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Used to do a bit back in the day, every time I got out my Black and Decker 18v drill I'd get a few mocking comments that it wasn't a "proper" tool. Kept my mout

Used to do a bit back in the day, every time I got out my Black and Decker 18v drill I'd get a few mocking comments that it wasn't a "proper" tool. Kept my mouth shut about it being a rebranded DeWalt for half the price. They didn't deserve the tip. Makita was always the highest regarded - assumed they were still a group-brand though, interesting to see them and Hilti are basically their own companies.

dbatten 6y ago
How did you discover it was actually a rebranded DeWalt (as opposed to a drill manufactured to less demanding specs by a company that also happens to own the DeWalt brand)? I own a good number of power tools, mostly DeWalt, though I usually check Consumer Reports and other reviews and have bought from other companies when the DeWalt option didn't look like it was holding up well. If I could verify that a homeowner-oriented brand (as opposed to a tradesman-oriented brand) like Black and Decker was literally just re-skinning a higher-end tool and selling it for less, I'd happily take the cost savings, though.
- wastedhours 6y ago
  Don't have any strong evidence to back up my claim unfortunately. We compared it visually, looked identical, specs sounded identical, and it put up with the same abuse over an extended period of time (I'm still, 10 years later, picking bits of concrete out of its air holes). I'll backtrack then and say "it's as good as the offering from their much more expensive stable mate, to the extent my daily use with it was exactly the same". Their QA might be lower then, so not sure whether it's a glowing recommendation of all their units, or just I won the drill-lottery. Will caveat and say this wasn't a bog-standard entry level drill - it was pretty much B&D's top of the line from their offering at the time.
Grazester 6y ago
When I was a teen back in the 90s working on my dad's boat I discovered this.Started looking at Black and Decker differently as a result.
- mywacaday 6y ago
  I used to tease a colleague that his Lexus was really a re-badged Toyota. There must be some difference between B&D and De Walt, tradespeople wouldn't take long to figure out they could save s few bucks and get the same quality from B&D
  - wastedhours 6y ago
    I don't doubt there is on some, or even most of their ranges. But you'd be surprised as to how much brand loyalty and brand prestige plays out with some tradespeople. Especially if you're starting out with your own firm, having to interact with other types of trades regularly you want to have the look of a pro. B&D doesn't inspire confidence to those in the know as much as Makita or DeWalt.
    - droopyEyelids 6y ago
      Your comment is hurting me the same way it hurts to read people say wearing a bike helmet is more dangerous because cyclists will feel invulnerable and take risks. It's like, people can invent a reason for anything, and either convince themselves their reason is the higher probability cause, or disregard probability entirely. Honestly, what do you think is more probable: That professionals throw away thousands of dollars buying conspicuous tools every year, or that equipment used in high impact, mechanically challenging situations for 8 hours a day is designed to a different standard than equipment for homeowners who might use it a couple times a month? My mind rebels so hard against internalizing how people make up so much illogical stuff to suite their preconceptions. I don't want to learn the lesson, but everywhere I look I'm being taught it over and over again.
      - wastedhours 6y ago
        I've been there on-site and seen it play out. This isn't me being an armchair enthusiast sat with my DIY kit judging the pros. I've talked to them, used their kit, they've used mine, consistently, on real, fully-paying jobs. > That professionals throw away thousands of dollars buying conspicuous tools every year That's exactly what I'm saying in my experience with general construction tradesmen. Now, the argument isn't that a crappy little 9v drill from Amazon will work the same as a proper engineered brand for specialised equipment, but that I have actual real-world experience of a whole number of pros who have explicitly told me they buy light, named gear for visual purposes more than it being better than some homebrand kit for their needs. We're talking drills, mixers, planes, sanders etc...
luma 6y ago
SBD and TTI each have various tiers of tool offerings, and while they may share outward physical design aspects, they are pretty clearly stratified when it comes to the parts inside. Using B&D vs DeWalt as the example here, you'll typically find the following on the DeWalt part over something that might look very similar from B&D: * Better quality housing materials (better grade plastics, more glass fiber reinforcement, etc) * Better motor (higher power, more efficient) * Upgraded electronics (soft-start, closed-loop speed control, etc) * Higher quality metal bits (better/more expensive designs, better quality materials, better machining) Whether or not these differences are worth the cost delta for each tool and for each tool user is up to the user. Check through some tool teardowns and you'll see what's happening here. Typically it's not the exact same tool from the same factory line with a new label.
- rpcope1 6y ago
  Not only this, but I've always found that for Milwaukee and DeWalt, there's a significantly higher chance that there's parts and information available for repair and overhaul of the tools, especially after the model stops selling, compared to many cheaper "consumer" lines or the kind of stuff that comes from Harbor Freight.

dbatten 6y ago

How did you discover it was actually a rebranded DeWalt (as opposed to a drill manufactured to less demanding specs by a company that also happens to own the DeWalt brand)? I own a good number of power tools, mostly DeWalt, though I usually check Consumer Reports and other reviews and have bought from other companies when the DeWalt option didn't look like it was holding up well. If I could verify that a homeowner-oriented brand (as opposed to a tradesman-oriented brand) like Black and Decker was literally just re-skinning a higher-end tool and selling it for less, I'd happily take the cost savings, though.

wastedhours 6y ago
Don't have any strong evidence to back up my claim unfortunately. We compared it visually, looked identical, specs sounded identical, and it put up with the same abuse over an extended period of time (I'm still, 10 years later, picking bits of concrete out of its air holes). I'll backtrack then and say "it's as good as the offering from their much more expensive stable mate, to the extent my daily use with it was exactly the same". Their QA might be lower then, so not sure whether it's a glowing recommendation of all their units, or just I won the drill-lottery. Will caveat and say this wasn't a bog-standard entry level drill - it was pretty much B&D's top of the line from their offering at the time.

Grazester 6y ago

When I was a teen back in the 90s working on my dad's boat I discovered this.Started looking at Black and Decker differently as a result.

mywacaday 6y ago
I used to tease a colleague that his Lexus was really a re-badged Toyota. There must be some difference between B&D and De Walt, tradespeople wouldn't take long to figure out they could save s few bucks and get the same quality from B&D
- wastedhours 6y ago
  I don't doubt there is on some, or even most of their ranges. But you'd be surprised as to how much brand loyalty and brand prestige plays out with some tradespeople. Especially if you're starting out with your own firm, having to interact with other types of trades regularly you want to have the look of a pro. B&D doesn't inspire confidence to those in the know as much as Makita or DeWalt.
  - droopyEyelids 6y ago
    Your comment is hurting me the same way it hurts to read people say wearing a bike helmet is more dangerous because cyclists will feel invulnerable and take risks. It's like, people can invent a reason for anything, and either convince themselves their reason is the higher probability cause, or disregard probability entirely. Honestly, what do you think is more probable: That professionals throw away thousands of dollars buying conspicuous tools every year, or that equipment used in high impact, mechanically challenging situations for 8 hours a day is designed to a different standard than equipment for homeowners who might use it a couple times a month? My mind rebels so hard against internalizing how people make up so much illogical stuff to suite their preconceptions. I don't want to learn the lesson, but everywhere I look I'm being taught it over and over again.
    - wastedhours 6y ago
      I've been there on-site and seen it play out. This isn't me being an armchair enthusiast sat with my DIY kit judging the pros. I've talked to them, used their kit, they've used mine, consistently, on real, fully-paying jobs. > That professionals throw away thousands of dollars buying conspicuous tools every year That's exactly what I'm saying in my experience with general construction tradesmen. Now, the argument isn't that a crappy little 9v drill from Amazon will work the same as a proper engineered brand for specialised equipment, but that I have actual real-world experience of a whole number of pros who have explicitly told me they buy light, named gear for visual purposes more than it being better than some homebrand kit for their needs. We're talking drills, mixers, planes, sanders etc...

luma 6y ago

SBD and TTI each have various tiers of tool offerings, and while they may share outward physical design aspects, they are pretty clearly stratified when it comes to the parts inside. Using B&D vs DeWalt as the example here, you'll typically find the following on the DeWalt part over something that might look very similar from B&D: * Better quality housing materials (better grade plastics, more glass fiber reinforcement, etc) * Better motor (higher power, more efficient) * Upgraded electronics (soft-start, closed-loop speed control, etc) * Higher quality metal bits (better/more expensive designs, better quality materials, better machining) Whether or not these differences are worth the cost delta for each tool and for each tool user is up to the user. Check through some tool teardowns and you'll see what's happening here. Typically it's not the exact same tool from the same factory line with a new label.

rpcope1 6y ago
Not only this, but I've always found that for Milwaukee and DeWalt, there's a significantly higher chance that there's parts and information available for repair and overhaul of the tools, especially after the model stops selling, compared to many cheaper "consumer" lines or the kind of stuff that comes from Harbor Freight.