8 ms·

What do you mean by American values? Specific examples?

magicsmoke 6y ago
Democracy naturally leads to competent and benevolent government, there are no circumstances under which human rights violations are ever acceptable, freedom of the individual takes priority over total benefit to the group, all individuals have the same intrinsic value regardless of their economic/social status, etc.
- wahern 6y ago
  > Democracy naturally leads to competent and benevolent government That hasn't been an American value for quite awhile, assuming it ever was.[1] Thus Reagan's famous quote: "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are 'I'm from the government, and I'm here to help'. [1] I'm willing to accept that it was for relatively brief but important periods, such as the 2-3 decades after WWII. The U.S. would still be a backwater were it not for moments where pragmatism and a shared sense of responsibility trumped cynicism and a reflexive fear of authority.
  - magicsmoke 6y ago
    Perhaps I should have worded it as Democracy is the most tolerable form of government. No matter the disillusionment with Democracy in America today, the idea of adopting China's government is completely outside the Overton window in America. In other parts of the world, I'm not so sure.
emiliobumachar 6y ago
Disobedience. http://www.paulgraham.com/gba.html http://www.paulgraham.com/gba.html "Those in authority tend to be annoyed by hackers' general attitude of disobedience. But that disobedience is a byproduct of the qualities that make them good programmers. They may laugh at the CEO when he talks in generic corporate newspeech, but they also laugh at someone who tells them a certain problem can't be solved. Suppress one, and you suppress the other."
- mywittyname 6y ago
  This is more of a young person thing, and only for specific personality types. And America is much less forgiving of disobedience today than it was, even just 20 years ago. Unless you come from a privileged group, run-ins with the authorities are not pleasant.
  - fakedang 6y ago
    Maybe that's why you see China catching up - because America is falling back and suppressing disobedience.
  - mac01021 6y ago
    > America is much less forgiving of disobedience today than it was, even just 20 years ago. Do you have any examples of this? I've always been american, but I was only 15 years old 20 years ago.
deleted 6y ago
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Democracy naturally leads to competent and benevolent government, there are no circumstances under which human rights violations are ever acceptable, freedom of the individual takes priority over total benefit to the group, all individuals have the same intrinsic value regardless of their economic/social status, etc.

wahern 6y ago
> Democracy naturally leads to competent and benevolent government That hasn't been an American value for quite awhile, assuming it ever was.[1] Thus Reagan's famous quote: "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are 'I'm from the government, and I'm here to help'. [1] I'm willing to accept that it was for relatively brief but important periods, such as the 2-3 decades after WWII. The U.S. would still be a backwater were it not for moments where pragmatism and a shared sense of responsibility trumped cynicism and a reflexive fear of authority.
- magicsmoke 6y ago
  Perhaps I should have worded it as Democracy is the most tolerable form of government. No matter the disillusionment with Democracy in America today, the idea of adopting China's government is completely outside the Overton window in America. In other parts of the world, I'm not so sure.

emiliobumachar 6y ago

Disobedience. http://www.paulgraham.com/gba.html http://www.paulgraham.com/gba.html "Those in authority tend to be annoyed by hackers' general attitude of disobedience. But that disobedience is a byproduct of the qualities that make them good programmers. They may laugh at the CEO when he talks in generic corporate newspeech, but they also laugh at someone who tells them a certain problem can't be solved. Suppress one, and you suppress the other."

mywittyname 6y ago
This is more of a young person thing, and only for specific personality types. And America is much less forgiving of disobedience today than it was, even just 20 years ago. Unless you come from a privileged group, run-ins with the authorities are not pleasant.
- fakedang 6y ago
  Maybe that's why you see China catching up - because America is falling back and suppressing disobedience.
- mac01021 6y ago
  > America is much less forgiving of disobedience today than it was, even just 20 years ago. Do you have any examples of this? I've always been american, but I was only 15 years old 20 years ago.

deleted 6y ago

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