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> If South Africa had the opportunities the US has he would now be likely in Praetoria. And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle. In terms of nationality or

> If South Africa had the opportunities the US has he would now be likely in Praetoria. And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle. In terms of nationality or whatever, Elon Musk is as American as anyone else. Probably more American than most. The American nationality isn't fundamentally based on the circumstances of your birth.

deleted 6y ago
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29athrowaway 6y ago
> Elon Musk is as American as anyone else. Probably more American than most He spent the first 17 years of his life in South Africa. We could say his personality and character are the product of South African culture. If he was born in the US, he would probably not be interested in manufacturing. Culturally, the US has moved away from manufacturing, and most of it is being offshored. > The American nationality isn't fundamentally based on the circumstances of your birth. Tell that to people pursuing the American citizenship that were born in American territories like American Samoa or Puerto Rico, where, unlike US states, they get drafted, they cannot vote and they're not considered US citizens.
- josephcsible 6y ago
  > Tell that to people pursuing the American citizenship that were born in American territories like American Samoa or Puerto Rico, where, unlike US states, they get drafted, they cannot vote and they're not considered US citizens. People born in Puerto Rico are US citizens. American Samoa is the exception to how most territories work.
  - 29athrowaway 6y ago
    But they're not a state. And because they're not a state, they have no congress representation, and because they have no congress representation and they are not a state, they do not have electors in the electoral college. So, yes... they are citizens, but they're in complete neglect and have no real representation. If they want to vote, they have to move to a US state.
- philwelch 6y ago
  > Tell that to people pursuing the American citizenship that were born in American territories like American Samoa or Puerto Rico Now you’re doubling back on yourself. You’re the one who drew the distinction between the legal technicalities of citizenship and the more nebulous concept of “nationality”, and yet here you are pontificating about how the legal technicalities of citizenship apply to residents of US territories. What does American Samoa have to do with your implication that immigrants aren’t real Americans?

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

29athrowaway 6y ago

> Elon Musk is as American as anyone else. Probably more American than most He spent the first 17 years of his life in South Africa. We could say his personality and character are the product of South African culture. If he was born in the US, he would probably not be interested in manufacturing. Culturally, the US has moved away from manufacturing, and most of it is being offshored. > The American nationality isn't fundamentally based on the circumstances of your birth. Tell that to people pursuing the American citizenship that were born in American territories like American Samoa or Puerto Rico, where, unlike US states, they get drafted, they cannot vote and they're not considered US citizens.

josephcsible 6y ago
> Tell that to people pursuing the American citizenship that were born in American territories like American Samoa or Puerto Rico, where, unlike US states, they get drafted, they cannot vote and they're not considered US citizens. People born in Puerto Rico are US citizens. American Samoa is the exception to how most territories work.
- 29athrowaway 6y ago
  But they're not a state. And because they're not a state, they have no congress representation, and because they have no congress representation and they are not a state, they do not have electors in the electoral college. So, yes... they are citizens, but they're in complete neglect and have no real representation. If they want to vote, they have to move to a US state.
philwelch 6y ago
> Tell that to people pursuing the American citizenship that were born in American territories like American Samoa or Puerto Rico Now you’re doubling back on yourself. You’re the one who drew the distinction between the legal technicalities of citizenship and the more nebulous concept of “nationality”, and yet here you are pontificating about how the legal technicalities of citizenship apply to residents of US territories. What does American Samoa have to do with your implication that immigrants aren’t real Americans?