5 ms·

Interesting and good to know, but how do I use this information when buying tools?

AngryData 6y ago
If you find a tool you like, check the offerings of the sub-brands from the same group. The mechanical difference between them might be little to none, while the price between them may vary wildly. Unfortunately you aren't going to be allowed to take them apart before purchase so its still hard to compare the internals, but you can check reviews and comparisons of those products.
- agumonkey 6y ago
  Some youtubers do just that (almost) and it is interesting. dewaldt vs Harbor freight etc
  - emsign 6y ago
    AvE comes to mind, very informative. Although I don't like his dad jokes and sexist phrases at all, they got old and annoying really quick. Sadly useful information to bad joke ratio is about 1:3 in his videos.
    - jcims 6y ago
      He doesn't do teardowns but Project Farm is my new favorite product tester/review channel. I enjoy me some AvE but this is the polar opposite experience - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2rzsm1Qi6N1X-wuOg_p0Ng https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2rzsm1Qi6N1X-wuOg_p0Ng
      - agumonkey 6y ago
        Yeah, the man churns through equipment and tests at a rare pace. So much I'm concerned for his sanity sometimes. So clear, so to the point.. pure service. One great channel is the aptly named "Tool teardown": - he even compares Harbor Freight entry level variants https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1keZFiKQhPc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1keZFiKQhPc - and the HF high grade vs dewaldt https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK3wsTsauq0&t=441s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK3wsTsauq0&t=441s
    - throwanem 6y ago
      Still a better ratio than any of my actual uncles, by a couple orders of magnitude in most cases. Besides, there's nothing that's not funny about seeing a half-in-the-bag jackass put a hacksaw through an 18650 and then be surprised when it shits the bed.
- riversflow 6y ago
  I mean, my intuition from owning a shop and buying a fair number of tools (and researching them) for heavy use is reinforced by this chart. The best tools are made by the corporations with the least siblings and the most specialization. As someone who had a fleet of power tools for an industrial operation, I prefer Makita over dewalt, for example. A number of more niche "best in class brands" weren't even on this list, for example Fein grinders are what machinists buy, Boeing uses Hutchins air tools, and most Arborists I've met reach for a stihl. Fascinating regardless
bruce_one 6y ago
The useful thing I've found from this is that "AEG" in Australia is the same as "RIDGID" (orange) in the US and the batteries are compatible. So I've been able to buy tools that are not available as AEG tools in Australia (ie they're not offered in the product range here). I purchased them skin only to avoid any charger incompatibilities (and use the AEG batteries and charges with the RIDGID tools). It might work in reverse that buying AEG from Australia is now a cheaper way to get RIDGID tools because the Australian dollar is quite weak compared to the US dollar.
rfreiberger 6y ago
Personally I use this in terms of trickle-down technology. If a feature appears on a Milwaukee, it will shortly appear on A Ridgid or Ryobi soon. This was the case for hydraulic impact drivers, that first came out on the Ridgid then Ryobi and Milwaukee soon after. But it's really about the entire tool family and how much does it fit you. Since you're not buying a single tool but more about buying the battery format. So if you need garden tools maybe down the line, check out a tool lineup that offers this, even if it's a remote possibility. All of the tools IMHO are well built and I doubt there's a huge gap in performance.
- exhilaration 6y ago
  Wait, you're saying that Ridgid, Ryobi and Milwaukee can share batteries and chargers?
  - fragmede 6y ago
    Not sure why you're downvoted, but perhaps apropos for the maker/hardware hacker-inclined, the packs I've seen are just 18650 cells (same as used en-mass on original Teslas) inside of a 3D-(re)printable plastic shell, and some hackable electronics. #righttorepair
- throwanem 6y ago
  There's a pretty huge gap in durability. I had a Ryobi starter-set drill blow out its MOSFET midway through taking an Ikea bed apart. The starter-set Milwaukee M12 I replaced it with is considerably better built, notably in having a much higher-rated flyback diode and better heat sinking. As a bonus, it has a sprag clutch behind the chuck, which makes it a lot nicer to use. That said, I'd still point at Ryobi as a good place to start, or to move up from an Ikea toy or whatever. They're fine for occasional, light-duty kind of use, and they have a wide range of cheap 'n cheerful stuff that'll take the 18v One+ batteries - the drill might be dead (until I get around to resurrecting it), but I'm still getting good service out of its batteries in the $100 weed eater I use a couple times a year. (Also, that $50 Ryobi starter drill, plus a cheap rotary scrubber head off Amazon, makes a great tool for getting rid of stubborn mildew. That's the other thing I like about them: they're cheap enough that you can try dumb shit and not be too upset if it blows up on you, or not really mind running it to death if it doesn't.)
wastedhours 6y ago
As other commenters have said - look for very similar specs between the more halo brands and the lower end stuff. Like a lot of things, it's possibly the same thing in a different suit, or only slightly detuned. You can save a pretty penny.
tinco 6y ago
All of these manufacturers make awesome tools, despite what many people claim, all of the hand tools are better than they were 20 years ago. There's a couple things you need to realize: most of them are fighting to have a good name, which means they'll do their utmost to squeeze value out of every cent they spend manufacturing a device. If you buy a $80 Makita drill, it's going to be just as good as a $80 DeWalt drill, or a Bosch or Metabo one. It's more about whether you like the colour scheme, the feel of it, maybe some feature tradeoffs. Want a better drill? Simply spend more. Yes, Hilti and Festool exclusively make $200 drills, and they're worth it to the professionals. But the $150 Makita/DeWalt/Milwaukee/etc drills are also better than the $80 drills those same manufacturers make. More money means more value. You think a carpenter would spend extra to get a $150 Makita instead of a $80 one if it wasn't worth it? Those brands would be nowhere if they couldn't get the pro's to use their tools. Looking purely at the brand can bite you in the ass. You might lift your nose at modern B&D, Ryobi or Bosch Green, because they only sell cheap tools, but then you'd miss the fact that DeWalt sells crap as well, they just don't switch the color schemes. Bosch has the same brand, but two colorschemes (green being the cheap ones). Makita sometimes sells batches of cheap powertools in big box stores that are bad and seems to be magically missing from their global marketing. Before buying a powertool, go to the store and grab it. Feel the weight of it, rub the plastic, scratch it with your finger nails, shake it hard to feel its sturdiness. Turn it on and notice the power, and the control. Go on youtube and see what the pro's use. Lots of pro's don't have any sponsorships, and even if they are sponsored, they wouldn't use the sponsored tools if they couldn't accomplish the work at the level they need to entertain their audience. Personally, I've got a mix of brands and qualities. When I started out everything I had was shit tier, and any time something either broke or annoyed me with its crappiness I replaced it with a better one. If you've got the money, you could skip that step and just buy good tier everything (just don't buy the DeWalt combo deals, they're a scam) and upgrade to S-tier when you start noticing some things that could be better. (about old tools: the old tools that are better are all the things that get better when they're heavier. That's decidedly not hand held power tools)

If you find a tool you like, check the offerings of the sub-brands from the same group. The mechanical difference between them might be little to none, while the price between them may vary wildly. Unfortunately you aren't going to be allowed to take them apart before purchase so its still hard to compare the internals, but you can check reviews and comparisons of those products.

agumonkey 6y ago
Some youtubers do just that (almost) and it is interesting. dewaldt vs Harbor freight etc
- emsign 6y ago
  AvE comes to mind, very informative. Although I don't like his dad jokes and sexist phrases at all, they got old and annoying really quick. Sadly useful information to bad joke ratio is about 1:3 in his videos.
  - jcims 6y ago
    He doesn't do teardowns but Project Farm is my new favorite product tester/review channel. I enjoy me some AvE but this is the polar opposite experience - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2rzsm1Qi6N1X-wuOg_p0Ng https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2rzsm1Qi6N1X-wuOg_p0Ng
    - agumonkey 6y ago
      Yeah, the man churns through equipment and tests at a rare pace. So much I'm concerned for his sanity sometimes. So clear, so to the point.. pure service. One great channel is the aptly named "Tool teardown": - he even compares Harbor Freight entry level variants https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1keZFiKQhPc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1keZFiKQhPc - and the HF high grade vs dewaldt https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK3wsTsauq0&t=441s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK3wsTsauq0&t=441s
  - throwanem 6y ago
    Still a better ratio than any of my actual uncles, by a couple orders of magnitude in most cases. Besides, there's nothing that's not funny about seeing a half-in-the-bag jackass put a hacksaw through an 18650 and then be surprised when it shits the bed.
riversflow 6y ago
I mean, my intuition from owning a shop and buying a fair number of tools (and researching them) for heavy use is reinforced by this chart. The best tools are made by the corporations with the least siblings and the most specialization. As someone who had a fleet of power tools for an industrial operation, I prefer Makita over dewalt, for example. A number of more niche "best in class brands" weren't even on this list, for example Fein grinders are what machinists buy, Boeing uses Hutchins air tools, and most Arborists I've met reach for a stihl. Fascinating regardless

bruce_one 6y ago

The useful thing I've found from this is that "AEG" in Australia is the same as "RIDGID" (orange) in the US and the batteries are compatible. So I've been able to buy tools that are not available as AEG tools in Australia (ie they're not offered in the product range here). I purchased them skin only to avoid any charger incompatibilities (and use the AEG batteries and charges with the RIDGID tools). It might work in reverse that buying AEG from Australia is now a cheaper way to get RIDGID tools because the Australian dollar is quite weak compared to the US dollar.

rfreiberger 6y ago

Personally I use this in terms of trickle-down technology. If a feature appears on a Milwaukee, it will shortly appear on A Ridgid or Ryobi soon. This was the case for hydraulic impact drivers, that first came out on the Ridgid then Ryobi and Milwaukee soon after. But it's really about the entire tool family and how much does it fit you. Since you're not buying a single tool but more about buying the battery format. So if you need garden tools maybe down the line, check out a tool lineup that offers this, even if it's a remote possibility. All of the tools IMHO are well built and I doubt there's a huge gap in performance.

exhilaration 6y ago
Wait, you're saying that Ridgid, Ryobi and Milwaukee can share batteries and chargers?
- fragmede 6y ago
  Not sure why you're downvoted, but perhaps apropos for the maker/hardware hacker-inclined, the packs I've seen are just 18650 cells (same as used en-mass on original Teslas) inside of a 3D-(re)printable plastic shell, and some hackable electronics. #righttorepair
throwanem 6y ago
There's a pretty huge gap in durability. I had a Ryobi starter-set drill blow out its MOSFET midway through taking an Ikea bed apart. The starter-set Milwaukee M12 I replaced it with is considerably better built, notably in having a much higher-rated flyback diode and better heat sinking. As a bonus, it has a sprag clutch behind the chuck, which makes it a lot nicer to use. That said, I'd still point at Ryobi as a good place to start, or to move up from an Ikea toy or whatever. They're fine for occasional, light-duty kind of use, and they have a wide range of cheap 'n cheerful stuff that'll take the 18v One+ batteries - the drill might be dead (until I get around to resurrecting it), but I'm still getting good service out of its batteries in the $100 weed eater I use a couple times a year. (Also, that $50 Ryobi starter drill, plus a cheap rotary scrubber head off Amazon, makes a great tool for getting rid of stubborn mildew. That's the other thing I like about them: they're cheap enough that you can try dumb shit and not be too upset if it blows up on you, or not really mind running it to death if it doesn't.)

wastedhours 6y ago

As other commenters have said - look for very similar specs between the more halo brands and the lower end stuff. Like a lot of things, it's possibly the same thing in a different suit, or only slightly detuned. You can save a pretty penny.

tinco 6y ago

All of these manufacturers make awesome tools, despite what many people claim, all of the hand tools are better than they were 20 years ago. There's a couple things you need to realize: most of them are fighting to have a good name, which means they'll do their utmost to squeeze value out of every cent they spend manufacturing a device. If you buy a $80 Makita drill, it's going to be just as good as a $80 DeWalt drill, or a Bosch or Metabo one. It's more about whether you like the colour scheme, the feel of it, maybe some feature tradeoffs. Want a better drill? Simply spend more. Yes, Hilti and Festool exclusively make $200 drills, and they're worth it to the professionals. But the $150 Makita/DeWalt/Milwaukee/etc drills are also better than the $80 drills those same manufacturers make. More money means more value. You think a carpenter would spend extra to get a $150 Makita instead of a $80 one if it wasn't worth it? Those brands would be nowhere if they couldn't get the pro's to use their tools. Looking purely at the brand can bite you in the ass. You might lift your nose at modern B&D, Ryobi or Bosch Green, because they only sell cheap tools, but then you'd miss the fact that DeWalt sells crap as well, they just don't switch the color schemes. Bosch has the same brand, but two colorschemes (green being the cheap ones). Makita sometimes sells batches of cheap powertools in big box stores that are bad and seems to be magically missing from their global marketing. Before buying a powertool, go to the store and grab it. Feel the weight of it, rub the plastic, scratch it with your finger nails, shake it hard to feel its sturdiness. Turn it on and notice the power, and the control. Go on youtube and see what the pro's use. Lots of pro's don't have any sponsorships, and even if they are sponsored, they wouldn't use the sponsored tools if they couldn't accomplish the work at the level they need to entertain their audience. Personally, I've got a mix of brands and qualities. When I started out everything I had was shit tier, and any time something either broke or annoyed me with its crappiness I replaced it with a better one. If you've got the money, you could skip that step and just buy good tier everything (just don't buy the DeWalt combo deals, they're a scam) and upgrade to S-tier when you start noticing some things that could be better. (about old tools: the old tools that are better are all the things that get better when they're heavier. That's decidedly not hand held power tools)