6 ms·

I'm not saying what the article is describing isn't necessarily happening, but cmon do a little more research than that. Their entire evidence is bringing up t

I'm not saying what the article is describing isn't necessarily happening, but cmon do a little more research than that. Their entire evidence is bringing up that Lyft and The Container Store Group reduced salaries for the period. They didn't even say by how much. Even if the labor statistics for the pandemic months isn't here, having your article backbone be "anecdotal data" from 2 companies, neither of whom hire that many people to begin with, makes all the conclusions extrapolated a little doubtful, even if they end up being true.

MattGaiser 6y ago
They have more evidence than that. They cite both a Federal Reserve survey as well as a VC fund and an investment bank.
- tehwebguy 6y ago
  Also like nonstop posts on r/legaladvice asking if people have legal recourse for pay cuts (they don't)
seltzered_ 6y ago
I think that's the thing, it might be too early to actually find any real published data on this. People will salary cuts will still be paying their rent/mortage and possibly spending more during this time. Still doesn't hurt to leverage anecdotal data. You may not know until there's later reports on net savings rate.
- alistairSH 6y ago
  Anecdote... My employer suspended most promotions and merit increases. They also suspended the 401k match. I assume by the time things are back to normal, I'll be out 9-12 months of matching, and will be 18 months without a merit increase. Any longer than that, and I'll be shopping for another position elsewhere. (and they only get that much leeway because it's a nice place to work, I walk to the office in normal times, and simple inertia of a 20 year career there).
wycy 6y ago
I personally know 2 people, a healthcare (non-COVID) worker and an architect, who've had salaries cut about 20% as well. Still anecdata, of course, but throwing it onto the pile.
segmondy 6y ago
The first salary cut is bonus, lots of companies chopped off their bonuses.
- dmoy 6y ago
  Also things like 401k matching, etc. Seeing a lot of that too.
elicash 6y ago
They specifically list three (not two) companies, but suggest it's happening on other earnings calls at well. I don't know that they need to make a giant list of every company. Others, below, list additional evidence in the article. They say, in the second sentence: "The hard numbers won’t be in for months, but anecdotal evidence is piling up." Anecdotally, I've heard similar from friends and family, too. Is there a single quote in the piece that you think COULD be inaccurate? I think it smartly distinguishes between what we know and don't know.
- goalieca 6y ago
  I was furloughed as were many of my neighbours and friends in tech. Some are drawing up lists for layoffs as we speak. There’s few job opportunities now. Many of us hate the cut but do enjoy the stability of keeping our jobs. Overall, I think tech will be bruised but not completely shattered like others. The economy is probably going to take years to recover.
snarf21 6y ago
My company did this as well. People over $X had to take a cut. One additional reason is how the PPP is written. Only the first $100K of an employee's salary is using in the PPP loan amount calculation. Cutting people closer to that mark gives them the maximum free money without using up cash savings.
Shivetya 6y ago
We did ten percent across the board for salaried, executive level is higher, and we have 50k employees world wide but I cannot say how many outside of HQ/SC are affected as we have a few subsidiaries and some areas are covered by different laws. This is to continue for sixty days minimum. This is in addition to those furloughed. Almost every contractor was released in April. Company has a reserve but they have to step in now because the unknowns are still too high. They have been really open with the issues at hand, the company's ability to withstand such pressures, and ideas going forward. Based on neighbors in my area, some are wholly unaffected, one has one day a week furlough which is effectively twenty percent but with benefits intact, a few are laid off completely or their spouse is. Pretty much I figure people are being tight with money even if unaffected because of the uncertainty and leadership at local, city, state, and federal levels, is all over the place; let alone those in the same using FUD to up their November chances * we are in automotive parts distribution and a few other industries * I of course do not ever speak for my employer
bachmeier 6y ago
Every university in the US is planning pay cuts in addition to the layoffs AFAICT.
- tesin 6y ago
  This is anecdata of one but not including service staff (student union etc.) we're looking at hiring. Enrollment is still high, and there's still the endowment as backstop. And in my particular niche, I still see job openings - they're just remote now
- e15ctr0n 6y ago
  A friend, who is an adjunct professor at an east coast university, was laid off on April 30. He's still looking for work.
timewasted 6y ago
I’m a software developer in the travel/hospitality/entertainment industry and I (along with the rest of my coworkers) took a 20% cut around the end of March.
karlkatzke 6y ago
In March, my wife had hers cut 10% and I was laid off. (She works for a major top-ten multinational engineering firm, and I worked for a major travel industry company in tech.) Everyone in her company above her took a 20% pay cut. These weren't small companies; my employer cut 3,000 people and reduced the pay of a chunk of their other 20k employees, and my wife's company employs more than 40k-ish full time and many more contractors and subcontractors. It's the knock-on effect that I'd worry about. We immediately cut all of our luxury spending, canceled our wine club subscriptions and gym memberships and started buying boxed wine and lifting weights in the garage again... we're not sure yet if we'll go back to those things when this is all over.
- PenguinCoder 6y ago
  > worked for a major travel industry company Unfortunately, that is probably the reasoning; despite the 'tech' part.
  - karlkatzke 6y ago
    Oh, I’m not looking for why I was laid off. I’m looking at the experiences of many Americans, and many other people worldwide. This recession is going to hurt, and some companies are going to have to borrow so much more than they can pay back just to exist after the illness passes.
av_engr 6y ago
Chiming in on anecdotal evidence, I personally experienced a 15% reduction as well. I'm in a smaller startup working on robotics/autonomy. The outlook for VC funding is uncertain so the decision was to reduce salary for extended company runway. The 15% was across the entire company.
pixelface 6y ago
one more anecdata, complete freeze on all movement and we all got handed down a 20% salary cut backdated 2 weeks. this came shortly after a round of layoffs, and another round is rumored to be coming soon.
- pmiller2 6y ago
  That's a super low blow to backdate a salary cut.
  - pixelface 6y ago
    it's also completely illegal, but doing anything about it would be a pyrrhic victory at this point - we can't go out and interview for new jobs when the whole state is on lockdown. definitely have it better than many, but it's a frustrating situation.
geori 6y ago
Anecdotally: I'm CTO at a custom apparel manufacturer. Demand plummeted for events and foot traffic at our customer's stores died, so nobody is buying high end suits. Our revenue is now 20% of what it was back in January. We got our PPP loans, so we kept everyone in the USA employed, but had to cut all salaries above $50k by 25%. And we will probably have to have a second round of cuts and have some layoffs in June.
pmiller2 6y ago
We either laid off or 100% furloughed about 15% of staff. Those of us who remain got a 20% furlough, except for people already working less than full time.
dunham 6y ago
The company I work for cut salaries either 25 or 50%, depending on the employee. Non-exempt employees had their hours cut either 25 or 50%. A few were furloughed. (We have about 1000 employees.)
JeremyNT 6y ago
Anecdote, my wife's employer cut pay for employees at her level by 10% (technically in the form of her working 10% less, but her position is salaried and she's not likely to really take that time off). The exec level is taking a bigger haircut. My own employer cut exec salary by 10% but it terminated its retirement benefits across the board (~10% of base compensation contribution). There is also normally an annual merit/COL salary adjustment this time of year, but that was skipped across the board. Both of us work at very large, successful non-profits (she in healthcare, I in education) that otherwise are well regarded as good employers. So this isn't just some pent up excuse for a greedy corp to cut a check for the shareholders and execs at the cost of the working stiffs. I know you're asking for more than anecdotes, but this sure smells like a broad trend (and, to be honest, a reasonable strategy) to me.
kronin 6y ago
My employer did 20% across the board, 2 months ago. Security software.
dragonwriter 6y ago
The State of California has proposed a 10% effective pay cut for the entire state workforce (235k+) in the governor's May Revise proposed budget for FY 2021 (July 2020-June 2021), which would likely be achieved by 2-day/month furloughs if some other reduction with the same fiscal impact isn't negotiated in the next couple of weeks with public sector unions. Which, sure, is just another anecdotal data point, but...

MattGaiser 6y ago

They have more evidence than that. They cite both a Federal Reserve survey as well as a VC fund and an investment bank.

tehwebguy 6y ago
Also like nonstop posts on r/legaladvice asking if people have legal recourse for pay cuts (they don't)

seltzered_ 6y ago

I think that's the thing, it might be too early to actually find any real published data on this. People will salary cuts will still be paying their rent/mortage and possibly spending more during this time. Still doesn't hurt to leverage anecdotal data. You may not know until there's later reports on net savings rate.

alistairSH 6y ago
Anecdote... My employer suspended most promotions and merit increases. They also suspended the 401k match. I assume by the time things are back to normal, I'll be out 9-12 months of matching, and will be 18 months without a merit increase. Any longer than that, and I'll be shopping for another position elsewhere. (and they only get that much leeway because it's a nice place to work, I walk to the office in normal times, and simple inertia of a 20 year career there).

wycy 6y ago

I personally know 2 people, a healthcare (non-COVID) worker and an architect, who've had salaries cut about 20% as well. Still anecdata, of course, but throwing it onto the pile.

segmondy 6y ago

The first salary cut is bonus, lots of companies chopped off their bonuses.

dmoy 6y ago
Also things like 401k matching, etc. Seeing a lot of that too.

elicash 6y ago

They specifically list three (not two) companies, but suggest it's happening on other earnings calls at well. I don't know that they need to make a giant list of every company. Others, below, list additional evidence in the article. They say, in the second sentence: "The hard numbers won’t be in for months, but anecdotal evidence is piling up." Anecdotally, I've heard similar from friends and family, too. Is there a single quote in the piece that you think COULD be inaccurate? I think it smartly distinguishes between what we know and don't know.

goalieca 6y ago
I was furloughed as were many of my neighbours and friends in tech. Some are drawing up lists for layoffs as we speak. There’s few job opportunities now. Many of us hate the cut but do enjoy the stability of keeping our jobs. Overall, I think tech will be bruised but not completely shattered like others. The economy is probably going to take years to recover.

snarf21 6y ago

My company did this as well. People over $X had to take a cut. One additional reason is how the PPP is written. Only the first $100K of an employee's salary is using in the PPP loan amount calculation. Cutting people closer to that mark gives them the maximum free money without using up cash savings.

Shivetya 6y ago

We did ten percent across the board for salaried, executive level is higher, and we have 50k employees world wide but I cannot say how many outside of HQ/SC are affected as we have a few subsidiaries and some areas are covered by different laws. This is to continue for sixty days minimum. This is in addition to those furloughed. Almost every contractor was released in April. Company has a reserve but they have to step in now because the unknowns are still too high. They have been really open with the issues at hand, the company's ability to withstand such pressures, and ideas going forward. Based on neighbors in my area, some are wholly unaffected, one has one day a week furlough which is effectively twenty percent but with benefits intact, a few are laid off completely or their spouse is. Pretty much I figure people are being tight with money even if unaffected because of the uncertainty and leadership at local, city, state, and federal levels, is all over the place; let alone those in the same using FUD to up their November chances * we are in automotive parts distribution and a few other industries * I of course do not ever speak for my employer

bachmeier 6y ago

Every university in the US is planning pay cuts in addition to the layoffs AFAICT.

tesin 6y ago
This is anecdata of one but not including service staff (student union etc.) we're looking at hiring. Enrollment is still high, and there's still the endowment as backstop. And in my particular niche, I still see job openings - they're just remote now
e15ctr0n 6y ago
A friend, who is an adjunct professor at an east coast university, was laid off on April 30. He's still looking for work.

timewasted 6y ago

I’m a software developer in the travel/hospitality/entertainment industry and I (along with the rest of my coworkers) took a 20% cut around the end of March.

karlkatzke 6y ago

In March, my wife had hers cut 10% and I was laid off. (She works for a major top-ten multinational engineering firm, and I worked for a major travel industry company in tech.) Everyone in her company above her took a 20% pay cut. These weren't small companies; my employer cut 3,000 people and reduced the pay of a chunk of their other 20k employees, and my wife's company employs more than 40k-ish full time and many more contractors and subcontractors. It's the knock-on effect that I'd worry about. We immediately cut all of our luxury spending, canceled our wine club subscriptions and gym memberships and started buying boxed wine and lifting weights in the garage again... we're not sure yet if we'll go back to those things when this is all over.

PenguinCoder 6y ago
> worked for a major travel industry company Unfortunately, that is probably the reasoning; despite the 'tech' part.
- karlkatzke 6y ago
  Oh, I’m not looking for why I was laid off. I’m looking at the experiences of many Americans, and many other people worldwide. This recession is going to hurt, and some companies are going to have to borrow so much more than they can pay back just to exist after the illness passes.

av_engr 6y ago

Chiming in on anecdotal evidence, I personally experienced a 15% reduction as well. I'm in a smaller startup working on robotics/autonomy. The outlook for VC funding is uncertain so the decision was to reduce salary for extended company runway. The 15% was across the entire company.

pixelface 6y ago

one more anecdata, complete freeze on all movement and we all got handed down a 20% salary cut backdated 2 weeks. this came shortly after a round of layoffs, and another round is rumored to be coming soon.

pmiller2 6y ago
That's a super low blow to backdate a salary cut.
- pixelface 6y ago
  it's also completely illegal, but doing anything about it would be a pyrrhic victory at this point - we can't go out and interview for new jobs when the whole state is on lockdown. definitely have it better than many, but it's a frustrating situation.

geori 6y ago

Anecdotally: I'm CTO at a custom apparel manufacturer. Demand plummeted for events and foot traffic at our customer's stores died, so nobody is buying high end suits. Our revenue is now 20% of what it was back in January. We got our PPP loans, so we kept everyone in the USA employed, but had to cut all salaries above $50k by 25%. And we will probably have to have a second round of cuts and have some layoffs in June.

pmiller2 6y ago

We either laid off or 100% furloughed about 15% of staff. Those of us who remain got a 20% furlough, except for people already working less than full time.

dunham 6y ago

The company I work for cut salaries either 25 or 50%, depending on the employee. Non-exempt employees had their hours cut either 25 or 50%. A few were furloughed. (We have about 1000 employees.)

JeremyNT 6y ago

Anecdote, my wife's employer cut pay for employees at her level by 10% (technically in the form of her working 10% less, but her position is salaried and she's not likely to really take that time off). The exec level is taking a bigger haircut. My own employer cut exec salary by 10% but it terminated its retirement benefits across the board (~10% of base compensation contribution). There is also normally an annual merit/COL salary adjustment this time of year, but that was skipped across the board. Both of us work at very large, successful non-profits (she in healthcare, I in education) that otherwise are well regarded as good employers. So this isn't just some pent up excuse for a greedy corp to cut a check for the shareholders and execs at the cost of the working stiffs. I know you're asking for more than anecdotes, but this sure smells like a broad trend (and, to be honest, a reasonable strategy) to me.

kronin 6y ago

My employer did 20% across the board, 2 months ago. Security software.

dragonwriter 6y ago

The State of California has proposed a 10% effective pay cut for the entire state workforce (235k+) in the governor's May Revise proposed budget for FY 2021 (July 2020-June 2021), which would likely be achieved by 2-day/month furloughs if some other reduction with the same fiscal impact isn't negotiated in the next couple of weeks with public sector unions. Which, sure, is just another anecdotal data point, but...