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There are always a few managers who are petty and vindictive. I've certainly met a few over the years. But beyond that, let's say you knew that a certain bank

There are always a few managers who are petty and vindictive. I've certainly met a few over the years. But beyond that, let's say you knew that a certain bank had a good chance of shutting down its branch offices in the town where you live, for whatever legitimate reason. Would you consider opening an account at that bank? Well, clearly no, because those bank branch offices might not be there for you to use in the future. Now let's say you were a manager and you knew one of your team members was looking for a new job. Would you feel it to be worthwhile to assign important project tasks to that person if you knew there was a good chance they would be unavailable in the very near future and you'd have to move the tasks to someone else? Are you going to put them up for a promotion or a bonus to reward them, knowing that the effort might (in a sense) be wasted? The knowledge that an employee is considering leaving, no matter how much the manager might wish them well personally, changes the relationship because of the uncertainty about the future availability of their time and accumulated knowledge. It's better either for the employee not to create that uncertainty and/or resolve it as soon as possible.

fsociety 6y ago
This. I was put in a situation where I signaled I was looking for a job elsewhere and it came back to bite me.
jgwil2 6y ago
Is there reverse also not possible though? I'm a manager and I see an employee who is thinking of leaving, so I try to figure out why. Do they want a raise? More responsibility or autonomy? And then I try to give it to them so they won't leave. Or is that overly idealistic?
- nsgi 6y ago
  Often this is only temporary, though. They increase your salary, but it comes out of your next raise and you get fewer opportunities because your loyalty is in question, or if they're evil and the employment laws allow it they make you happy temporarily until they find a replacement. If you're company is prepared to do those things for you they should be willing to before you threaten to quit
  - Lunatic666 6y ago
    It's the job of the manager to create an environment where employees can go to the manager to discuss things which are not going well or change of career anytime without the fear of retribution. I'm mentioning this often to make sure everyone knows it. Last month we had a case where someone was unhappy being a Team Lead and we could change their career path to something more interesting with an equal level of contribution.
- giantg2 6y ago
  A good manager might. I know of two managers who offered me jobs on their teams so I wouldn't need to go to another part of the company (same money and all). Most managers cut you loose because it's easy to replace you.
  - jagtesh 6y ago
    Not sure who told you this. It's not easy to replace anyone and hasn't been for a while now. An experienced individual leaving a team is always a big hit to the team's productivity. Typically takes 3-6 months to recover from that.
    - giantg2 6y ago
      Ok, maybe not easy to do, but easy to justify. Why not get rid of an expensive senior dev and replace them with someone fresh out of school? They typically can work more hours (no kids) and can do 80% of the work for 50% of the pay.
diob 6y ago
This isn't how I've seen it work out where I work. Anytime someone expresses they're going to leave, my company bends over backwards (sometimes too much to be honest) to try and make them happy. I think it all depends on how you phrase things when it comes to the reactions of others. If you say I'm leaving, I hate this company, etc. etc. of course there is going to be retribution. But if you say I want new opportunities, I'm looking to grow, I think most folks (at least those I that I would _want_ to work for) wouldn't seek retribution for that. So long as it aligns with company goals and you're right for that opportunity, I think most are happy to let you have the chance to prove yourself. To be honest, the main reason I've started looking to leave my current job is I've expressed multiple times that I'd like a new challenge, or to help on XYZ and they've straight up ignored me. I don't think it's malicious on their part, I just think my managers are too focused on their own careers to help me with mine (it doesn't help that I'd be dipping into their territory by moving up). I guess you could say I've hit a ceiling, and it can probably only be solved by moving on to another company. The frustrating part will be when I do get an offer and tell them I'm leaving, they're going to suddenly want to do all the things I've been asking for to get me to stay.
- mewpmewp2 6y ago
  I hear the advice that "never accept a counter offer", but this is specifically how I got all my raises in a company I stayed in for more than 4 years. I still do occasional freelance to them despite moving on. I went to other companies to find out what my market value was and this helped me convince my company that I deserve a raise. They weren't looking to replace me or anything and we still have a good relationship with no hard feelings.
  - diob 6y ago
    Yeah, that's the same way I've gone about getting raises. And like you, I don't have a bad relationship with the company I'm at. Even if I do end up leaving, I think they'd be happy to work with me again in the future. I think folks assume people will be upset about these sorts of things, but any company worth it's salt realizes that you're both there to make money. It's a business relationship.
LockAndLol 6y ago
If you want them to stay and would consider it a loss if they left, why wouldn't you give them incentive to stay? Why wouldn't you try and keep the employee? If a manager indirectly finds out that an employee is looking over the fence and takes that negatively, then I think it's a bigger reflection on the manager than the employee. Either you consider them valuable or you don't.

fsociety 6y ago

This. I was put in a situation where I signaled I was looking for a job elsewhere and it came back to bite me.

jgwil2 6y ago

Is there reverse also not possible though? I'm a manager and I see an employee who is thinking of leaving, so I try to figure out why. Do they want a raise? More responsibility or autonomy? And then I try to give it to them so they won't leave. Or is that overly idealistic?

nsgi 6y ago
Often this is only temporary, though. They increase your salary, but it comes out of your next raise and you get fewer opportunities because your loyalty is in question, or if they're evil and the employment laws allow it they make you happy temporarily until they find a replacement. If you're company is prepared to do those things for you they should be willing to before you threaten to quit
- Lunatic666 6y ago
  It's the job of the manager to create an environment where employees can go to the manager to discuss things which are not going well or change of career anytime without the fear of retribution. I'm mentioning this often to make sure everyone knows it. Last month we had a case where someone was unhappy being a Team Lead and we could change their career path to something more interesting with an equal level of contribution.
giantg2 6y ago
A good manager might. I know of two managers who offered me jobs on their teams so I wouldn't need to go to another part of the company (same money and all). Most managers cut you loose because it's easy to replace you.
- jagtesh 6y ago
  Not sure who told you this. It's not easy to replace anyone and hasn't been for a while now. An experienced individual leaving a team is always a big hit to the team's productivity. Typically takes 3-6 months to recover from that.
  - giantg2 6y ago
    Ok, maybe not easy to do, but easy to justify. Why not get rid of an expensive senior dev and replace them with someone fresh out of school? They typically can work more hours (no kids) and can do 80% of the work for 50% of the pay.

diob 6y ago

This isn't how I've seen it work out where I work. Anytime someone expresses they're going to leave, my company bends over backwards (sometimes too much to be honest) to try and make them happy. I think it all depends on how you phrase things when it comes to the reactions of others. If you say I'm leaving, I hate this company, etc. etc. of course there is going to be retribution. But if you say I want new opportunities, I'm looking to grow, I think most folks (at least those I that I would _want_ to work for) wouldn't seek retribution for that. So long as it aligns with company goals and you're right for that opportunity, I think most are happy to let you have the chance to prove yourself. To be honest, the main reason I've started looking to leave my current job is I've expressed multiple times that I'd like a new challenge, or to help on XYZ and they've straight up ignored me. I don't think it's malicious on their part, I just think my managers are too focused on their own careers to help me with mine (it doesn't help that I'd be dipping into their territory by moving up). I guess you could say I've hit a ceiling, and it can probably only be solved by moving on to another company. The frustrating part will be when I do get an offer and tell them I'm leaving, they're going to suddenly want to do all the things I've been asking for to get me to stay.

mewpmewp2 6y ago
I hear the advice that "never accept a counter offer", but this is specifically how I got all my raises in a company I stayed in for more than 4 years. I still do occasional freelance to them despite moving on. I went to other companies to find out what my market value was and this helped me convince my company that I deserve a raise. They weren't looking to replace me or anything and we still have a good relationship with no hard feelings.
- diob 6y ago
  Yeah, that's the same way I've gone about getting raises. And like you, I don't have a bad relationship with the company I'm at. Even if I do end up leaving, I think they'd be happy to work with me again in the future. I think folks assume people will be upset about these sorts of things, but any company worth it's salt realizes that you're both there to make money. It's a business relationship.

LockAndLol 6y ago

If you want them to stay and would consider it a loss if they left, why wouldn't you give them incentive to stay? Why wouldn't you try and keep the employee? If a manager indirectly finds out that an employee is looking over the fence and takes that negatively, then I think it's a bigger reflection on the manager than the employee. Either you consider them valuable or you don't.