4 ms·

I’m pretty sure that most TSA employees forgot why water bottles aren’t allowed a long time ago (if they ever knew), and now are just searching for water bottle

I’m pretty sure that most TSA employees forgot why water bottles aren’t allowed a long time ago (if they ever knew), and now are just searching for water bottles directly. That’s the consequence of hard and fast rules — people stop using their brains.

mehrdadn 6y ago
Yeah, it really feels like that. Obligatory xkcd: https://xkcd.com/651/ https://xkcd.com/651/
remarkEon 6y ago
TSA employees are paid for security theatre - not actual security. I don't mean to denigrate these folks too much but ... they're not exactly the kind of people I'd hire to, say, walk my dog. They stand there and pretend they're doing "security" but what they're really doing is bureaucracy and political patronage. Suppose for a moment we wanted to implement the kind of security that TSA pretends to represent. We'd thus deputize them as part of DoD (or DHS) and they'd carry MP5s and have actual training standards, weight standards, quarterly fitness reports, have to get security clearances etc. etc. They'd do drills at a mock airport, and we'd eventually do away with the "checkpoint" style of security at airports that's really just an invitation for a suicide bomber. I once saw a TSA employee at LAX insist on putting a kid's balloon from Disneyland, that was clear and 100% see-through, through the X-ray machine. I watched this and, as I suspected, the TSA agent never even considered that because the balloon was filled with helium it of course wouldn't move through the machine on the conveyor belt and it got stuck. "Checkpoint" indefinitely shut down. Security Theatre, indeed.
- m10i 6y ago
  Why does the balloon being filled with helium mean it wouldn’t move through the machine on the conveyor belt? Just curious.
  - ylyn 6y ago
    You're kidding, right? The balloon would float and not stay in contact with the belt.
  - aetch 6y ago
    The balloon floats and will not touch the conveyor belt?
    - m10i 6y ago
      Hey thanks for the answer. I can be too literal, so at the time I wasn't sure if that's what he was implying, or if there was some other special property about helium in a balloon in an X-ray machine that I didn't know of.
  - fingerlocks 6y ago
    the charitable interpretation of this question is “Why wasn’t the balloon tied to something that could move through the conveyor belt?”. Which is a much more reasonable thing to ask.
  - botwriter 6y ago
    Don't worry fella I'm assuming you havn't woken up and had your first coffee of the day :D
  - m10i 6y ago
    Although I was very tired when I originally posted this around 2:30 AM, I think my train of thought was that if they got it from outside of the machine in the conveyor belt --> inside of the machine in the conveyor belt --> it's the same mechanism which will get it to pop out of the other end. But I suppose I was giving too much benefit of the doubt :)
- rainyMammoth 6y ago
  I agree with your assessment but I would not be that harsh with the TSA agents. They are the cogs that need to make the security theatre run. I would bet that the vast majority of them know for a fact that their job is highly useless and only see it as a way to get some money at the end of the month. What I still don't understand is how did we get here and why is it still going on even though most people would agree that it's a security theatre.
  - jjeaff 6y ago
    I think we can all play the stupid 24 hour news cycle headlines in our head at this point. [insert politician here] disbands security at airports! They don't care about lives!
    - Mirioron 6y ago
      Politics is so highly partisan that stupidity sticks around, because changing it would look bad. It's kind of ironic.
- koolba 6y ago
  Did the agent eventually stick their hand into X-ray machine to fish out the balloon? If so, did they have the sense to at least turn off the machine first?
- spamuel 6y ago
  You're literally just describing security theater. Why would they need to carry MP5s? Because that's what you've seen in movies? MP5s are practically antiques at this point. Not every dude operating a bag scanner needs to be armed for the same reason your IT security doesn't need to be armed. They're not THAT KIND of "security". Why do they need security clearances? For all that Secret-level intel they're getting briefed on? Or because you're under the impression that clearances are "security-ish"? You want to mitigate "security theater" by making security wildly more dramatic and aimless. Someone needs to do the basic step of checking bags and passengers. That person does not need to be Jason Bourne.
  - jlawson 6y ago
    MP5s are modern high-quality weapons. They'd need MP5s in case a group of terrorists attacked the checkpoint, or got caught going through the checkpoint and decided on plan B (just kill as many people in the airport as possible). They need security clearances to ensure that they're not going to help someone get a bomb onto the plane.
  - remarkEon 6y ago
    No, I'm describing how a serious country would implement security at its airports. >Why would they need to carry MP5s? Because that's what you've seen in movies? The MP5 is a "it just works" close battle weapon that is very popular for urban combat and, speaking from experience, is a weapon that is very balanced and is also gorgeous to look at. The greatest critiques against it probably have to do with the fact it's usually chambered in 9mm. Now, HK makes a bunch or other variants but the 9mm is the most popular. >Why do they need security clearances? Because I don't want people who harass me to open my baggage in front of them to have questionable contacts that could otherwise be a means for a would-be terrorist (or other state actors since Cold War II just kicked off) to get a bomb onboard an aircraft. >You want to mitigate "security theater" by making security wildly more dramatic and aimless. I want to do away with the security theatre, and replace it with a serious organization that is trained and understands what they're doing.

mehrdadn 6y ago

Yeah, it really feels like that. Obligatory xkcd: https://xkcd.com/651/ https://xkcd.com/651/

remarkEon 6y ago

TSA employees are paid for security theatre - not actual security. I don't mean to denigrate these folks too much but ... they're not exactly the kind of people I'd hire to, say, walk my dog. They stand there and pretend they're doing "security" but what they're really doing is bureaucracy and political patronage. Suppose for a moment we wanted to implement the kind of security that TSA pretends to represent. We'd thus deputize them as part of DoD (or DHS) and they'd carry MP5s and have actual training standards, weight standards, quarterly fitness reports, have to get security clearances etc. etc. They'd do drills at a mock airport, and we'd eventually do away with the "checkpoint" style of security at airports that's really just an invitation for a suicide bomber. I once saw a TSA employee at LAX insist on putting a kid's balloon from Disneyland, that was clear and 100% see-through, through the X-ray machine. I watched this and, as I suspected, the TSA agent never even considered that because the balloon was filled with helium it of course wouldn't move through the machine on the conveyor belt and it got stuck. "Checkpoint" indefinitely shut down. Security Theatre, indeed.

m10i 6y ago
Why does the balloon being filled with helium mean it wouldn’t move through the machine on the conveyor belt? Just curious.
- ylyn 6y ago
  You're kidding, right? The balloon would float and not stay in contact with the belt.
- aetch 6y ago
  The balloon floats and will not touch the conveyor belt?
  - m10i 6y ago
    Hey thanks for the answer. I can be too literal, so at the time I wasn't sure if that's what he was implying, or if there was some other special property about helium in a balloon in an X-ray machine that I didn't know of.
- fingerlocks 6y ago
  the charitable interpretation of this question is “Why wasn’t the balloon tied to something that could move through the conveyor belt?”. Which is a much more reasonable thing to ask.
- botwriter 6y ago
  Don't worry fella I'm assuming you havn't woken up and had your first coffee of the day :D
- m10i 6y ago
  Although I was very tired when I originally posted this around 2:30 AM, I think my train of thought was that if they got it from outside of the machine in the conveyor belt --> inside of the machine in the conveyor belt --> it's the same mechanism which will get it to pop out of the other end. But I suppose I was giving too much benefit of the doubt :)
rainyMammoth 6y ago
I agree with your assessment but I would not be that harsh with the TSA agents. They are the cogs that need to make the security theatre run. I would bet that the vast majority of them know for a fact that their job is highly useless and only see it as a way to get some money at the end of the month. What I still don't understand is how did we get here and why is it still going on even though most people would agree that it's a security theatre.
- jjeaff 6y ago
  I think we can all play the stupid 24 hour news cycle headlines in our head at this point. [insert politician here] disbands security at airports! They don't care about lives!
  - Mirioron 6y ago
    Politics is so highly partisan that stupidity sticks around, because changing it would look bad. It's kind of ironic.
koolba 6y ago
Did the agent eventually stick their hand into X-ray machine to fish out the balloon? If so, did they have the sense to at least turn off the machine first?
spamuel 6y ago
You're literally just describing security theater. Why would they need to carry MP5s? Because that's what you've seen in movies? MP5s are practically antiques at this point. Not every dude operating a bag scanner needs to be armed for the same reason your IT security doesn't need to be armed. They're not THAT KIND of "security". Why do they need security clearances? For all that Secret-level intel they're getting briefed on? Or because you're under the impression that clearances are "security-ish"? You want to mitigate "security theater" by making security wildly more dramatic and aimless. Someone needs to do the basic step of checking bags and passengers. That person does not need to be Jason Bourne.
- jlawson 6y ago
  MP5s are modern high-quality weapons. They'd need MP5s in case a group of terrorists attacked the checkpoint, or got caught going through the checkpoint and decided on plan B (just kill as many people in the airport as possible). They need security clearances to ensure that they're not going to help someone get a bomb onto the plane.
- remarkEon 6y ago
  No, I'm describing how a serious country would implement security at its airports. >Why would they need to carry MP5s? Because that's what you've seen in movies? The MP5 is a "it just works" close battle weapon that is very popular for urban combat and, speaking from experience, is a weapon that is very balanced and is also gorgeous to look at. The greatest critiques against it probably have to do with the fact it's usually chambered in 9mm. Now, HK makes a bunch or other variants but the 9mm is the most popular. >Why do they need security clearances? Because I don't want people who harass me to open my baggage in front of them to have questionable contacts that could otherwise be a means for a would-be terrorist (or other state actors since Cold War II just kicked off) to get a bomb onboard an aircraft. >You want to mitigate "security theater" by making security wildly more dramatic and aimless. I want to do away with the security theatre, and replace it with a serious organization that is trained and understands what they're doing.