4 ms·

I haven't read a great deal about them in the papers, but what I have read is that they have a frighteningly high conviction rate - meaning that either - the p

by smcl 6y ago

I haven't read a great deal about them in the papers, but what I have read is that they have a frighteningly high conviction rate - meaning that either - the police are really good at finding the perpetrators of crimes - the state are really careful about only taking cases to trial they are extremely confident they can win - ... or that simply being tried in court sufficient for convince everyone judges and/or juries that you're guilty and that it's basically a formality after that point I've no idea which of these is true, I really hope it's just either of the first two.

_jal 6y ago
The US Federal conviction rate is only a few percentage points lower. And as a US citizen, I can assure you it is not the first in our case.
- ciarannolan 6y ago
  No, it's actually not even close. [1] >In the United States federal court system, the conviction rate rose from approximately 75 percent to approximately 85% between 1972 and 1992.[13] For 2012, the US Department of Justice reported a 93% conviction rate.[14] In 2000, the conviction rate was also high in U.S. state courts. Coughlan, writing in 2000, stated, "In recent years, the conviction rate has averaged approximately 84% in Texas, 82% in California, 72% in New York, 67% in North Carolina, and 59% in Florida."[15] >In 2018, the Bureau of Justice Statistics reported that among defendants charged with a felony, 68% were convicted (59% of a felony and the remainder of a misdemeanor) with felony conviction rates highest for defendants originally charged with motor vehicle theft (74%), driving-related offenses (73%), murder (70%), burglary (69%), and drug trafficking (67%); and lowest for defendants originally charged with assault (45%).[16] Compare this to: > The criminal justice system of Japan has been referred to as a form of "hostage justice" (hitojichi-shiho), including in an appeal by 1010 Japanese professors, lawyers, and other legal professionals.[8] Collin Jones, a professor at Doshisha Law School in Kyoto, notes that the system has a conviction rate commonly described as 99.9%, but that the rate is, in fact, closer to 99.4%.[9][10][verification needed] Jones agrees with the group of legal professionals petitioning for change that practices such as interrogating suspects without counsel or charge for up to 23 days, not requiring the disclosure of exculpatory evidence, or of relationships between prosecutors and the courts increases the likelihood of convictions;[9][8] these professionals are unequivocal in their belief in the issue continues despite reforms, and that the system contributes to wrongful conviction: [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conviction_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conviction_rate
pnw_hazor 6y ago
The Japanese police are really good at coercing confessions using techniques and procedures that are unavailable (unlawful) in most first world countries.
amyjess 6y ago
There's also: - the police use highly unethical interrogation methods to extract confessions TBH, it's probably a combination of all four factors.
- smcl 6y ago
  Maybe I should have been less careful with my last option - I wanted to put “The system finds a culprit and makes them guilty” but felt it was a bit accusatory.
  - jki275 6y ago
    It's exactly correct.
pyuser583 6y ago
It’s number two.
- smcl 6y ago
  Ahh I imagine that means a lot of crimes go unsolved then?
  - jki275 6y ago
    There isn't really a lot of crime in Japan. It's culturally very shameful to be a criminal or to have a criminal in the family in Japan, and the entire culture is based on maintaining the family honor.
    - NotSammyHagar 6y ago
      Yet the Yakuza and underworld exists and operate in some manner.
      - pyuser583 6y ago
        Yakuza is legal in Japan. Not sure what you mean by “underworld” in the Japanese context. Edit: my info about yakuza being legal is outdated. Japanese authorities have been cracking down on it.
      - jki275 6y ago
        That's true, of course. But the Yakuza are kind of an "honorable criminal" type. They don't foist their criminal actions on the general populace. It's a bit complicated, and doesn't make a lot of sense in the American paradigm. They're not like the Italian Mafia exactly.
    - smcl 6y ago
      What I meant was that if the system is only interested in pursuing cases where there's a very likely conviction at the end, there must be a large percentage of unsolved crimes even if the absolute amount is smaller than the USA/UK/Germany/$comparisonCountry.
jki275 6y ago
Their conviction rate is over 99% as I recall, and it's essentially all coerced confessions. Once they make an arrest, that person will be convicted. A Japanese prisoner has zero rights in Japan. A Gaijin has even less. Lived there for six years.
kyuudou 6y ago
You might want to hear what Yuta has to say about this[1]. It's not as black and white, basically. 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINAk2xl8Bc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINAk2xl8Bc

by smcl 6y ago

_jal 6y ago

The US Federal conviction rate is only a few percentage points lower. And as a US citizen, I can assure you it is not the first in our case.

ciarannolan 6y ago
No, it's actually not even close. [1] >In the United States federal court system, the conviction rate rose from approximately 75 percent to approximately 85% between 1972 and 1992.[13] For 2012, the US Department of Justice reported a 93% conviction rate.[14] In 2000, the conviction rate was also high in U.S. state courts. Coughlan, writing in 2000, stated, "In recent years, the conviction rate has averaged approximately 84% in Texas, 82% in California, 72% in New York, 67% in North Carolina, and 59% in Florida."[15] >In 2018, the Bureau of Justice Statistics reported that among defendants charged with a felony, 68% were convicted (59% of a felony and the remainder of a misdemeanor) with felony conviction rates highest for defendants originally charged with motor vehicle theft (74%), driving-related offenses (73%), murder (70%), burglary (69%), and drug trafficking (67%); and lowest for defendants originally charged with assault (45%).[16] Compare this to: > The criminal justice system of Japan has been referred to as a form of "hostage justice" (hitojichi-shiho), including in an appeal by 1010 Japanese professors, lawyers, and other legal professionals.[8] Collin Jones, a professor at Doshisha Law School in Kyoto, notes that the system has a conviction rate commonly described as 99.9%, but that the rate is, in fact, closer to 99.4%.[9][10][verification needed] Jones agrees with the group of legal professionals petitioning for change that practices such as interrogating suspects without counsel or charge for up to 23 days, not requiring the disclosure of exculpatory evidence, or of relationships between prosecutors and the courts increases the likelihood of convictions;[9][8] these professionals are unequivocal in their belief in the issue continues despite reforms, and that the system contributes to wrongful conviction: [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conviction_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conviction_rate

pnw_hazor 6y ago

The Japanese police are really good at coercing confessions using techniques and procedures that are unavailable (unlawful) in most first world countries.

amyjess 6y ago

There's also: - the police use highly unethical interrogation methods to extract confessions TBH, it's probably a combination of all four factors.

smcl 6y ago
Maybe I should have been less careful with my last option - I wanted to put “The system finds a culprit and makes them guilty” but felt it was a bit accusatory.
- jki275 6y ago
  It's exactly correct.

pyuser583 6y ago

It’s number two.

smcl 6y ago
Ahh I imagine that means a lot of crimes go unsolved then?
- jki275 6y ago
  There isn't really a lot of crime in Japan. It's culturally very shameful to be a criminal or to have a criminal in the family in Japan, and the entire culture is based on maintaining the family honor.
  - NotSammyHagar 6y ago
    Yet the Yakuza and underworld exists and operate in some manner.
    - pyuser583 6y ago
      Yakuza is legal in Japan. Not sure what you mean by “underworld” in the Japanese context. Edit: my info about yakuza being legal is outdated. Japanese authorities have been cracking down on it.
    - jki275 6y ago
      That's true, of course. But the Yakuza are kind of an "honorable criminal" type. They don't foist their criminal actions on the general populace. It's a bit complicated, and doesn't make a lot of sense in the American paradigm. They're not like the Italian Mafia exactly.
  - smcl 6y ago
    What I meant was that if the system is only interested in pursuing cases where there's a very likely conviction at the end, there must be a large percentage of unsolved crimes even if the absolute amount is smaller than the USA/UK/Germany/$comparisonCountry.

jki275 6y ago

Their conviction rate is over 99% as I recall, and it's essentially all coerced confessions. Once they make an arrest, that person will be convicted. A Japanese prisoner has zero rights in Japan. A Gaijin has even less. Lived there for six years.

kyuudou 6y ago

You might want to hear what Yuta has to say about this[1]. It's not as black and white, basically. 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINAk2xl8Bc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINAk2xl8Bc