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It is disappointing to continue to see such rampant fragmentation within Europe. I had hoped that the EU would break down regulatory barriers and force bureauc

It is disappointing to continue to see such rampant fragmentation within Europe. I had hoped that the EU would break down regulatory barriers and force bureaucratic consolidation, but it seems progress has stalled in the last 10 years. The EU should have one single intelligence agency - not a dysfunctional collection of fighting to be part of the "in" group.

simonh 6y ago
That would be very premature, you’d need much stronger political union first. The risk is the joint Intelligence agency would end up as leaky and compromised as the most leaky, most compromised intelligence agency of the individual countries. That would make the sum equal to the weakest of its parts.
dathinab 6y ago
It's still a union of separate and culture/ political diverse countries. As such it's basically guaranteed to keep country specific intelligence agencies. A EU based agency would be interesting, but given how problematic it is to oversee it probably a nightmare to. A stronger cooperation between EU agencies should be possible.
jhelphenstine 6y ago
One single intelligence agency? And what if the Germans are interested in gaining better understanding of Viktor Orban? Or if the Italians want to know just how far Germany will really go to help them financially? An intelligence agency is a means of acquiring answers to intelligence needs - I'm not sure Europe is of one mind with regard to what questions merit answering.
- seppin 6y ago
  Exactly. You'd need a single united economic and political union first. The EU is heading away from that, not towards it.
  - normalnorm 6y ago
    How do you figure that? The EU is an economic and political union. It might not be complete or perfect, but integration has been happening decade by decade. We now have a single currency, a unified supreme court, a single charter of citizen rights, freedom of movement and a single market. A lot of younger people feel European, there is such a thing as an European identity. Each one of these things was considered impossible at a certain point. It is a slow and hard process but it is happening. I find that the English-speaking media is particularly keen on repeating the mantra that "the EU is collapsing". I've witnessed this all my life. It became more intense now with Brexit, but the UK was not ever a real member. It opted out and demanded exceptions for everything. Unfortunately, the EU had to be built around the UK, not with it. There was also a shift in attitude with the current administration in the US, which sees the EU as an adversary instead of as a friend. So I would take anything I read in English about the EU with a pinch of salt...
    - JetSetWilly 6y ago
      > the UK was not ever a real member. It opted out and demanded exceptions for everything. Unfortunately, the EU had to be built around the UK, not with it. There's a tendency among hardcore europhiles to blame the nasty british for all questioning of the European ideal, as though if it weren't for perfidious albion Europe would be of one mind. This completely ignores both the deep euroscepticism felt by many people across the EU(which European countries tend to just ignore instead of being so hasty like Britain as to actually have a referendum - and if a referendum must be held, just have it again and again until you get the right answer...) and also ignores that other countries have differing opinions to France and Germany too.
      - normalnorm 6y ago
        > There's a tendency among hardcore europhiles to blame the nasty british for all questioning of the European ideal, as though if it weren't for perfidious albion Europe would be of one mind. Perhaps, but that was not what I said at all. What I said is that the UK always chose to not participate in the project, and that the project went on without it. Now, with Brexit, the UK government is openly hostile towards the EU. This is just a fact. Another fact is that the EU was able to maintain a united political front when faced with Brexit (which posed -- and was meant to pose -- an existential threat to the EU). So the reports of EU's death may be premature, as the cliché goes... > This completely ignores both the deep euroscepticism felt by many people across the EU Well, I haven't. On the contrary, I said that it is a very hard and incomplete project, and that it was considered impossible by a lot of people every step of the way. I also mentioned that it is among the younger generations that a European identity is growing. Not established, but growing. > and also ignores that other countries have differing opinions to France and Germany too Well, I ignored none of that. You just assumed it. What I think is undeniable is that there are vested interests in the collapse of the EU. The EU is composed of many small countries, that could be much more easily pushed around if not acting as bloc. Naturally, those who would indeed like to push Europe around dislike the EU. With the stance of the current US administration and of the post-Brexit UK government, it just so happens that in the current year of 2020, a lot of people with such vested interests write in English.
deathgrips 6y ago
Instead it should have one dysfunctional government :)
fulafel 6y ago
This is events from 1970-1990.

simonh 6y ago

That would be very premature, you’d need much stronger political union first. The risk is the joint Intelligence agency would end up as leaky and compromised as the most leaky, most compromised intelligence agency of the individual countries. That would make the sum equal to the weakest of its parts.

dathinab 6y ago

It's still a union of separate and culture/ political diverse countries. As such it's basically guaranteed to keep country specific intelligence agencies. A EU based agency would be interesting, but given how problematic it is to oversee it probably a nightmare to. A stronger cooperation between EU agencies should be possible.

jhelphenstine 6y ago

One single intelligence agency? And what if the Germans are interested in gaining better understanding of Viktor Orban? Or if the Italians want to know just how far Germany will really go to help them financially? An intelligence agency is a means of acquiring answers to intelligence needs - I'm not sure Europe is of one mind with regard to what questions merit answering.

seppin 6y ago
Exactly. You'd need a single united economic and political union first. The EU is heading away from that, not towards it.
- normalnorm 6y ago
  How do you figure that? The EU is an economic and political union. It might not be complete or perfect, but integration has been happening decade by decade. We now have a single currency, a unified supreme court, a single charter of citizen rights, freedom of movement and a single market. A lot of younger people feel European, there is such a thing as an European identity. Each one of these things was considered impossible at a certain point. It is a slow and hard process but it is happening. I find that the English-speaking media is particularly keen on repeating the mantra that "the EU is collapsing". I've witnessed this all my life. It became more intense now with Brexit, but the UK was not ever a real member. It opted out and demanded exceptions for everything. Unfortunately, the EU had to be built around the UK, not with it. There was also a shift in attitude with the current administration in the US, which sees the EU as an adversary instead of as a friend. So I would take anything I read in English about the EU with a pinch of salt...
  - JetSetWilly 6y ago
    > the UK was not ever a real member. It opted out and demanded exceptions for everything. Unfortunately, the EU had to be built around the UK, not with it. There's a tendency among hardcore europhiles to blame the nasty british for all questioning of the European ideal, as though if it weren't for perfidious albion Europe would be of one mind. This completely ignores both the deep euroscepticism felt by many people across the EU(which European countries tend to just ignore instead of being so hasty like Britain as to actually have a referendum - and if a referendum must be held, just have it again and again until you get the right answer...) and also ignores that other countries have differing opinions to France and Germany too.
    - normalnorm 6y ago
      > There's a tendency among hardcore europhiles to blame the nasty british for all questioning of the European ideal, as though if it weren't for perfidious albion Europe would be of one mind. Perhaps, but that was not what I said at all. What I said is that the UK always chose to not participate in the project, and that the project went on without it. Now, with Brexit, the UK government is openly hostile towards the EU. This is just a fact. Another fact is that the EU was able to maintain a united political front when faced with Brexit (which posed -- and was meant to pose -- an existential threat to the EU). So the reports of EU's death may be premature, as the cliché goes... > This completely ignores both the deep euroscepticism felt by many people across the EU Well, I haven't. On the contrary, I said that it is a very hard and incomplete project, and that it was considered impossible by a lot of people every step of the way. I also mentioned that it is among the younger generations that a European identity is growing. Not established, but growing. > and also ignores that other countries have differing opinions to France and Germany too Well, I ignored none of that. You just assumed it. What I think is undeniable is that there are vested interests in the collapse of the EU. The EU is composed of many small countries, that could be much more easily pushed around if not acting as bloc. Naturally, those who would indeed like to push Europe around dislike the EU. With the stance of the current US administration and of the post-Brexit UK government, it just so happens that in the current year of 2020, a lot of people with such vested interests write in English.

deathgrips 6y ago

Instead it should have one dysfunctional government :)

fulafel 6y ago

This is events from 1970-1990.