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True, but I won’t own the car in 10 years so I don’t care. I’m not discounting your point or anyone else’s on merit. What I’m getting at is that it’s a minority

by jm4 6y ago

True, but I won’t own the car in 10 years so I don’t care. I’m not discounting your point or anyone else’s on merit. What I’m getting at is that it’s a minority position and most people don’t care. How many 10 year old cars do you see out on the road? Yeah, they’re out there, but most of them are a lot newer than that. Most buyers just don’t keep a car long enough for any of this to matter and the ones that do care have 100 other options.

bcrosby95 6y ago
> Yeah, they’re out there, but most of them are a lot newer than that. What do you think happens to a car when you're done with it? In the USA, the average passenger vehicle age in 2019 was 11.8 years: https://www.bts.gov/content/average-age-automobiles-and-trucks-operation-united-states https://www.bts.gov/content/average-age-automobiles-and-truc...
- jm4 6y ago
  It ends up on a used lot, at an auction, shipped overseas or in a junk yard depending on how long I drove it and what kind of shape it’s in. But I don’t care. The next owner isn’t my problem and I’m not going to give it a second thought. The fact is I’m not going to keep a Tesla long enough that the warranty expires and I can trade it or sell it for reasonable value in order to get a new one so the ability to get it repaired by a third party is irrelevant to me. What I’m arguing is that this is true for most Tesla buyers and Tesla doesn’t have to cater to buyers who demand right to repair because there are 100 other options in that space.
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    Tesla cares at least somewhat about what happens out of warranty because producing junk that costs an arm and a leg to keep running beyond the warranty is not how you build the kind of reputation that lets you move downmarket which has been Tesla's stated goal since the beginning.
    - jm4 6y ago
      That's their problem, not mine. My concern as an owner is whether I could reasonably sell or trade the car for a new one after I drive it 3-6 years and that's been satisfied. The point where it's difficult to unload a used Tesla is when I question whether it's worthwhile to buy a new one. As long as you can buy one, take it somewhere to get it repaired, expect reasonable resale value and then easily sell or trade it in, that checks the important boxes for most buyers. Tesla has achieved that. Is there room for improvement? Sure. Is it turning off a few potential buyers? Maybe, but not enough of them that it hasn't become a mainstream car.
LyndsySimon 6y ago
> How many 10 year old cars do you see out on the road? Yeah, they’re out there, but most of them are a lot newer than that This must be a regional thing. I would guess the majority of vehicleS on the road in Arkansas are more than 10 years old. My daily driver is a 2000 (built in 1999). Granted, it’s a Jeep Wrangler, so that’s probably not representative of the overall market... but my wife’s vehicle is a 2015 Kia Sorento and still looks and feels “new”. Out of curiosity, how much do you drive your Tesla? I don’t commute every day but my Jeep has ~180k on it. The Kia has ~120k. We’re starting to consider upgrading the Kia, but unless we find a crazy deal it would surprise me if we kept it another five years and 100k+ miles.
- jm4 6y ago
  I drive the Tesla 50-120 miles a day depending on what I’m doing that day. I mostly got it for the autopilot and then loved everything else after the fact. Whatever flaws autopilot has, it’s life changing if you have to spend a lot of time on the highway. P.S. An old Wrangler definitely isn’t representative. Hell, the old ones are even better. My wife has a newer one and we will probably keep it forever. Great vehicles.
ariwilson 6y ago
The average American car is 11.8 years old. https://www.autoblog.com/2019/06/27/record-average-age-cars-on-road/ https://www.autoblog.com/2019/06/27/record-average-age-cars-...

by jm4 6y ago

bcrosby95 6y ago

> Yeah, they’re out there, but most of them are a lot newer than that. What do you think happens to a car when you're done with it? In the USA, the average passenger vehicle age in 2019 was 11.8 years: https://www.bts.gov/content/average-age-automobiles-and-trucks-operation-united-states https://www.bts.gov/content/average-age-automobiles-and-truc...

jm4 6y ago
It ends up on a used lot, at an auction, shipped overseas or in a junk yard depending on how long I drove it and what kind of shape it’s in. But I don’t care. The next owner isn’t my problem and I’m not going to give it a second thought. The fact is I’m not going to keep a Tesla long enough that the warranty expires and I can trade it or sell it for reasonable value in order to get a new one so the ability to get it repaired by a third party is irrelevant to me. What I’m arguing is that this is true for most Tesla buyers and Tesla doesn’t have to cater to buyers who demand right to repair because there are 100 other options in that space.
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  Tesla cares at least somewhat about what happens out of warranty because producing junk that costs an arm and a leg to keep running beyond the warranty is not how you build the kind of reputation that lets you move downmarket which has been Tesla's stated goal since the beginning.
  - jm4 6y ago
    That's their problem, not mine. My concern as an owner is whether I could reasonably sell or trade the car for a new one after I drive it 3-6 years and that's been satisfied. The point where it's difficult to unload a used Tesla is when I question whether it's worthwhile to buy a new one. As long as you can buy one, take it somewhere to get it repaired, expect reasonable resale value and then easily sell or trade it in, that checks the important boxes for most buyers. Tesla has achieved that. Is there room for improvement? Sure. Is it turning off a few potential buyers? Maybe, but not enough of them that it hasn't become a mainstream car.

LyndsySimon 6y ago

> How many 10 year old cars do you see out on the road? Yeah, they’re out there, but most of them are a lot newer than that This must be a regional thing. I would guess the majority of vehicleS on the road in Arkansas are more than 10 years old. My daily driver is a 2000 (built in 1999). Granted, it’s a Jeep Wrangler, so that’s probably not representative of the overall market... but my wife’s vehicle is a 2015 Kia Sorento and still looks and feels “new”. Out of curiosity, how much do you drive your Tesla? I don’t commute every day but my Jeep has ~180k on it. The Kia has ~120k. We’re starting to consider upgrading the Kia, but unless we find a crazy deal it would surprise me if we kept it another five years and 100k+ miles.

jm4 6y ago
I drive the Tesla 50-120 miles a day depending on what I’m doing that day. I mostly got it for the autopilot and then loved everything else after the fact. Whatever flaws autopilot has, it’s life changing if you have to spend a lot of time on the highway. P.S. An old Wrangler definitely isn’t representative. Hell, the old ones are even better. My wife has a newer one and we will probably keep it forever. Great vehicles.

ariwilson 6y ago

The average American car is 11.8 years old. https://www.autoblog.com/2019/06/27/record-average-age-cars-on-road/ https://www.autoblog.com/2019/06/27/record-average-age-cars-...