5 ms·

I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. It is true that my 2020 Macbook Pro 16 is not as much better than the competition as my 2011 M

I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. It is true that my 2020 Macbook Pro 16 is not as much better than the competition as my 2011 Macbook Air was. But it is still definitely the best laptop I've ever owned. I keep my laptops, and I can reach for whichever one I want: 2011, 2013, 2015, 2016, 2018 in Air, 13", 15" and now 16" form factors, and I choose the 2020. I also daily reject a number of windows and Chromebook pieces of hardware in favor of the MBP16. When I don't choose it, I most often choose my iPad pro at times or my iPhone. A thorough and hard ecosystem-level look at realistic competitors just doesn't turn up anything that even comes close in terms of just "working". Probably the closest would be an XPS developer running Ubuntu, but that is a completely different experience than the 'it just works' world I get to live in with my Macbook. And, by "it just works", I include a decent package manager with homebrew, a very solid neovim or spacemacs development environment, a fully working highdpi environment without 'quirks', ... the list goes on. And, Windows has no Unix underneath it plus it contains ads in the start menu. For me, it's just not a serious option for real work. In all, I'd say that most people agree with me; the market seems to prefer this hardware.

troughway 6y ago
>Windows has no Unix underneath it plus it contains ads in the start menu. For me, it's just not a serious option for real work. The start menu can be customized to turn all of that off. If you want to pin your own things to it, you can. WSL2 is going to drop soon. Looks like a good move by Microsoft. What kind of work do you do exactly that disqualifies Windows from being a "serious option for real work"?
- jolux 6y ago
  It has telemetry that you can’t turn off without hacking the registry. And I use macOS because I don’t have to tell the OS to get its bullshit ads out of the main menu, because that’s not even a supported feature.
  - nailer 6y ago
    The parent was talking about ads, which are obviously completely different than telemetry. But here's Apple's telemetry policy: https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/en-ww/ https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/en-ww/ See 'Collection and Use of Non-Personal Information'
    - jolux 6y ago
      I see the telemetry as coterminous with the ads: something Microsoft is doing because they know their customers are trapped. My day job has been line of business .NET for two years, and my personal machine is a Mac. The amount of crap I have to slog through on Windows is insulting and ridiculous. Every time I think about getting a new personal machine to run Windows I remember all that crap and the thought passes. A real shame, too. MS is making all the right moves technologically speaking right now. Thankfully my latest machine has Enterprise and our AD disables most of it. Apple’s analytics are not comparable.
      - qubex 6y ago
        > coterminous Ooh, new word. Haven’t seen a new word in months!
      - nailer 6y ago
        > The amount of crap I have to slog through on Windows is insulting and ridiculous. Really? I spent two minutes removing some default start menu items. My mac continually sent me pop ups insisting I use the Apple version of every product.
        jolux 6y ago
        I had to jump through a load of hoops to get Windows to stop nagging me to use OneDrive. What popups does the Mac send you? I’ve never seen one like you say.
        nailer 6y ago
- danlugo92 6y ago
  Oh c'mon now. > The start menu can be customized to turn all of that off. If you want to pin your own things to it, you can. Shouldn't be there in the first place, including all of the other advertising and telemetry. > WSL2 is going to drop soon. Looks like a good move by Microsoft. It'll be always a hack. Will never beat native Unix. > What kind of work do you do exactly that disqualifies Windows from being a "serious option for real work"? WSL is a hack, NTFS chokes on small files (web dev), advertising and telemetry. Also, you're computer randomly shutting off and locking itself up, jesus christ what the fuck (TBH MacOS also has this but it's 100x easier to disable).
  - kyriakos 6y ago
    If you put it like that whole Linux is a hack and that's a good thing, that's what makes it good.
itsraining 6y ago
My 2020 MacBook Pro 16 crashes frequently when it goes to sleep. https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251223766 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251223766 This has been a downgrade for me.
- wilkowskidom 6y ago
  I had the same. Disabling power nap did it for me. If this doesn’t help I read disabling graphic switching does it. But yeah it’s redicules that We have to deal with this on a $3k laptop
  - blondin 6y ago
    hold on, disabling power nap won't fixes the auto log outs. it's a (new?) security setting. one sec... alright okay. for anyone having the issue, you have to go to your "security & privacy" -> click on padlock -> enter password -> click on "advanced". in the sheet disable "Log out after X min of inactivity".
- mns 6y ago
  Wow, thanks for this. I thought that I might have a hardware problem, as a couple of times as I wake the laptop, it looks like it restarted, but did not have the time to check it as I mostly use my work laptop currently.
jagger27 6y ago
> I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. Post-Jobsism, maybe? For me the saddest part of modern Apple decline is software. Sure, they made some really horrible hardware blunders but on the whole the hardware is what keeps the company alive, and no one can compete. Little things, like HiDPI string you along year after year, but at the same time things like SIP chip away at your patience. My 16” is a big upgrade from my 2017 15”, and I have very few complaints with the 8-core, 32GB model.
- tinus_hn 6y ago
  It was the same when Jobs was around. If you want to read takedowns of these pieces read The Macalope: https://www.macworld.com/column/macalope/ https://www.macworld.com/column/macalope/
mortenjorck 6y ago
> I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. I’m not aware of a term, but I’ve observed two distinct variations, and they’re hardly exclusive to Apple commenters. They are “<successful company> is doomed” and “<successful company> lost me as a customer.” While the two often share points of contention, the former always makes the case that these points constitute a blind spot that will lead to the company’s downfall, while the latter focuses on how these points are at odds with their own needs or preferences. Valid as any of their arguments may be, the focus of these pieces invariably seems to be companies that go on to greater successes, in spite of these supposed blind spots or losing a subset of vocal customers. Somehow “Blackberry is doomed” never caught on as a genre, while Apple’s doom never seems to go out of fashion.
- 0xDEEPFAC 6y ago
  I think he addresses the irony that their products are no good, but still they will continue to do good business: "Apple isn’t going to lose because something better came along; it is going to lose because it shat the bed repeatedly for so many years that people like me are no longer going to want to sleep with it. " ... "Somehow, the fact that this "loss" isn’t actually going to hurt their bottom line in any significant way makes it all the more tragic. Apple will continue to rake in billions selling its overpriced portable devices — which surely bring as much suffering and ennui to the world as they do pleasure — while folks like me that have owned Macs for literally decades (since 1994 in my case), just want to craft beautiful and useful things, move off the platform."
nailer 6y ago
> And, Windows has no Unix underneath it plus it contains ads in the start menu. And macOS has popup ads. And Windows has apt-get which has far more packages than homebrew. Windows keyboards never went through a multi-year period of being awful. The OS supports touch. And the OS maker isn't trying to tell laptop purchasers not to buy a laptop.
danlugo92 6y ago
> I include a decent package manager with homebrew It it didn't come out of the box then it is not "just works" isn't it? heheh Ubuntu is just-works too now. No apple-level HiDPI though. However bad the lack of ports and butterfly keyboards are (which is now fixed). Nothing comes close to the hardware or the HiDPI handling in macbooks.
musicale 6y ago
> I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. Apple Death Knell Counter https://www.macobserver.com/features/death-knell/ https://www.macobserver.com/features/death-knell/ "Apple has been declared dead 71 times since April, 1995." ...make that 72.

troughway 6y ago

>Windows has no Unix underneath it plus it contains ads in the start menu. For me, it's just not a serious option for real work. The start menu can be customized to turn all of that off. If you want to pin your own things to it, you can. WSL2 is going to drop soon. Looks like a good move by Microsoft. What kind of work do you do exactly that disqualifies Windows from being a "serious option for real work"?

jolux 6y ago
It has telemetry that you can’t turn off without hacking the registry. And I use macOS because I don’t have to tell the OS to get its bullshit ads out of the main menu, because that’s not even a supported feature.
- nailer 6y ago
  The parent was talking about ads, which are obviously completely different than telemetry. But here's Apple's telemetry policy: https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/en-ww/ https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/en-ww/ See 'Collection and Use of Non-Personal Information'
  - jolux 6y ago
    I see the telemetry as coterminous with the ads: something Microsoft is doing because they know their customers are trapped. My day job has been line of business .NET for two years, and my personal machine is a Mac. The amount of crap I have to slog through on Windows is insulting and ridiculous. Every time I think about getting a new personal machine to run Windows I remember all that crap and the thought passes. A real shame, too. MS is making all the right moves technologically speaking right now. Thankfully my latest machine has Enterprise and our AD disables most of it. Apple’s analytics are not comparable.
    - qubex 6y ago
      > coterminous Ooh, new word. Haven’t seen a new word in months!
    - nailer 6y ago
      > The amount of crap I have to slog through on Windows is insulting and ridiculous. Really? I spent two minutes removing some default start menu items. My mac continually sent me pop ups insisting I use the Apple version of every product.
      - jolux 6y ago
        I had to jump through a load of hoops to get Windows to stop nagging me to use OneDrive. What popups does the Mac send you? I’ve never seen one like you say.
        nailer 6y ago
danlugo92 6y ago
Oh c'mon now. > The start menu can be customized to turn all of that off. If you want to pin your own things to it, you can. Shouldn't be there in the first place, including all of the other advertising and telemetry. > WSL2 is going to drop soon. Looks like a good move by Microsoft. It'll be always a hack. Will never beat native Unix. > What kind of work do you do exactly that disqualifies Windows from being a "serious option for real work"? WSL is a hack, NTFS chokes on small files (web dev), advertising and telemetry. Also, you're computer randomly shutting off and locking itself up, jesus christ what the fuck (TBH MacOS also has this but it's 100x easier to disable).
- kyriakos 6y ago
  If you put it like that whole Linux is a hack and that's a good thing, that's what makes it good.

itsraining 6y ago

My 2020 MacBook Pro 16 crashes frequently when it goes to sleep. https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251223766 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251223766 This has been a downgrade for me.

wilkowskidom 6y ago
I had the same. Disabling power nap did it for me. If this doesn’t help I read disabling graphic switching does it. But yeah it’s redicules that We have to deal with this on a $3k laptop
- blondin 6y ago
  hold on, disabling power nap won't fixes the auto log outs. it's a (new?) security setting. one sec... alright okay. for anyone having the issue, you have to go to your "security & privacy" -> click on padlock -> enter password -> click on "advanced". in the sheet disable "Log out after X min of inactivity".
mns 6y ago
Wow, thanks for this. I thought that I might have a hardware problem, as a couple of times as I wake the laptop, it looks like it restarted, but did not have the time to check it as I mostly use my work laptop currently.

jagger27 6y ago

> I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. Post-Jobsism, maybe? For me the saddest part of modern Apple decline is software. Sure, they made some really horrible hardware blunders but on the whole the hardware is what keeps the company alive, and no one can compete. Little things, like HiDPI string you along year after year, but at the same time things like SIP chip away at your patience. My 16” is a big upgrade from my 2017 15”, and I have very few complaints with the 8-core, 32GB model.

tinus_hn 6y ago
It was the same when Jobs was around. If you want to read takedowns of these pieces read The Macalope: https://www.macworld.com/column/macalope/ https://www.macworld.com/column/macalope/

mortenjorck 6y ago

> I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. I’m not aware of a term, but I’ve observed two distinct variations, and they’re hardly exclusive to Apple commenters. They are “<successful company> is doomed” and “<successful company> lost me as a customer.” While the two often share points of contention, the former always makes the case that these points constitute a blind spot that will lead to the company’s downfall, while the latter focuses on how these points are at odds with their own needs or preferences. Valid as any of their arguments may be, the focus of these pieces invariably seems to be companies that go on to greater successes, in spite of these supposed blind spots or losing a subset of vocal customers. Somehow “Blackberry is doomed” never caught on as a genre, while Apple’s doom never seems to go out of fashion.

0xDEEPFAC 6y ago
I think he addresses the irony that their products are no good, but still they will continue to do good business: "Apple isn’t going to lose because something better came along; it is going to lose because it shat the bed repeatedly for so many years that people like me are no longer going to want to sleep with it. " ... "Somehow, the fact that this "loss" isn’t actually going to hurt their bottom line in any significant way makes it all the more tragic. Apple will continue to rake in billions selling its overpriced portable devices — which surely bring as much suffering and ennui to the world as they do pleasure — while folks like me that have owned Macs for literally decades (since 1994 in my case), just want to craft beautiful and useful things, move off the platform."

nailer 6y ago

> And, Windows has no Unix underneath it plus it contains ads in the start menu. And macOS has popup ads. And Windows has apt-get which has far more packages than homebrew. Windows keyboards never went through a multi-year period of being awful. The OS supports touch. And the OS maker isn't trying to tell laptop purchasers not to buy a laptop.

danlugo92 6y ago

> I include a decent package manager with homebrew It it didn't come out of the box then it is not "just works" isn't it? heheh Ubuntu is just-works too now. No apple-level HiDPI though. However bad the lack of ports and butterfly keyboards are (which is now fixed). Nothing comes close to the hardware or the HiDPI handling in macbooks.

musicale 6y ago

> I'm sure there's a word coined for these 'death of Apple' posts. Apple Death Knell Counter https://www.macobserver.com/features/death-knell/ https://www.macobserver.com/features/death-knell/ "Apple has been declared dead 71 times since April, 1995." ...make that 72.