7 ms·

A complete Internet web server built into an Ethernet (RJ-45) jack

97 points by tzm 16y ago

sethg 16y ago
OK, it’s got an Ethernet jack and a Web server on one end. What’s on the other end? If I were designing a clothes dryer or coffee machine and wanted to Internet-enable it, how would I hook up the signals from the control panel to the jack? Is there some standard bus or serial protocol that appliance manufacturers use for their onboard computers?
- jerryr 16y ago
  It's a manufacturer-specific serial protocol--NOT standard. You can find the command reference here: http://www.lantronix.com/pdf/XPort-Pro_CR.pdf http://www.lantronix.com/pdf/XPort-Pro_CR.pdf But, if you're really interested in internet-enabling a new product, you'd likely be better off selecting a microcontroller with built-in Ethernet (or an Arduino with Ethernet shield, if prototyping). In my experience, products like the XPort were better for manufacturers looking to internet-enable a legacy device with a free serial port.
imr 16y ago
Certainly not new, I know digi.com sells a lot of these things since at least 2008. Look for the Digi Connect products. The interfaces on the other side can be as simple as RS-232.
- marcinw 16y ago
  I remember working with several of the Parallax PINK modules back in the day as well. http://www.parallax.com/Store/Accessories/CommunicationRF/tabid/161/ProductID/40/List/0/Default.aspx?SortField=ProductName,ProductName http://www.parallax.com/Store/Accessories/CommunicationRF/ta... If memory serves me correctly, some peers at my university had wrote a web interface to control the lights on the Christmas Tree in the commons area.
- Isamu 16y ago
  They've been on the market for a lot longer than that, actually. But it looks like some incremental improvements have been made over the years, quite interesting really. http://www.digi.com/products/wireless-wired-embedded-solutions/solutions-on-module/digi-connect/ http://www.digi.com/products/wireless-wired-embedded-solutio... http://www.lantronix.com/device-networking/embedded-device-servers/xport.html http://www.lantronix.com/device-networking/embedded-device-s...
ashishb4u 16y ago
does it means that interface jacks have not advanced even a bit in the last few decades??
- iclelland 16y ago
  If you're referring to the physical jack, then, essentially, no. They were standardised in the 1970s, and the form factor hasn't changed at all, while electronic parts have become much much smaller over the same time frame. There may have been advances within the connector itself, to improve the signal-carrying properties of the internal connections, but the overall design of the connector is basically unchanged.
DuckPaddle 16y ago
That appears to be a Lantronics XPORT, been using them for over 7 years. Interesting they are selling them for over 200 we buy them for 70 each, Now that's markup....
- jerryr 16y ago
  Yeah, looks like an XPort. Maybe this is the evaluation kit, which comes with the carrier board for ~$150-200. It's been a while since I used one (probably 7 years ago), but the serial interface was rather limited. To develop firmware for the XPort itself, you needed an SDK only available under NDA for customers they were willing to support (we were such a customer and the SDK was reasonably usable). It was a cool idea & a great way to Ethernet-enable serial devices, but nowadays something like the Arduino with Ethernet shield is probably more accessible.
ErrantX 16y ago
Hmm. $200. You can get an Arduino with an ethernet shield for about $75-80. This does not appear to have any detailed tech specs on the linked page,detail on customisability/programmability or on the interconnects offered. But even if we allow it some leniency on that I figure an Arduino is still the no brainer choice :)
- deleted 16y ago
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  - deleted 16y ago
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- PonyGumbo 16y ago
  True, but this appears to be much smaller than an Arduino.
  - ErrantX 16y ago
    I assumed this was intended as a posting for home hackers to have a go at internet enabling their devices; in which case I think the size consideration isn't much of an issue. If we're talking consumer product design, i.e. mass produced internet enabled fridges, sure this is not a bad idea :) But for a home hacker the Arduino is the way forward :)
    - nupark 16y ago
      Arduino is considerably more expensive, sizable, and complicated than is really needed for a finished home hacker project. Additionally, size does matter (sorry :) when you're trying to fit a piece of electronics into your home in an unobtrusive way. You don't need a full Arduino to wirelessly enable (802.15.4+ZigBee or 6LoWPAN!) a simple device. You just need the MCU (and the tiny family may be sufficient - $2-5) and the wireless hardware (eg, xbee, or one of Atmel's new combined atmega+802.15.4 chipsets if you can deal with the antenna requirements - $8 - $30), an optional crystal oscillator (<$1), and -- if necessary -- a power source (eg, some batteries). As for commercial applications -- I'd expect them to use wireless, and my money is on either straight WiFi (especially for something as large as a fridge), or 802.15.4 and 6LoWPAN (especially for smaller, low-power devices).
brianbreslin 16y ago
could this be used the same way those wall outlet/pluggable web connected computers were for hacking networks? i.e. you replace someone's existing ethernet wall jack with this one w/a server in it, and they would NEVER find your machine piggy backing off their internal network.
philthy 16y ago
This is one of the smaller devices like this I've seen. I am really curious about the photographic opportunities that could be open with such a device. Footage could be directly streamed online via ethernet cable connected directly to the camera...
grandalf 16y ago
I wish someone would design a firewall that is just an RJ-45 jack with a few dip switches to open/close commonly needed ports, the rest closed by default.
- stewartbutler 16y ago
  I'd think that the bandwidth on an embedded device like this is too low for enterprise use -- it would be a network bottleneck. You'd have to have a much higher clock rate than most small devices can achieve to get full 10/100/1000 bandwidth, so the market would be pretty small.
  - bigiain 16y ago
    I wonder - for between a typical sub 10Mbit ADSL connection and the rest of a home/small business network? I suspect there's a _lot_ of sub 10 Mbit (never mind 100 or 1000Mbit) internet connections where an "inline firewall" ethernet doohicky wouldn't need too much cpu horsepower...
- pixdamix 16y ago
  There's was a company who tried this kind of thing: Selling a wireless card which embedded a linux powered firewall: http://www.yoggie.com/New_Yoggie/Welcome.html http://www.yoggie.com/New_Yoggie/Welcome.html http://www.yoggie-gatekeeper.co.uk/ http://www.yoggie-gatekeeper.co.uk/ I don't know but it seems they failed a funding round.
  - zdw 16y ago
    The "Killer Nic" is semi-sucessful in the gaming arena: http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/killer-nic-m1/ http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/killer-nic-m1/ It basically is linux on a NIC card that does packet reordering for lower latency, with varying degrees of success depending the situation. They're also moving into wireless: http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/bigfoot-networks-killer-wireless-n-adaptors-deliver-breakthrough-wi-fi-performance-for-notebooks/ http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/bigfoot-networks-killer-wirel...
tylerritchie 16y ago
Off topic-ish: Is inventables actually just linkbait garbage which happens to also sell things? They never list the vendor of their products, the prices are always high (often twice that of retail), and they never have any technical details or volume pricing. Oh, you're interested in this Sorghum based "Non-Toxic Decorative Wood Composite?" [1] Well, you can buy a 4"x3" sample for $15 but they won't tell you who makes it (Kieri USA [2] does) or the cost for boards. The manufacturer is usually only a Google search away, and I'm willing to pay a premium for a small sample, but I'm not going to order even samples unless I can get more detailed information. Does Inventables actually serve any purpose other than to act as linkbait for a bunch of interesting products? [1] http://www.inventables.com/technologies/non-toxic-decorative-wood-composite http://www.inventables.com/technologies/non-toxic-decorative... [2] http://www.kireiusa.com http://www.kireiusa.com
- ChuckMcM 16y ago
  Yes, basically. Its a storefront for someone who sells at 100% markup stuff you can get elsewhere.
- danwolff 16y ago
  Inventables a University of Illinois startup. If you play with several dozen of their materials, you will get several product ideas, some olf which may even have markets! I think they are trying to provide value through all the normal ways an online reseller would, with a bent for the entrepeneurial inventer market. At least that'd the impression that I get. For large quantities I would hazard the guess that no party misses out on the pie.
drdaeman 16y ago
That's not RJ45, it's properly called 8P8C.
nabilt 16y ago
Interesting product. Doing a quick google search I have seen prices under $100. Unfortunately, it looks like it only has serial out. I have been looking for a small single board linux computer (preferably open source) to use as a gateway and/or web server for embedded projects. I would like something in between an Arduino and Beagleboard. Arduino is great for running simple web servers, but it would be nice to have a Linux OS with some familiar tools to be able to build more complex web apps. Products like the Beagleboard fill this need, but they are complex and expensive if you decide to bundle it with your product. If you don't mind external hosting you can always send your data to the cloud, but I like the simplicity of a self contained product. The closest I have found to these requirement is at Dangerous Prototypes (sill in development). Web Platform v2 - 210MHz ARM926 - 2x SPI - Hopefully 2 layers! - Linux - 4x USART - 2x 10 bit a/d - ethernet - < $100? Forum: http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=935&start=180#p16876 http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&... Wiki: http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Robert:_AT91SAM9260_Linux_development_board http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Robert:_AT91SAM9260_Linu...
- noonespecial 16y ago
  Try a SheevaPlug. Its a little ARM with a full-on debian install. About $80. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SheevaPlug http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SheevaPlug Or if you're into x86 try something from pcEngines. A bit more expensive, but no crosscompiler required to build packages on your desktop. http://www.pcengines.ch/ http://www.pcengines.ch/
  - nabilt 16y ago
    Ahh yes. I forgot to mention that. Plug computers seem like the best option right now. Thanks.
mhp 16y ago
I sure hope its IPv6 if everyone is going to start putting web servers into their socks.

97 points by tzm 16y ago

sethg 16y ago

OK, it’s got an Ethernet jack and a Web server on one end. What’s on the other end? If I were designing a clothes dryer or coffee machine and wanted to Internet-enable it, how would I hook up the signals from the control panel to the jack? Is there some standard bus or serial protocol that appliance manufacturers use for their onboard computers?

jerryr 16y ago
It's a manufacturer-specific serial protocol--NOT standard. You can find the command reference here: http://www.lantronix.com/pdf/XPort-Pro_CR.pdf http://www.lantronix.com/pdf/XPort-Pro_CR.pdf But, if you're really interested in internet-enabling a new product, you'd likely be better off selecting a microcontroller with built-in Ethernet (or an Arduino with Ethernet shield, if prototyping). In my experience, products like the XPort were better for manufacturers looking to internet-enable a legacy device with a free serial port.

imr 16y ago

Certainly not new, I know digi.com sells a lot of these things since at least 2008. Look for the Digi Connect products. The interfaces on the other side can be as simple as RS-232.

marcinw 16y ago
I remember working with several of the Parallax PINK modules back in the day as well. http://www.parallax.com/Store/Accessories/CommunicationRF/tabid/161/ProductID/40/List/0/Default.aspx?SortField=ProductName,ProductName http://www.parallax.com/Store/Accessories/CommunicationRF/ta... If memory serves me correctly, some peers at my university had wrote a web interface to control the lights on the Christmas Tree in the commons area.
Isamu 16y ago
They've been on the market for a lot longer than that, actually. But it looks like some incremental improvements have been made over the years, quite interesting really. http://www.digi.com/products/wireless-wired-embedded-solutions/solutions-on-module/digi-connect/ http://www.digi.com/products/wireless-wired-embedded-solutio... http://www.lantronix.com/device-networking/embedded-device-servers/xport.html http://www.lantronix.com/device-networking/embedded-device-s...

ashishb4u 16y ago

does it means that interface jacks have not advanced even a bit in the last few decades??

iclelland 16y ago
If you're referring to the physical jack, then, essentially, no. They were standardised in the 1970s, and the form factor hasn't changed at all, while electronic parts have become much much smaller over the same time frame. There may have been advances within the connector itself, to improve the signal-carrying properties of the internal connections, but the overall design of the connector is basically unchanged.

DuckPaddle 16y ago

That appears to be a Lantronics XPORT, been using them for over 7 years. Interesting they are selling them for over 200 we buy them for 70 each, Now that's markup....

jerryr 16y ago
Yeah, looks like an XPort. Maybe this is the evaluation kit, which comes with the carrier board for ~$150-200. It's been a while since I used one (probably 7 years ago), but the serial interface was rather limited. To develop firmware for the XPort itself, you needed an SDK only available under NDA for customers they were willing to support (we were such a customer and the SDK was reasonably usable). It was a cool idea & a great way to Ethernet-enable serial devices, but nowadays something like the Arduino with Ethernet shield is probably more accessible.

ErrantX 16y ago

Hmm. $200. You can get an Arduino with an ethernet shield for about $75-80. This does not appear to have any detailed tech specs on the linked page,detail on customisability/programmability or on the interconnects offered. But even if we allow it some leniency on that I figure an Arduino is still the no brainer choice :)

deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
PonyGumbo 16y ago
True, but this appears to be much smaller than an Arduino.
- ErrantX 16y ago
  I assumed this was intended as a posting for home hackers to have a go at internet enabling their devices; in which case I think the size consideration isn't much of an issue. If we're talking consumer product design, i.e. mass produced internet enabled fridges, sure this is not a bad idea :) But for a home hacker the Arduino is the way forward :)
  - nupark 16y ago
    Arduino is considerably more expensive, sizable, and complicated than is really needed for a finished home hacker project. Additionally, size does matter (sorry :) when you're trying to fit a piece of electronics into your home in an unobtrusive way. You don't need a full Arduino to wirelessly enable (802.15.4+ZigBee or 6LoWPAN!) a simple device. You just need the MCU (and the tiny family may be sufficient - $2-5) and the wireless hardware (eg, xbee, or one of Atmel's new combined atmega+802.15.4 chipsets if you can deal with the antenna requirements - $8 - $30), an optional crystal oscillator (<$1), and -- if necessary -- a power source (eg, some batteries). As for commercial applications -- I'd expect them to use wireless, and my money is on either straight WiFi (especially for something as large as a fridge), or 802.15.4 and 6LoWPAN (especially for smaller, low-power devices).

brianbreslin 16y ago

could this be used the same way those wall outlet/pluggable web connected computers were for hacking networks? i.e. you replace someone's existing ethernet wall jack with this one w/a server in it, and they would NEVER find your machine piggy backing off their internal network.

philthy 16y ago

This is one of the smaller devices like this I've seen. I am really curious about the photographic opportunities that could be open with such a device. Footage could be directly streamed online via ethernet cable connected directly to the camera...

grandalf 16y ago

I wish someone would design a firewall that is just an RJ-45 jack with a few dip switches to open/close commonly needed ports, the rest closed by default.

stewartbutler 16y ago
I'd think that the bandwidth on an embedded device like this is too low for enterprise use -- it would be a network bottleneck. You'd have to have a much higher clock rate than most small devices can achieve to get full 10/100/1000 bandwidth, so the market would be pretty small.
- bigiain 16y ago
  I wonder - for between a typical sub 10Mbit ADSL connection and the rest of a home/small business network? I suspect there's a _lot_ of sub 10 Mbit (never mind 100 or 1000Mbit) internet connections where an "inline firewall" ethernet doohicky wouldn't need too much cpu horsepower...
pixdamix 16y ago
There's was a company who tried this kind of thing: Selling a wireless card which embedded a linux powered firewall: http://www.yoggie.com/New_Yoggie/Welcome.html http://www.yoggie.com/New_Yoggie/Welcome.html http://www.yoggie-gatekeeper.co.uk/ http://www.yoggie-gatekeeper.co.uk/ I don't know but it seems they failed a funding round.
- zdw 16y ago
  The "Killer Nic" is semi-sucessful in the gaming arena: http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/killer-nic-m1/ http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/killer-nic-m1/ It basically is linux on a NIC card that does packet reordering for lower latency, with varying degrees of success depending the situation. They're also moving into wireless: http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/bigfoot-networks-killer-wireless-n-adaptors-deliver-breakthrough-wi-fi-performance-for-notebooks/ http://www.bigfootnetworks.com/bigfoot-networks-killer-wirel...

tylerritchie 16y ago

Off topic-ish: Is inventables actually just linkbait garbage which happens to also sell things? They never list the vendor of their products, the prices are always high (often twice that of retail), and they never have any technical details or volume pricing. Oh, you're interested in this Sorghum based "Non-Toxic Decorative Wood Composite?" [1] Well, you can buy a 4"x3" sample for $15 but they won't tell you who makes it (Kieri USA [2] does) or the cost for boards. The manufacturer is usually only a Google search away, and I'm willing to pay a premium for a small sample, but I'm not going to order even samples unless I can get more detailed information. Does Inventables actually serve any purpose other than to act as linkbait for a bunch of interesting products? [1] http://www.inventables.com/technologies/non-toxic-decorative-wood-composite http://www.inventables.com/technologies/non-toxic-decorative... [2] http://www.kireiusa.com http://www.kireiusa.com

ChuckMcM 16y ago
Yes, basically. Its a storefront for someone who sells at 100% markup stuff you can get elsewhere.
danwolff 16y ago
Inventables a University of Illinois startup. If you play with several dozen of their materials, you will get several product ideas, some olf which may even have markets! I think they are trying to provide value through all the normal ways an online reseller would, with a bent for the entrepeneurial inventer market. At least that'd the impression that I get. For large quantities I would hazard the guess that no party misses out on the pie.

drdaeman 16y ago

That's not RJ45, it's properly called 8P8C.

nabilt 16y ago

Interesting product. Doing a quick google search I have seen prices under $100. Unfortunately, it looks like it only has serial out. I have been looking for a small single board linux computer (preferably open source) to use as a gateway and/or web server for embedded projects. I would like something in between an Arduino and Beagleboard. Arduino is great for running simple web servers, but it would be nice to have a Linux OS with some familiar tools to be able to build more complex web apps. Products like the Beagleboard fill this need, but they are complex and expensive if you decide to bundle it with your product. If you don't mind external hosting you can always send your data to the cloud, but I like the simplicity of a self contained product. The closest I have found to these requirement is at Dangerous Prototypes (sill in development). Web Platform v2 - 210MHz ARM926 - 2x SPI - Hopefully 2 layers! - Linux - 4x USART - 2x 10 bit a/d - ethernet - < $100? Forum: http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=935&start=180#p16876 http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&... Wiki: http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Robert:_AT91SAM9260_Linux_development_board http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Robert:_AT91SAM9260_Linu...

noonespecial 16y ago
Try a SheevaPlug. Its a little ARM with a full-on debian install. About $80. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SheevaPlug http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SheevaPlug Or if you're into x86 try something from pcEngines. A bit more expensive, but no crosscompiler required to build packages on your desktop. http://www.pcengines.ch/ http://www.pcengines.ch/
- nabilt 16y ago
  Ahh yes. I forgot to mention that. Plug computers seem like the best option right now. Thanks.

mhp 16y ago

I sure hope its IPv6 if everyone is going to start putting web servers into their socks.