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More housing won't help if they don't _want_ housing. I lived on the streets for awhile and _many_ people did not want homes, they wanted comfort, food, happin

More housing won't help if they don't _want_ housing. I lived on the streets for awhile and _many_ people did not want homes, they wanted comfort, food, happiness, forget their pain, booze, drugs, entertainment.... a house? Nope. Now what do you do with those people?

peer2pay 6y ago
I think thebradbrain is talking more about a longer timeframe here. Nobody is born with the goal to become homeless and therefore eliminating the factors that cause homelessness before the people actually end up on the street should be the focus.
- 7373737373 6y ago
  The factors that cause homelessness are not only material, but psychological and social as well. A mentally ill or socially isolated or outcast person won't be necessarily less so just because they have a roof over their head. I once met a man who's only social contacts were other homeless people around him. He shared his food with them, although this might have not been reciprocated. This feeling of giving something was important to him, even though it seems one cannot be friends with other homeless people. Other than this, he had absolutely no one who cared about him. He got into psychotic episodes and had a criminal record. I met another man who once had it all, and then lost it, money, purpose, love, meaning. These people are utterly lost, forgotten, neglected at a spiritual, psychological and physical level. Drugs rob them of their agency. They were forced to see behind the memeplex that is society, with its values and ideals and virtues that only exist when one is privileged enough to live away from the chaos that is reality. They have personalities or had experiences that are not compatible with a civilized society, their human desires cannot be constrained by teachings of morality or even the abstract threat of state violence. They are extreme risk takers, or have sociopsychological differences/difficulties, different modes of thought, sometimes temporary, sometimes induced due to traumatizing life circumstances or drug use.
  - LyndsySimon 6y ago
    > the memeplex that is society This concept stands out to me. Is this phrasing something I’d not encountered before, and it looks like there’s a whole are of anthropology that I’ve somehow overlooked to this point. I have some reading to do :)
- gridlockd 6y ago
  For some people the only way to live free is to become "homeless", which is really just a consequence of not living up to anyone else's standards.
DoreenMichele 6y ago
We don't really need to worry about those people. Let's just build enough housing for those who want housing. That at least shrinks the problem. Let's do what reasonably can be done and follow the 80/20 rule and take care of the majority of the problem that is relatively easily resolved, thereby freeing up more resources for the short list of really, really hard cases.
- polalavik 6y ago
  But we do need to worry about those people when those people may be a large percentage of the people on the streets. These people are deep into the throws of mental illness, addiction, or both. What do you do to help people who don’t want to help themselves? It’s a very difficult problem and I don’t know if there is an easy solution that doesn’t infringe on people’s rights. You can’t make being homeless illegal and state conservatorship seems dystopian.
  - DoreenMichele 6y ago
    There is a clear connection between housing costs and rate of homelessness. https://streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com/2018/11/the-clear-connection-between-housing.html https://streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com/2018/11/the-clear-c... This country has an inadequate supply of housing nationwide. We have generally been under building housing for decades, then we act like our homeless population is just a bunch of "junkies and crazies." When I say "we don't need to worry about them," I mean the existence of people who are homeless by choice should not be an excuse to keep not building adequate housing and justify punishing those who do want housing on the excuse that "some of y'all losers don't even want housing." I spent nearly six years homeless. I've studied this problem space. I am actively developing information resources and best practices. "Build more housing -- especially stuff like Missing Middle Housing" is the short answer to a large part of this. Healthcare availability is another factor that makes a difference and help connecting to earned income that works for them in spite of handicaps and so forth. Earning money online is part of how I made progress on my issues and got myself back into housing.
  - thebradbain 6y ago
thebradbain 6y ago
I am by no means a sociological expert, but I think it is safe to assume a large majority of homeless do not want to be homeless; I’ll defer to those who have dedicated their lives to the fixing the issue of homelessness on how to remediate that special case, if it is indeed a significant concern.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

peer2pay 6y ago

I think thebradbrain is talking more about a longer timeframe here. Nobody is born with the goal to become homeless and therefore eliminating the factors that cause homelessness before the people actually end up on the street should be the focus.

7373737373 6y ago
The factors that cause homelessness are not only material, but psychological and social as well. A mentally ill or socially isolated or outcast person won't be necessarily less so just because they have a roof over their head. I once met a man who's only social contacts were other homeless people around him. He shared his food with them, although this might have not been reciprocated. This feeling of giving something was important to him, even though it seems one cannot be friends with other homeless people. Other than this, he had absolutely no one who cared about him. He got into psychotic episodes and had a criminal record. I met another man who once had it all, and then lost it, money, purpose, love, meaning. These people are utterly lost, forgotten, neglected at a spiritual, psychological and physical level. Drugs rob them of their agency. They were forced to see behind the memeplex that is society, with its values and ideals and virtues that only exist when one is privileged enough to live away from the chaos that is reality. They have personalities or had experiences that are not compatible with a civilized society, their human desires cannot be constrained by teachings of morality or even the abstract threat of state violence. They are extreme risk takers, or have sociopsychological differences/difficulties, different modes of thought, sometimes temporary, sometimes induced due to traumatizing life circumstances or drug use.
- LyndsySimon 6y ago
  > the memeplex that is society This concept stands out to me. Is this phrasing something I’d not encountered before, and it looks like there’s a whole are of anthropology that I’ve somehow overlooked to this point. I have some reading to do :)
gridlockd 6y ago
For some people the only way to live free is to become "homeless", which is really just a consequence of not living up to anyone else's standards.

DoreenMichele 6y ago

We don't really need to worry about those people. Let's just build enough housing for those who want housing. That at least shrinks the problem. Let's do what reasonably can be done and follow the 80/20 rule and take care of the majority of the problem that is relatively easily resolved, thereby freeing up more resources for the short list of really, really hard cases.

polalavik 6y ago
But we do need to worry about those people when those people may be a large percentage of the people on the streets. These people are deep into the throws of mental illness, addiction, or both. What do you do to help people who don’t want to help themselves? It’s a very difficult problem and I don’t know if there is an easy solution that doesn’t infringe on people’s rights. You can’t make being homeless illegal and state conservatorship seems dystopian.
- DoreenMichele 6y ago
  There is a clear connection between housing costs and rate of homelessness. https://streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com/2018/11/the-clear-connection-between-housing.html https://streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com/2018/11/the-clear-c... This country has an inadequate supply of housing nationwide. We have generally been under building housing for decades, then we act like our homeless population is just a bunch of "junkies and crazies." When I say "we don't need to worry about them," I mean the existence of people who are homeless by choice should not be an excuse to keep not building adequate housing and justify punishing those who do want housing on the excuse that "some of y'all losers don't even want housing." I spent nearly six years homeless. I've studied this problem space. I am actively developing information resources and best practices. "Build more housing -- especially stuff like Missing Middle Housing" is the short answer to a large part of this. Healthcare availability is another factor that makes a difference and help connecting to earned income that works for them in spite of handicaps and so forth. Earning money online is part of how I made progress on my issues and got myself back into housing.
- thebradbain 6y ago

thebradbain 6y ago

I am by no means a sociological expert, but I think it is safe to assume a large majority of homeless do not want to be homeless; I’ll defer to those who have dedicated their lives to the fixing the issue of homelessness on how to remediate that special case, if it is indeed a significant concern.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]