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Pretty much every other energy source is more dangerous than nuclear. http://nextbigfuture.com/2008/03/deaths-per-twh-for-all-energy-sources.html http://nextbig

Pretty much every other energy source is more dangerous than nuclear. http://nextbigfuture.com/2008/03/deaths-per-twh-for-all-energy-sources.html http://nextbigfuture.com/2008/03/deaths-per-twh-for-all-ener...

paganel 16y ago
Then I guess people are stupid, aren't they, because of all the friends I know none of them would prefer having his/her house close to a nuclear plant, compared to having it close to a coal plant. And what do you know? These stupid people (including me) do have the power to vote, and I sure as hell would vote for nuclear power plants to be closed down were I given the chance to do so.
- jbri 16y ago
  I'm not sure what you're saying. Are you suggesting that because ignorant people think something is unsafe, that means that it actually is unsafe?
- paganel 16y ago
  In responding to jbri's comment bellow, as the "Reply" link doesn't show up for me on that one: > Are you suggesting that because ignorant people think something is unsafe, that means that it actually is unsafe? Yeah, this is what I'm saying, but isn't this what web 2.0 people were calling "wisdom of the crowds"? I guess back then it sounded cool, now it's just "return to technocracy" once more.
  - jbri 16y ago
    You can click the "link" button next to the comment header to get a reply box regardless. Regarding this "wisdom of the crowds" crap, does the presence of a lynch mob indicate that someone was actually guilty? If masses of people swear by a medical treatment, does that magically mean it's not a placebo? Crowds are dumb. The only time you want to follow the "wisdom of the crowd" is when the crowd is your marketable commodity.
    - paganel 16y ago
      > Crowds are dumb. The only time you want to follow the "wisdom of the crowd" is when the crowd is your marketable commodity. We're settled, then, because this is where we disagree :) I believe in the power of the people of taking decisions for themselves (even if the decisions are dumb), while you suggest than an informed elite should have the upper hand (if I read you correctly). I could go on and on about why I believe in what I said above (maybe the fact that I grew up under an authoritarian regime), but that doesn't belong in here, and I'm pretty sure you have your good reasons for believing in what you said. I guess history will decide.
      - khafra 16y ago
        If you're saying that mob rule has the power to irrationally stop nuclear power production, I agree with you. If you're saying this is the way things ought to be, I'm not sure if I agree but I think you have a valid point about the democratic form of government. If you're saying a dumb herd of people's panicky reactions to a scary situation actually mean nuclear power is more dangerous than other forms, you're dead wrong. I don't think other people here understand which of these arguments you're making, either.
        paganel 16y ago
        Yeap, you're right on the first 2 points I was trying to make. Reguarding this > If you're saying a dumb herd of people's panicky reactions to a scary situation actually mean nuclear power is more dangerous than other forms, you're dead wrong. I didn't say that people's reaction to nuclear power changes it into something "dangerous", I was only saying that if people decide not to fund nuclear development anymore (say, by not allowing their Governments to subsidize said industry) then its voice should be listened to, even if to some it may sound "dumb" or "panicky". This is why I said that if the voice of the majority isn't listened to we're back to Technocracy, i.e. a small group of informed elite taking vital decisions for the rest of us.
        kstenerud 16y ago
- krschultz 16y ago
  I live within 5 miles of two nuclear power plants and over 10 navy nuclear reactors. It doesn't bother me one bit. I'm actually thinking of moving closer to one of the power plants because rent is a little cheaper because people like you are irrationally afraid of it. Look at Japan, right now 10,000 people are dead from a tsunamai/earthquake double punch and you are worried about the nuclear reactor? The one person killed in the reactor was killed by a crane falling, that could have happened at any industrial complex in an earthquake. There have been a few cases of radiation exposure, but I gaurentee you there where also some guys killed in the refineries that blew up. Not to mention only a few months ago we had a dozen guys die when an oil rig blew up. You need to put it in perspective and get a sense of scale.
- mediacrisis 16y ago
  In the 20 years I've lived by a nuclear power plant, nothing has gone wrong. The coal plant two counties over has had two major explosions, resulting in dozens of deaths, hundreds of injuries, and an exorbitant amount of property damage. So if we're going off of anecdotal evidence here, I'll take nuclear power. The closer the better.
- thingie 16y ago
  So, you would prefer living near tens of square miles of moon-like wasteland created by ever-growing surface coal mines, eventually even having your house demolished to allow the mine grow more again, in order to feed that power plant? In a country like this, with smoking power plants nearby: http://krajina.venku.cz/exkur2a/ex2a-01a.htm http://krajina.venku.cz/exkur2a/ex2a-01a.htm Or rather just tolerate this: http://www.vyletnik.cz/images/profily/users/1969/jaderna-elektrarna-temelin-informacni-centrum-390.jpg http://www.vyletnik.cz/images/profily/users/1969/jaderna-ele... (Please note that these images are very real, and we're going to need to extend either the mines or build some new nuclear plants, at least locally, in the Czech republic.)

paganel 16y ago

Then I guess people are stupid, aren't they, because of all the friends I know none of them would prefer having his/her house close to a nuclear plant, compared to having it close to a coal plant. And what do you know? These stupid people (including me) do have the power to vote, and I sure as hell would vote for nuclear power plants to be closed down were I given the chance to do so.

jbri 16y ago
I'm not sure what you're saying. Are you suggesting that because ignorant people think something is unsafe, that means that it actually is unsafe?
paganel 16y ago
In responding to jbri's comment bellow, as the "Reply" link doesn't show up for me on that one: > Are you suggesting that because ignorant people think something is unsafe, that means that it actually is unsafe? Yeah, this is what I'm saying, but isn't this what web 2.0 people were calling "wisdom of the crowds"? I guess back then it sounded cool, now it's just "return to technocracy" once more.
- jbri 16y ago
  You can click the "link" button next to the comment header to get a reply box regardless. Regarding this "wisdom of the crowds" crap, does the presence of a lynch mob indicate that someone was actually guilty? If masses of people swear by a medical treatment, does that magically mean it's not a placebo? Crowds are dumb. The only time you want to follow the "wisdom of the crowd" is when the crowd is your marketable commodity.
  - paganel 16y ago
    > Crowds are dumb. The only time you want to follow the "wisdom of the crowd" is when the crowd is your marketable commodity. We're settled, then, because this is where we disagree :) I believe in the power of the people of taking decisions for themselves (even if the decisions are dumb), while you suggest than an informed elite should have the upper hand (if I read you correctly). I could go on and on about why I believe in what I said above (maybe the fact that I grew up under an authoritarian regime), but that doesn't belong in here, and I'm pretty sure you have your good reasons for believing in what you said. I guess history will decide.
    - khafra 16y ago
      If you're saying that mob rule has the power to irrationally stop nuclear power production, I agree with you. If you're saying this is the way things ought to be, I'm not sure if I agree but I think you have a valid point about the democratic form of government. If you're saying a dumb herd of people's panicky reactions to a scary situation actually mean nuclear power is more dangerous than other forms, you're dead wrong. I don't think other people here understand which of these arguments you're making, either.
      - paganel 16y ago
        Yeap, you're right on the first 2 points I was trying to make. Reguarding this > If you're saying a dumb herd of people's panicky reactions to a scary situation actually mean nuclear power is more dangerous than other forms, you're dead wrong. I didn't say that people's reaction to nuclear power changes it into something "dangerous", I was only saying that if people decide not to fund nuclear development anymore (say, by not allowing their Governments to subsidize said industry) then its voice should be listened to, even if to some it may sound "dumb" or "panicky". This is why I said that if the voice of the majority isn't listened to we're back to Technocracy, i.e. a small group of informed elite taking vital decisions for the rest of us.
        kstenerud 16y ago
krschultz 16y ago
I live within 5 miles of two nuclear power plants and over 10 navy nuclear reactors. It doesn't bother me one bit. I'm actually thinking of moving closer to one of the power plants because rent is a little cheaper because people like you are irrationally afraid of it. Look at Japan, right now 10,000 people are dead from a tsunamai/earthquake double punch and you are worried about the nuclear reactor? The one person killed in the reactor was killed by a crane falling, that could have happened at any industrial complex in an earthquake. There have been a few cases of radiation exposure, but I gaurentee you there where also some guys killed in the refineries that blew up. Not to mention only a few months ago we had a dozen guys die when an oil rig blew up. You need to put it in perspective and get a sense of scale.
mediacrisis 16y ago
In the 20 years I've lived by a nuclear power plant, nothing has gone wrong. The coal plant two counties over has had two major explosions, resulting in dozens of deaths, hundreds of injuries, and an exorbitant amount of property damage. So if we're going off of anecdotal evidence here, I'll take nuclear power. The closer the better.
thingie 16y ago
So, you would prefer living near tens of square miles of moon-like wasteland created by ever-growing surface coal mines, eventually even having your house demolished to allow the mine grow more again, in order to feed that power plant? In a country like this, with smoking power plants nearby: http://krajina.venku.cz/exkur2a/ex2a-01a.htm http://krajina.venku.cz/exkur2a/ex2a-01a.htm Or rather just tolerate this: http://www.vyletnik.cz/images/profily/users/1969/jaderna-elektrarna-temelin-informacni-centrum-390.jpg http://www.vyletnik.cz/images/profily/users/1969/jaderna-ele... (Please note that these images are very real, and we're going to need to extend either the mines or build some new nuclear plants, at least locally, in the Czech republic.)