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Where do you get so much self righteousness to conclude that your assessment is appropriate for all companies, all positions, everywhere? And why does there ha

Where do you get so much self righteousness to conclude that your assessment is appropriate for all companies, all positions, everywhere? And why does there have to even be a single "formula" for work in any case? I find that attitude extremely narrow minded. At the same time I fully support your freedom to seek out the opportunities that work for you. I just don't understand the attitude that other people must be on power trips if they don't think they way you do in this regard.

Apocryphon 6y ago
He or she must be saying something right, if all of these tech megacorps are starting to embrace remote work, potentially sparking a sea change that will sweep Silicon Valley.
- gwright 6y ago
  This is just sloppy logical thinking. Even assuming your statement that "all...megacorps are staring to embrace", it is not reasonable to then conclude that any alternate opinion about remote work at all is wrong thinking. By what logic can you assume the special case of some types of positions in Silicon Valley "megacorps" is generally applicable to all other jobs?
  - Apocryphon 6y ago
    I said "all of these", not all. Permanent remote is starting to be embraced by other white collar professions as well, including banking and insurance: https://fortune.com/2020/05/11/permanent-work-from-home-coronavirus-nationwide-fortune-100/ https://fortune.com/2020/05/11/permanent-work-from-home-coro... https://www.americanbanker.com/articles/capital-one-to-keep-most-staff-home-until-at-least-september https://www.americanbanker.com/articles/capital-one-to-keep-... https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/may/21/rbs-staff-work-from-home-september-bank-covid-19-safety https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/may/21/rbs-staff-w... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-barclays-results-offices/barclays-ceo-says-putting-7000-people-in-a-building-may-be-thing-of-the-past-idUSKCN22B0ZE https://www.reuters.com/article/us-barclays-results-offices/...
    - gwright 6y ago
      So what? I'm not arguing against remote work. I'm arguing against the religion of "universal remote work". One size doesn't fit all. That should be completely uncontroversial.
      - Apocryphon 6y ago
        I actually agree. I don’t think every single white collar position should be remote. However, the poster you’ve been replying to didn’t say that, either. He or she simply said that these companies that are doing an about-face and moving towards permanent remote were always in a position to try more remote- they had the resources and capabilities to experiment, and is bitter that they didn’t do so until forced by the pandemic. They weren’t saying that remote must be done in all circumstances, that’s a strawman you read into their posts.
unexaminedlife 6y ago
I think it's strange you are saying this idea of remote work is a "single formula". If anything, refusing to do things differently is more like a "single formula" in my mind. Maybe you think differently about this, but I can't fathom a real-world scenario where tapping into all qualified candidates in the entire world vs tapping into all qualified candidates within a 20-30 mile radius from my HQ could be even close in comparison. Obviously we won't decide who is "right" here in a forum. But I will be interested to follow what happens to the companies who weren't prepared for this and companies who already were. I anticipate some major reshuffling will be happening in the coming years. The companies who built their entire culture around on-site teams vs companies who built infrastructure and culture around acceptance of work from home. Companies with large balance sheets will be able to hide it for some time, but their unpreparedness will begin to show within 1-3 years I think. This is all given the premise that things don't 100% go back to "normal".
- CathedralBorrow 6y ago
  > Obviously we won't decide who is "right" here in a forum. Is there any debate to be had about that anyway? From what you've written here, you are right and everyone who thinks otherwise clearly hasn't thought things through well enough.
  - benibela 6y ago
    It is true. Here, unexaminedlife is right about everything
    - CathedralBorrow 6y ago
      What exactly is true? That remote working is always better in all conceivable scenarios and that anyone saying anything else is stupid and wasteful and probably smells too?
      - benibela 6y ago
        > That remote working is always better in all conceivable scenarios and that anyone saying anything else is stupid and wasteful This. Exactly this. >and probably smells too? But not this. It is probably the opposite. When I work remotely, I rarely shower. Showering is stupid and wasteful. Millions of people lack potable water and here we are wasting it for showering
engineeringwoke 6y ago
Controlling managers lose power, that is not needed for the functioning of the business, when you are not in their physical presence. To call it power tripping seems like a logical conclusion.
- gwright 6y ago
  Define "controlling", define "power", define 'not needed for the functioning of the business". Define "power tripping". I'm not sure how to draw any meaning from your statement when the terms you use are so abstract and ill-defined.

Apocryphon 6y ago

He or she must be saying something right, if all of these tech megacorps are starting to embrace remote work, potentially sparking a sea change that will sweep Silicon Valley.

gwright 6y ago
This is just sloppy logical thinking. Even assuming your statement that "all...megacorps are staring to embrace", it is not reasonable to then conclude that any alternate opinion about remote work at all is wrong thinking. By what logic can you assume the special case of some types of positions in Silicon Valley "megacorps" is generally applicable to all other jobs?
- Apocryphon 6y ago
  I said "all of these", not all. Permanent remote is starting to be embraced by other white collar professions as well, including banking and insurance: https://fortune.com/2020/05/11/permanent-work-from-home-coronavirus-nationwide-fortune-100/ https://fortune.com/2020/05/11/permanent-work-from-home-coro... https://www.americanbanker.com/articles/capital-one-to-keep-most-staff-home-until-at-least-september https://www.americanbanker.com/articles/capital-one-to-keep-... https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/may/21/rbs-staff-work-from-home-september-bank-covid-19-safety https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/may/21/rbs-staff-w... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-barclays-results-offices/barclays-ceo-says-putting-7000-people-in-a-building-may-be-thing-of-the-past-idUSKCN22B0ZE https://www.reuters.com/article/us-barclays-results-offices/...
  - gwright 6y ago
    So what? I'm not arguing against remote work. I'm arguing against the religion of "universal remote work". One size doesn't fit all. That should be completely uncontroversial.
    - Apocryphon 6y ago
      I actually agree. I don’t think every single white collar position should be remote. However, the poster you’ve been replying to didn’t say that, either. He or she simply said that these companies that are doing an about-face and moving towards permanent remote were always in a position to try more remote- they had the resources and capabilities to experiment, and is bitter that they didn’t do so until forced by the pandemic. They weren’t saying that remote must be done in all circumstances, that’s a strawman you read into their posts.

unexaminedlife 6y ago

I think it's strange you are saying this idea of remote work is a "single formula". If anything, refusing to do things differently is more like a "single formula" in my mind. Maybe you think differently about this, but I can't fathom a real-world scenario where tapping into all qualified candidates in the entire world vs tapping into all qualified candidates within a 20-30 mile radius from my HQ could be even close in comparison. Obviously we won't decide who is "right" here in a forum. But I will be interested to follow what happens to the companies who weren't prepared for this and companies who already were. I anticipate some major reshuffling will be happening in the coming years. The companies who built their entire culture around on-site teams vs companies who built infrastructure and culture around acceptance of work from home. Companies with large balance sheets will be able to hide it for some time, but their unpreparedness will begin to show within 1-3 years I think. This is all given the premise that things don't 100% go back to "normal".

CathedralBorrow 6y ago
> Obviously we won't decide who is "right" here in a forum. Is there any debate to be had about that anyway? From what you've written here, you are right and everyone who thinks otherwise clearly hasn't thought things through well enough.
- benibela 6y ago
  It is true. Here, unexaminedlife is right about everything
  - CathedralBorrow 6y ago
    What exactly is true? That remote working is always better in all conceivable scenarios and that anyone saying anything else is stupid and wasteful and probably smells too?
    - benibela 6y ago
      > That remote working is always better in all conceivable scenarios and that anyone saying anything else is stupid and wasteful This. Exactly this. >and probably smells too? But not this. It is probably the opposite. When I work remotely, I rarely shower. Showering is stupid and wasteful. Millions of people lack potable water and here we are wasting it for showering

engineeringwoke 6y ago

Controlling managers lose power, that is not needed for the functioning of the business, when you are not in their physical presence. To call it power tripping seems like a logical conclusion.

gwright 6y ago
Define "controlling", define "power", define 'not needed for the functioning of the business". Define "power tripping". I'm not sure how to draw any meaning from your statement when the terms you use are so abstract and ill-defined.