4 ms·

Based on the quality of today's conversation here on HN, I'm not inclined to fault them for taking that approach publicly. We can't even discuss this topic cohe

Based on the quality of today's conversation here on HN, I'm not inclined to fault them for taking that approach publicly. We can't even discuss this topic coherently ourselves. Our discussion here is filled with "this is my position" statements that are presented as arguments contradicting another's position. I think this post here today serves only as a rallying cry for "no telemetry" extremists and contributes nothing interesting or curious or relevant to HN that hasn't been covered in hundreds of framing-implied or framing-explicit "telemetry is bad" posts prior.

catalogia 6y ago
> Based on the quality of today's conversation here on HN, I'm not inclined to fault them for taking that approach publicly. Oh yeah sure, Microsoft is the victim, cyberbullied by their own users. It's a classic case of innocent naive corporations getting senselessly dogpiled by mean common people, clearly that's the way this power dynamic is arranged. Yeah, fucking right.
- floatingatoll 6y ago
  For example.
  - catalogia 6y ago
    Aww, did I hurt the corporation's feelings? PR departments have cooped the rhetoric of antibullying campaigns meant to protect children in order to shield corporations from well deserved criticism from people that have even less power against the corporation than a child has against an adult. It's horseshit.
vetinari 6y ago
Surprisingly, multiple, different people in a public forum do not have single, unified opinion. Unlike people acting on mandate given from above. Your name calling the position you don't agree with does not help the calm and rational discussion.
salawat 6y ago
Okay, I could buy this argument on somewhere like Chan. HN though? I can count on a single hand the number of times a thread has gotten hopelessly out of hand. Most people have reasons for their positions, for or against. That they may not necessarily agree with your own, or be politely phrased enough for your personal tastes doesn't detract from the message. Software companies have treated the User's machine as their playground for years with little or no resistance, because most of the technically savvy were A)employed by them B) kids or niche enough hobbyists to be safely ignored. or C) cared not a lick as long as things worked. I've been trying to warn places for years this free-ride will end as soon as larger swathes of the population are both socially and technically savvy, and large groups of people are in a position to put in substantial resistance in terms of implementation behaviors they are willing to support. I'm a hardliner against hiding anything* from the user. It's creepy, and inspires nil trust. Companies have only themselves to blame when they start taking advantage of user's ignorance. I spend half my time making the various degrees of learned helplessness foisted on people by tech companies a thing of the past for user's I support. It takes time and persistence, but it can be done. Not a one of them appreciates the wool having been pulled over their eyes.

catalogia 6y ago

> Based on the quality of today's conversation here on HN, I'm not inclined to fault them for taking that approach publicly. Oh yeah sure, Microsoft is the victim, cyberbullied by their own users. It's a classic case of innocent naive corporations getting senselessly dogpiled by mean common people, clearly that's the way this power dynamic is arranged. Yeah, fucking right.

floatingatoll 6y ago
For example.
- catalogia 6y ago
  Aww, did I hurt the corporation's feelings? PR departments have cooped the rhetoric of antibullying campaigns meant to protect children in order to shield corporations from well deserved criticism from people that have even less power against the corporation than a child has against an adult. It's horseshit.

vetinari 6y ago

Surprisingly, multiple, different people in a public forum do not have single, unified opinion. Unlike people acting on mandate given from above. Your name calling the position you don't agree with does not help the calm and rational discussion.

salawat 6y ago

Okay, I could buy this argument on somewhere like Chan. HN though? I can count on a single hand the number of times a thread has gotten hopelessly out of hand. Most people have reasons for their positions, for or against. That they may not necessarily agree with your own, or be politely phrased enough for your personal tastes doesn't detract from the message. Software companies have treated the User's machine as their playground for years with little or no resistance, because most of the technically savvy were A)employed by them B) kids or niche enough hobbyists to be safely ignored. or C) cared not a lick as long as things worked. I've been trying to warn places for years this free-ride will end as soon as larger swathes of the population are both socially and technically savvy, and large groups of people are in a position to put in substantial resistance in terms of implementation behaviors they are willing to support. I'm a hardliner against hiding anything* from the user. It's creepy, and inspires nil trust. Companies have only themselves to blame when they start taking advantage of user's ignorance. I spend half my time making the various degrees of learned helplessness foisted on people by tech companies a thing of the past for user's I support. It takes time and persistence, but it can be done. Not a one of them appreciates the wool having been pulled over their eyes.