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Impact of Android 10 on Termux usability is already old news. What worries me more is behaviour of Termux developers. They make dubious claims and effectively

Impact of Android 10 on Termux usability is already old news. What worries me more is behaviour of Termux developers. They make dubious claims and effectively sabotage their own application (more on that below). The solution to Android 10 problems — a software wrapper called "proot" [1] — has already been found. That solution would allow to keep all of Termux functionality and preserve existing package managers (such as apt). Proot allows Android user to compile C code in Termux (which they currently can do) and does not require major changes to Termux itself. Termux developers refused to adopt proot as solution and even removed it's mention from their wiki on Github. Instead they are insisting that all Termux packages should be distributed in Android apk files, published on Google Play. That "solution" has major usability issues, does not scale (it uses shoddy Android PackageManager to track all Termux packages) and would prevent users from using Gcc and other compilers in Termux. The only claimed upside of using apk files is that it would better comply with Google's policies. Termux developers justify their actions by following arguments: 1. Termux packages require a lot of bandwidth to host, and Termux does not have money to pay for their mirrors; hosting packages in Google Play would be preferable. That statement is nonsense — even fringe Linux distributions like Artix can find FREE mirrors, willing to host their packages. This is usually done by contacting curators of existing servers, that host Linux packages, and asking them for support. Termux is more popular than some of Linux distributions, but it does not look like Termux devs even TRY to do that — they apparently just sit on their hands, occasionally begging their sole mirror provider (JFrog) for more bandwidth. 2. Termux currently does not comply with Google's policy and it's developers are afraid, that this will result in removal from Google Play. They are technically right, but they are making mistake by downgrading experience of their app in attempt to pacify Google Play censors. They are making even bigger mistake by displaying guilt about that — Termux does nothing wrong, and the display of guilt is a better excuse to punish them than their actions. 1: despite it's name, proot does not require root access

teruakohatu 6y ago
I guess it needs to be forked.
madushan1000 6y ago
Yeah, their decision baffles me too. I'm pretty sure the average termux user is willing to install f-droid if play store decides to remove termux. They shouldn't compromise usability to appease google overloads. Do you know of any documentation on how to use proot to get around this restriction?
AshamedCaptain 6y ago
There are _already_ several "Linux-like environments" on Android that use proot. GNUroot, UserLAnd, Linux Deploy, AnLinux, Androlinux, etc. Some of them _literally_ just package existing Linux distros such as Debian (e.g. GNUroot) in a way thatis much more compatible and easier to mantain than something ad-hoc such as Termux. Termux became popular _precisely_ because they did NOT use proot. Proot is great in theory -- using ptrace and hooks in order to simulate a more Linux-like environment, ala Cygwin. In practice, it is just goddamn slow, and ptrace just introduce MORE compatibility issues than the native Android does. Termux had a shitton of disadvantages compared to the proot-based distributions, such as for example the fact that every package had to be patched in order to use the non-standard Android directory structure, making compatibility with native Linux binaries utright difficult (not even ld is where it should be) and reusing Linux distro scripts impossible. But _still_ it became the most popular because proot is just worse. No wonder they completely ignore all requests to use proot. If you want to use proot, there is no point at all for Termux to exist (or at least, for Termux the distro; the terminal emulator itself may still be interesting, your mileage may vary). There's little point remaining for patching packages for Termux; you can use Debian packages, so just go and use Debian. And to to top it off, what if a future Android breaks proot, which looks likely?

teruakohatu 6y ago

I guess it needs to be forked.

madushan1000 6y ago

Yeah, their decision baffles me too. I'm pretty sure the average termux user is willing to install f-droid if play store decides to remove termux. They shouldn't compromise usability to appease google overloads. Do you know of any documentation on how to use proot to get around this restriction?

AshamedCaptain 6y ago

There are _already_ several "Linux-like environments" on Android that use proot. GNUroot, UserLAnd, Linux Deploy, AnLinux, Androlinux, etc. Some of them _literally_ just package existing Linux distros such as Debian (e.g. GNUroot) in a way thatis much more compatible and easier to mantain than something ad-hoc such as Termux. Termux became popular _precisely_ because they did NOT use proot. Proot is great in theory -- using ptrace and hooks in order to simulate a more Linux-like environment, ala Cygwin. In practice, it is just goddamn slow, and ptrace just introduce MORE compatibility issues than the native Android does. Termux had a shitton of disadvantages compared to the proot-based distributions, such as for example the fact that every package had to be patched in order to use the non-standard Android directory structure, making compatibility with native Linux binaries utright difficult (not even ld is where it should be) and reusing Linux distro scripts impossible. But _still_ it became the most popular because proot is just worse. No wonder they completely ignore all requests to use proot. If you want to use proot, there is no point at all for Termux to exist (or at least, for Termux the distro; the terminal emulator itself may still be interesting, your mileage may vary). There's little point remaining for patching packages for Termux; you can use Debian packages, so just go and use Debian. And to to top it off, what if a future Android breaks proot, which looks likely?