7 ms·

I'm selling my bootstrapped SaaS project. Currently doing $2500 MRR and growing

28 points by andycloke 6y ago

andycloke 6y ago
Hi HN, I've bootstrapped my SaaS tool Influence Grid (https://www.influencegrid.com https://www.influencegrid.com) since December 2019. It's a TikTok influencer search engine used by marketing agencies, consumer brands etc. I'm looking to sell and thought this doc might be interesting to other HN folk as it goes into how I've built and grown the project, and why I'm selling. Any questions or offers, let me know! andy@influencegrid.com
- didgeoridoo 6y ago
  How many hours per week have you personally had to put into sales, management, and support? $2500/mo would look great if the answer is “barely any”, less so if the answer is “basically a full time job”. Where are you on that spectrum?
  - andycloke 6y ago
    Support is an hour or two a week. Sales and management has varied a lot as I’ve got more and less interested in the project, but a few hours a week. I’ve been working full time somewhere else whilst building this. As with any side project it’s been as much about learning (SEO, marketing, customer development) as the financial returns!
blackrock 6y ago
It sounds risky to build your business on top of someone else’s business. Do you even have legal authorization to access TikTok’s data, and customer base? For an example, PadMapper built their rental search website on top of Craigslist, a few years back. It was actually quite nice at the time. And then, Craigslist shut them down with a cease-and-desist order.
- andycloke 6y ago
  Of course it’s a risk, but as an indie hacker making my first business, being able to build on another platform that’s blowing up has serious benefits in terms of getting traction. I doubt they care at $2500 MRR lol
  - blackrock 6y ago
    I do commend you on that. Good work getting some traction on your idea.
  - tuesday20 6y ago
    Is the data scraped? What is the tech stack?
    - andycloke 6y ago
      Yes Backend: TypeScript, Node, Postgres, Apollo Server, TypeORM Frontend: TypeScript, React, Apollo Client, Razzle.js/ After.js (just for SSR) Deployed on Heroku More details in the link
- heromal 6y ago
  Maybe that's why he's selling lol. That, or the fact that tiktok is working on an ad system similar to youtube, which will let the influences make money. That'll kill this.
  - ckdarby 6y ago
    Back in the day I had a close friend who ran something on Instagram that would scrape data, allow scheduling of posts, groups that would be automated to like your posts (non-bot accounts), etc. They had considered selling at one point because they feared Instagram was going to shut them down with legal force. They clear nearly a million in revenue before FB legal team showed up and told them to cease and desist. They closed shop, took their excellent profit and went on to found actual enterprise software. TL;DR OP probably wants to sell to not have to gamble with legal coming after them as they grow.
oonny 6y ago
genuine question: how is this different than the official creator marketplace from TikTok? https://creatormarketplace.tiktok.com/ https://creatormarketplace.tiktok.com/ I'm in the influencer space. Why would I pay you when I get the same thing for free from Tiktok?
- vaughnegut 6y ago
  I'm sketchy on details, but in the posting the author mentions that the creator marketplace is opt in, so there's (comparatively) few people on there.
- andycloke 6y ago
  Yeah I address that in the doc. Basically many of my customers have the TikTok CM but it hasn’t got enough people on it. Obviously that could change
jefecoon 6y ago
Hi Andy, Former founder, now investment banker here. Sorry to hear you're not interested in continuing the business moving forward. Btw, if you really want to sell, probably best to work on this answer [ e.g. I love other things > i hate this ]. My quick take: - $2500/mo MRR in ~6mo is nice validation of the opportunity. A natural question would be "are you interested in pursuing this as an actual business, and becoming a startup founder?" You should expect this question from any & every potential acquirer. Btw, I'd coach you that "i don't love this space" isn't best answer; try "i find this super interesting, but I love XYZ and that's where my heart is..." Follow-up question: would you join us as a developer on this for 12 months?" - You'll be viewed as "side hustle," not pre-seed startup. By that i mean to say you're level of 'completeness' and value will be categorized this way. This will make it challenging for a buyer to consider you an 'acqui-hire' level target, e.g. the old adage "$1M / developer" type acqui-hire valuation some co's use for buying teams. - I think you're most likely acquirers will be influencer marketplace and/or related mktg / agency / services firms [ e.g. Hypr, Traacker, similar ]. They're the independent alternatives to TikTok, Snap, whomever's own features in this area. - Scraping will be considered a fundamental risk, e.g. "does your current usage fully abide TikTok Terms of Use?" Do they offer an API? If so, why aren't you using it? How at risk is your scraping of being cut off by TT in the future? Have you spoken with a TT biz dev person about this? See 'ckdarby' comment on friend's Insta business getting C&D ltr from FB legal; very hard for you to be acquired if you have any of this risk. - Valuation: you're super early stage; sorry, i'm not super familiar with valuation around side-hustle projects so I'd google this a bit to see if there are nice precedent / comparables. - Classic mba style valuation rules-of-thumb, for later stage / at scale businesses: 6.5-7.5x EBITDA. Fairly standard business school valuation rule-of-thumb, e.g. if you were at scale business being considered by private equity buyers they'd start their valuation & waterfall model around here. Finally, congratulations -- this is a fantastic side-hustle. You may be able to find a way to get a deal closed, especially if you're willing to go with the code-base to help it land, migrate off scraping to API, etc. J
- andycloke 6y ago
  Hi J, Thanks for all the feedback! Not sure I totally get your point about my reason for selling. Are you saying I should or shouldn't say my heart's not in it? That's the genuine reason and I've always built in the open and been transparent about my business/ goals. My primary motivation now is starting another SaaS project like this one, but in a niche that I'm more interested in. At the moment I think that's B2B lead gen or SEO. Obviously very different beasts to this - mature industries etc but things I've developed an interest in by doing this more opportunist project. So I'm 100% not looking for an acquire-hire! Happy to be viewed as a side hustle. That's basically what it has been until very recently. Yes, those are the main people I'm speaking to at the moment. Also Indie Hacker types. Agree, if it wasn't for the fact it relies on scraping this thing would be worth 5 x much as I've suggested in the doc. I'd say this is very hard to value, even looking at historical multiples on Flippa etc. Please don't mention MBAs!

28 points by andycloke 6y ago

Hi HN, I've bootstrapped my SaaS tool Influence Grid (https://www.influencegrid.com https://www.influencegrid.com) since December 2019. It's a TikTok influencer search engine used by marketing agencies, consumer brands etc. I'm looking to sell and thought this doc might be interesting to other HN folk as it goes into how I've built and grown the project, and why I'm selling. Any questions or offers, let me know! andy@influencegrid.com

didgeoridoo 6y ago
How many hours per week have you personally had to put into sales, management, and support? $2500/mo would look great if the answer is “barely any”, less so if the answer is “basically a full time job”. Where are you on that spectrum?
- andycloke 6y ago
  Support is an hour or two a week. Sales and management has varied a lot as I’ve got more and less interested in the project, but a few hours a week. I’ve been working full time somewhere else whilst building this. As with any side project it’s been as much about learning (SEO, marketing, customer development) as the financial returns!

blackrock 6y ago

It sounds risky to build your business on top of someone else’s business. Do you even have legal authorization to access TikTok’s data, and customer base? For an example, PadMapper built their rental search website on top of Craigslist, a few years back. It was actually quite nice at the time. And then, Craigslist shut them down with a cease-and-desist order.

andycloke 6y ago
Of course it’s a risk, but as an indie hacker making my first business, being able to build on another platform that’s blowing up has serious benefits in terms of getting traction. I doubt they care at $2500 MRR lol
- blackrock 6y ago
  I do commend you on that. Good work getting some traction on your idea.
- tuesday20 6y ago
  Is the data scraped? What is the tech stack?
  - andycloke 6y ago
    Yes Backend: TypeScript, Node, Postgres, Apollo Server, TypeORM Frontend: TypeScript, React, Apollo Client, Razzle.js/ After.js (just for SSR) Deployed on Heroku More details in the link
heromal 6y ago
Maybe that's why he's selling lol. That, or the fact that tiktok is working on an ad system similar to youtube, which will let the influences make money. That'll kill this.
- ckdarby 6y ago
  Back in the day I had a close friend who ran something on Instagram that would scrape data, allow scheduling of posts, groups that would be automated to like your posts (non-bot accounts), etc. They had considered selling at one point because they feared Instagram was going to shut them down with legal force. They clear nearly a million in revenue before FB legal team showed up and told them to cease and desist. They closed shop, took their excellent profit and went on to found actual enterprise software. TL;DR OP probably wants to sell to not have to gamble with legal coming after them as they grow.

oonny 6y ago

genuine question: how is this different than the official creator marketplace from TikTok? https://creatormarketplace.tiktok.com/ https://creatormarketplace.tiktok.com/ I'm in the influencer space. Why would I pay you when I get the same thing for free from Tiktok?

vaughnegut 6y ago
I'm sketchy on details, but in the posting the author mentions that the creator marketplace is opt in, so there's (comparatively) few people on there.
andycloke 6y ago
Yeah I address that in the doc. Basically many of my customers have the TikTok CM but it hasn’t got enough people on it. Obviously that could change

jefecoon 6y ago

Hi Andy, Former founder, now investment banker here. Sorry to hear you're not interested in continuing the business moving forward. Btw, if you really want to sell, probably best to work on this answer [ e.g. I love other things > i hate this ]. My quick take: - $2500/mo MRR in ~6mo is nice validation of the opportunity. A natural question would be "are you interested in pursuing this as an actual business, and becoming a startup founder?" You should expect this question from any & every potential acquirer. Btw, I'd coach you that "i don't love this space" isn't best answer; try "i find this super interesting, but I love XYZ and that's where my heart is..." Follow-up question: would you join us as a developer on this for 12 months?" - You'll be viewed as "side hustle," not pre-seed startup. By that i mean to say you're level of 'completeness' and value will be categorized this way. This will make it challenging for a buyer to consider you an 'acqui-hire' level target, e.g. the old adage "$1M / developer" type acqui-hire valuation some co's use for buying teams. - I think you're most likely acquirers will be influencer marketplace and/or related mktg / agency / services firms [ e.g. Hypr, Traacker, similar ]. They're the independent alternatives to TikTok, Snap, whomever's own features in this area. - Scraping will be considered a fundamental risk, e.g. "does your current usage fully abide TikTok Terms of Use?" Do they offer an API? If so, why aren't you using it? How at risk is your scraping of being cut off by TT in the future? Have you spoken with a TT biz dev person about this? See 'ckdarby' comment on friend's Insta business getting C&D ltr from FB legal; very hard for you to be acquired if you have any of this risk. - Valuation: you're super early stage; sorry, i'm not super familiar with valuation around side-hustle projects so I'd google this a bit to see if there are nice precedent / comparables. - Classic mba style valuation rules-of-thumb, for later stage / at scale businesses: 6.5-7.5x EBITDA. Fairly standard business school valuation rule-of-thumb, e.g. if you were at scale business being considered by private equity buyers they'd start their valuation & waterfall model around here. Finally, congratulations -- this is a fantastic side-hustle. You may be able to find a way to get a deal closed, especially if you're willing to go with the code-base to help it land, migrate off scraping to API, etc. J

andycloke 6y ago
Hi J, Thanks for all the feedback! Not sure I totally get your point about my reason for selling. Are you saying I should or shouldn't say my heart's not in it? That's the genuine reason and I've always built in the open and been transparent about my business/ goals. My primary motivation now is starting another SaaS project like this one, but in a niche that I'm more interested in. At the moment I think that's B2B lead gen or SEO. Obviously very different beasts to this - mature industries etc but things I've developed an interest in by doing this more opportunist project. So I'm 100% not looking for an acquire-hire! Happy to be viewed as a side hustle. That's basically what it has been until very recently. Yes, those are the main people I'm speaking to at the moment. Also Indie Hacker types. Agree, if it wasn't for the fact it relies on scraping this thing would be worth 5 x much as I've suggested in the doc. I'd say this is very hard to value, even looking at historical multiples on Flippa etc. Please don't mention MBAs!