive machine and reviewer complains about lack of 4K... :) 1080p is pretty decent in a little laptop like this.

TylerE 6y ago
I mean, a $35 RaspPI does 4k...
- bronco21016 6y ago
  4K display not included... I mean that’s not even a fair comparison.
- cushychicken 6y ago
  It also doesn't include a monitor.
  - hestefisk 6y ago
    Yeah and no scsi controller. Lame.
  - ferzul 6y ago
    but it would be nice to pay a bit more and get 4k.
    - zamadatix 6y ago
      I don't think it makes much sense to "pay a bit more and get 4k" on a device which costs $199. If people are looking to "pay a bit more" to get 4k then they should probably look at a device which can actually handle 4k decently not expect it as an upgrade option on one of the cheapest laptops available.
- andrepd 6y ago
  That's completely not the point. They're talking about the display, not video-out capabilities.

seba_dos1 6y ago

I have one. It seems to be a pretty nice machine with a good performance for buck ratio. However, the touchpad and keyboard make it completely unusable for me. The keyboard doesn't register some key combos at all, and I've never used a touchpad this bad...

bufferoverflow 6y ago
Get a bluetooth mouse?
- yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
  If you need an external mouse and keyboard to use a laptop, it's not much of a laptop.
- seba_dos1 6y ago
  In situations where I'd be comfortable using a Bluetooth mouse, I'd probably have my much more powerful amd64 laptop with me. But well, I don't even need a mouse to comfortably use that one :P

arprocter 6y ago

I wish the author expanded on how Midori is "really testing my patience" - kind of a showstopper if you can't browse with what is a very lightweight browser

neurostimulant 6y ago

> There are upgrade kits available, for example an adapter to add an NVMe disk instead of the eMMC. For the original Pinebook, there has been an upgrade kit with a better processor even. I didn't know you could add nvme disk to the pinebook pro. The emmc storage was turning me off, but with this the machine seem to be more attractive to me. If it has upgradable cpu as well I would seriously consider using this laptop, just need to figure out shipping as international shipping is usually handled by the awful state-owned postal company here, which for some reason can't successfully deliver anything to my address.

seoirsewalker 6y ago

I received pinebook pro last week and initially I was really disappointed with the trackpad, double tap was only working 30% of the time, laggy movement, urgh. After some experimentation and someone on the forums pointing me to https://wiki.pine64.org/index.php/Pinebook_Pro#X-Windows_.26_trackpad_settings https://wiki.pine64.org/index.php/Pinebook_Pro#X-Windows_.26... I am getting decent performance.

sam_lowry_ 6y ago

> The keyboard is an absolute joy to use. The keyboard is a cheap no-name, far worse than a Thinkpad keyboard or an Apple keyboard. I had trouble with the button S since the beginning. But this is fine for such a cheap laptop.