7 ms·

This was the weekly chart #1998. This thing has been running continuously for 38 years. It's iconic over here. The present fsckup is hilarious to the point of b

This was the weekly chart #1998. This thing has been running continuously for 38 years. It's iconic over here. The present fsckup is hilarious to the point of being unbelievable. I bit the bullet and temporarily tuned my radio to something unrelated. There's a crowdfunded alternative, though, picking up steam: Nowy Świat, #1 on patronite.pl (Polish lookalike of Patreon) with 630KPLN/mo pledged already, due to start airing in June. Their staff is composed mostly of Trójka's exiles.

ohB9iof7 6y ago
For anyone wondering, here is the fast answer: it's about $152k a month.
- xendo 6y ago
  how many Rogans is that?
  - prostheticvamp 6y ago
    18 microRogans.
- hawski 6y ago
  And you have to remember that life is cheaper in Poland and earnings are lower accordingly. If https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.jsp https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.js... is to be belived it could be thought as $270k for USA average and around $346k for San Francisco. But salaries are lower then that. With data from Wikipedia for Gross Average Wage the sum goes to around $646k. Also I believe Polish artists will earn much less than their American counterparts.
avn2109 6y ago
FWIW I'm an American living in Poland since 2 years ago, though I'm participating only as a spectator and I don't have a political horse in this race. This whole saga seems like a bit of a tempest in a teapot from where I sit. As of a few days ago, a certain minority political faction is suddenly very interested in high-sounding principles and will talk your ear off about freedom of speech and young-threatened-Democracy with a capital-D etc. Probably there is a lot of this downthread. Without making any claims about this issue itself, I will observe three interesting metacharacteristics of the situation: 0) This same suddenly-principled faction has a long record of happily supporting soft-and-hard censorship whenever it suits their politics and gleefully condemning other people's speech if they don't like it. A nonzero fraction (but of course not all) of the condemnation here comes from the literal Polish Communist Party (and their modern, slightly-rebranded allies), aka the same people who brought us 50 years of totalitarian oppression and censorship-enforced-by-secret-police-abductions. This strikes me as pretty rich. 1) Most ordinary Polish people know about this topic, but many don't find it anywhere near as scandalous as this breathless NYT article would have you believe. As far as I can tell this is not high on the list of pressing political issues for many regular people (despite a domestic Polish and foreign media blitz to the contrary). 2) State media is widely regarded as a running joke, known for its comically-hokey stories such as "Polish citizenry rejoices as Potassium exports rise 12%" (made up example but catches the tone). There are literally a small handful of state-funded radio and TV stations and arguably a semiaffiliated newspaper or two, in varying states of cheesiness. Meanwhile there are gallons and gallons of antigovernment media, most of which is overwhelmingly more competent than the allegedly State-controlled media, with super-slick hollywood production values and content which is precision-engineered to be engaging. In light of this disparity I find claims about "all encompassing State propaganda mind control" to be rather dubious.
- loh 6y ago
  For my own curiosity, what are some of the Polish anti-government media outlets?
  - avn2109 6y ago
    You could get a sense of it from wyborcza.pl, which is both the largest/most-prestigious newspaper in the country and quite strongly opposed to the current Government. Or polityka.pl, which is kinda like the New Yorker magazine of Poland, insofar as it is a weekly upper-middlebrow witty news magazine with giant circulation, unabashedly opposing the country's executive. If you want a TV show or videos on the internet you could have a look at fakty.tvn24.pl. But really there are tons, these are just off the top of my head and the list goes on for miles.
  - b0rsuk 6y ago
    oko.press (has some english-language articles; investigative journalism), onet.pl (tabloid) , tvn24.pl (TV station), krytykapolityczna.pl (openly leftist so unpopular in Poland)
- adimitrov 6y ago
  Just so you know why I downvoted you: - your comment is not at all unpolitical, even though you claim to not "have a political horse in this race." Your dismissal of the opposition to PiS as hypocritical, small, and a "certain minority" is deeply political. - saying "evil people X" say Y thing, therefore Y thing is false/unworthy/etc. is a fallacy. Saying that (former) communists are upset about the removal of the song has no bearing on whether this is an important story or not - all Polish people I know (my in laws and Polish friends) know about this and think it's a big deal. Yes, they live in Poland. I don't have a clear overview of all Polish newspapers, but those that I saw definitely ran the story prominently. It's also been big is Polish social media. This story made waves in Poland. - criticizing all Polish state media in a general fashion when this story is a bout Trójka specifically is absolutely fallacious. Trójka has not praised Potassium exports or had similar stories; even the NYT piece says that Trójka has been a special case among Polish media as far back as 1982. - there can be no doubt about the current ruling party's intention of trying to subsume all relevant media under its control. Examples [1][2][3]. Lots of pieces have been written about this, and it's nothing new. It's not even going on in secret. Your tone is not apolitical with respect to the situation in Poland, and the content of your writing isn't either. Claiming you're apolitical is disingenuous. That's why I think you deserved the downvote. Me, I'm against PiS, and similar movements throughout Europe. I believe they are harmful to their countries, and to the European project. [1]: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/05/31/polands-government-is-systematically-silencing-opposition-voices-gazeta-wyborcza-adam-michnik-pis-kaczynski-kurski-tvp/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/05/31/polands-government-is-s... [2]: https://www.publicmediaalliance.org/threats-to-media-independence-continue-across-central-europe/ https://www.publicmediaalliance.org/threats-to-media-indepen... [3]: https://www.economist.com/europe/2018/04/21/polands-ruling-law-and-justice-party-is-doing-lasting-damage https://www.economist.com/europe/2018/04/21/polands-ruling-l...

ohB9iof7 6y ago

For anyone wondering, here is the fast answer: it's about $152k a month.

xendo 6y ago
how many Rogans is that?
- prostheticvamp 6y ago
  18 microRogans.
hawski 6y ago
And you have to remember that life is cheaper in Poland and earnings are lower accordingly. If https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.jsp https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.js... is to be belived it could be thought as $270k for USA average and around $346k for San Francisco. But salaries are lower then that. With data from Wikipedia for Gross Average Wage the sum goes to around $646k. Also I believe Polish artists will earn much less than their American counterparts.

avn2109 6y ago

FWIW I'm an American living in Poland since 2 years ago, though I'm participating only as a spectator and I don't have a political horse in this race. This whole saga seems like a bit of a tempest in a teapot from where I sit. As of a few days ago, a certain minority political faction is suddenly very interested in high-sounding principles and will talk your ear off about freedom of speech and young-threatened-Democracy with a capital-D etc. Probably there is a lot of this downthread. Without making any claims about this issue itself, I will observe three interesting metacharacteristics of the situation: 0) This same suddenly-principled faction has a long record of happily supporting soft-and-hard censorship whenever it suits their politics and gleefully condemning other people's speech if they don't like it. A nonzero fraction (but of course not all) of the condemnation here comes from the literal Polish Communist Party (and their modern, slightly-rebranded allies), aka the same people who brought us 50 years of totalitarian oppression and censorship-enforced-by-secret-police-abductions. This strikes me as pretty rich. 1) Most ordinary Polish people know about this topic, but many don't find it anywhere near as scandalous as this breathless NYT article would have you believe. As far as I can tell this is not high on the list of pressing political issues for many regular people (despite a domestic Polish and foreign media blitz to the contrary). 2) State media is widely regarded as a running joke, known for its comically-hokey stories such as "Polish citizenry rejoices as Potassium exports rise 12%" (made up example but catches the tone). There are literally a small handful of state-funded radio and TV stations and arguably a semiaffiliated newspaper or two, in varying states of cheesiness. Meanwhile there are gallons and gallons of antigovernment media, most of which is overwhelmingly more competent than the allegedly State-controlled media, with super-slick hollywood production values and content which is precision-engineered to be engaging. In light of this disparity I find claims about "all encompassing State propaganda mind control" to be rather dubious.

loh 6y ago
For my own curiosity, what are some of the Polish anti-government media outlets?
- avn2109 6y ago
  You could get a sense of it from wyborcza.pl, which is both the largest/most-prestigious newspaper in the country and quite strongly opposed to the current Government. Or polityka.pl, which is kinda like the New Yorker magazine of Poland, insofar as it is a weekly upper-middlebrow witty news magazine with giant circulation, unabashedly opposing the country's executive. If you want a TV show or videos on the internet you could have a look at fakty.tvn24.pl. But really there are tons, these are just off the top of my head and the list goes on for miles.
- b0rsuk 6y ago
  oko.press (has some english-language articles; investigative journalism), onet.pl (tabloid) , tvn24.pl (TV station), krytykapolityczna.pl (openly leftist so unpopular in Poland)
adimitrov 6y ago
Just so you know why I downvoted you: - your comment is not at all unpolitical, even though you claim to not "have a political horse in this race." Your dismissal of the opposition to PiS as hypocritical, small, and a "certain minority" is deeply political. - saying "evil people X" say Y thing, therefore Y thing is false/unworthy/etc. is a fallacy. Saying that (former) communists are upset about the removal of the song has no bearing on whether this is an important story or not - all Polish people I know (my in laws and Polish friends) know about this and think it's a big deal. Yes, they live in Poland. I don't have a clear overview of all Polish newspapers, but those that I saw definitely ran the story prominently. It's also been big is Polish social media. This story made waves in Poland. - criticizing all Polish state media in a general fashion when this story is a bout Trójka specifically is absolutely fallacious. Trójka has not praised Potassium exports or had similar stories; even the NYT piece says that Trójka has been a special case among Polish media as far back as 1982. - there can be no doubt about the current ruling party's intention of trying to subsume all relevant media under its control. Examples [1][2][3]. Lots of pieces have been written about this, and it's nothing new. It's not even going on in secret. Your tone is not apolitical with respect to the situation in Poland, and the content of your writing isn't either. Claiming you're apolitical is disingenuous. That's why I think you deserved the downvote. Me, I'm against PiS, and similar movements throughout Europe. I believe they are harmful to their countries, and to the European project. [1]: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/05/31/polands-government-is-systematically-silencing-opposition-voices-gazeta-wyborcza-adam-michnik-pis-kaczynski-kurski-tvp/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/05/31/polands-government-is-s... [2]: https://www.publicmediaalliance.org/threats-to-media-independence-continue-across-central-europe/ https://www.publicmediaalliance.org/threats-to-media-indepen... [3]: https://www.economist.com/europe/2018/04/21/polands-ruling-law-and-justice-party-is-doing-lasting-damage https://www.economist.com/europe/2018/04/21/polands-ruling-l...